Forums of the Megaverse®

Okay, this thought just popped into my head. I don't know if it's been thought of before or not but it's a new idea to me. What if the Army of the Southern Cross was just one army out of several? I don't mean different branches like Army, Navy, Marines. I mean separate armies that are a part of the whole army. First Army, Second Army, Third Army and so on, with Leonard being a Field Marshal for a specific army: _____ Army: The Army of the Southern Cross. And that name eventually ends up being a nickname for all of the UEG forces on Earth. It would explain why, under old canon at least, the REF had the same uniforms, mecha, and ships as the ASC. They were the same army, not different branches. It'd also explain why Leonard complained about the REF taking everything. If they were separate he could have stopped them like the US Air Force stopping the US Army from obtaining A-10 Warthogs. "Their ours! You can't have them!" If the REF was a part of the same army as the ASC, they wouldn't need special permission to use their own equipment. They'd already have it. It could also help explain why the ASC doesn't have the same mecha the REF has. They're reservists. They don't get the newest toys. And then after the REF Civil War, they change uniforms to get away from the old and start fresh

Anyway, that was my thought. Thanks for reading.

The Armies of the Southern Cross are a large global force active in all corners of the Earth as well as space.

The cap on their size is more or less based on how many humans and zentraedi you think are left.




The ASC aren't the reservists, they are the force protecting Earth and the solar system while the UEEF goes off to deep space.

Isn't that like saying the Army is the Army? Armies, Divisions, Battalions, Companies and such can have their own names. Why couldn't the ASC be one specific army and the collective nickname for all the UEG forces on Earth? I can see the remaining defenders adopting that name, especially when Leonard built them back up from what was leftover from the REF's mission. Maybe even making it official later on. Otherwise, why would the REF have the same uniforms, mecha, and ships? If they're complete separate, they'd have different things.

I didn't mention size but that could mean as many or as few "Armies" as needed.

Not exactly, no, but they weren't out on the frontlines either. At least not until the frontlines came to them. And if the frontline troops get the most and best equipment, there wouldn't be a lot left on Earth. Hence Leonard's complaining about it. And possibly why they were upgrading 20 year old mecha designs.

If that was the case, what makes you think Leonard could have stopped the UEEF/REF from draining stockpiles? Somone somewhere in the UEG decided what went where in terms of resource allocation. Leondard wasn't the DeFacto head of the government, in the animation there is some civilian oversight that he answers to (Prime Minister Moran).

It might work out that just after the RoD that the AotSC was one of many mercenary groups. But it could be that by the time of the launching of the SDF3 there was .....Corporate Mergers that made it the only one.

ShadowLogan wrote: ↑Sat Sep 30, 2023 11:06 am If that was the case, what makes you think Leonard could have stopped the UEEF/REF from draining stockpiles? Somone somewhere in the UEG decided what went where in terms of resource allocation. Leondard wasn't the DeFacto head of the government, in the animation there is some civilian oversight that he answers to (Prime Minister Moran).

It's more difficult to requisition something from a separate branch than from your own. It would also take more than a someone somewhere to have things transferred. It would either an act of congress ratified by the Prime Minister to to overrule the head of that branch or the Prime Minister removing them from their position. Leonard wasn't removed. I fact Moran and Leonard seem to be buddies so Moran would favor Leonard in any decision. Also, if the ASC started off as independent, and even traded blows with the RDF they're not going to join UEG without certain safeguards in place. Like being completely autonomous. As in "You can't touch us." Otherwise the RDF could have drained him into oblivion long before the REF launched. Insead they were sharingresources. And then there's the question of the REF adopting ASC uniforms. Why would they do that? It'd be like the US Navy adopting US Army uniforms.

I think it'd make more sense if they were all a part of the same military. They could still come to blows. A Company fighting B Company until someone higher up the chain stops it. But if someone higher up the chain than Leonard wants something he couldn't stop them from getting it. In this case Lang said, "This goes" and it went with Leonard grumbling about it.

Sambot wrote:It's more difficult to requisition something from a separate branch than from your own.

To an extent, but I am thinking more from the POV of production contracts and similar where it goes right after production as opposed to after the fact as you seem to be. Or put another way, there is bound to be some limits on production capacity which means who do you give priority to the "overseas" units or "homefront" units during a buildup?

I do think the ASC and EF are part of the same military organization, which would explain a variety of things you bring up. However, Leonard may not have been the "head" of said the overall organization when the EF departs or during its buildup. He might not even be the head of the overall organization in 2029 but is just a "theatre" commander. Which seems to be the implication I get from the Sentinels conference scene and in the series proper (he apparently could not just order the EF to return).

ShadowLogan wrote: ↑Sun Oct 01, 2023 4:21 pm

Sambot wrote:It's more difficult to requisition something from a separate branch than from your own.

To an extent, but I am thinking more from the POV of production contracts and similar where it goes right after production as opposed to after the fact as you seem to be. Or put another way, there is bound to be some limits on production capacity which means who do you give priority to the "overseas" units or "homefront" units during a buildup?

I do think the ASC and EF are part of the same military organization, which would explain a variety of things you bring up. However, Leonard may not have been the "head" of said the overall organization when the EF departs or during its buildup. He might not even be the head of the overall organization in 2029 but is just a "theatre" commander. Which seems to be the implication I get from the Sentinels conference scene and in the series proper (he apparently could not just order the EF to return).

Of course and those on the homefront will grumble that those overseas are getting all the production.

That's what I was referring to. Leonard is the commander of A Army, not The Army. At least, not until later. Then later on all the defenders adopt ASC as a nick name unless Leonard's Army was the only one left.

I think you're using the term 'Army' incorrectly, as in Field Army. What I think you mean is Combatant Command. The REF is a Combatant Command and sure as drek NOT a service branch (seriously, where would the SecEXFOR even reside?). The Army of the Southern Cross probably was once a Combatant Command under the previous UEG before the government and military were reorganized in the years following The Zentraedi Holocaust. By the time of the Second Robotech War, the "ASC" is basically synonymous with the United Earth Defense Force. A clue to the fact the REF and ASC are 'the same military' is Scott's dialogue in The Fortress:

SCOTT: That's an old outpost of our Mountain Offense Squad from the war against the Robotech Masters.

'Our'. Not 'The ASC's'.