why are DC and Marvel even mentioned here?????

[say652]

As a palladium site devoted to palladiums Heroes Unlimited why are separate companies with their own games constantly referenced? I mean the Heroes Unlimited system offers so much stuff to work and create with(so does every other palladium world book) why are other peoples creations constantly referenced? I would love to see more original characters using Heroes Unlimited rules(even if a blatant ripoff which is fine as long as it has a different name and costume.)

[Nightmask]

Because people naturally reference what they know, building off of that and what they find enjoyable and entertaining. When someone needs to give an example they go with something others are likely to recognize, one can hardly expect people to pretend the rest of the world doesn't exist and only talk about just the microcosm of the Heroes Unlimited and Palladium game system.

[Stone Gargoyle]

People naturally think of Marvel and DC when they think of superheroes. It does get annoying when there is constant referencing with the attempt to convert characters, which is obviously against the policies of the boards.

[say652]

Agreed i would love to see somebodies H.U. character using H.U. rules but come on people stop trying to stat some one else's character. In the world of the blind the one eyed man is king.

[drewkitty ~..~]

Agrees with SG.

[Nightmask]

Agreed i would love to see somebodies H.U. character using H.U. rules but come on people stop trying to stat some one else's character. In the world of the blind the one eyed man is king.

Considering Marvel and DC alone have thousands of characters it's REALLY hard to create a character that doesn't look like something someone else already created years or decades ago. Swamp Thing and Man-Thing came out within months of each other from DC and Marvel purely as independent thoughts (perhaps inspired by a previous swamp creature character that came out well before then) and just about anyone who wants to use a shield and be a front-line combatant gets accused of trying to copy Captain America (who had to change from his original kite shield to his iconic disc due to copyright issues by the creators of The Shield, another patriotic super-hero who also had a kite shield).

It's just not really possible at this point to be completely independent, whatever you create someone can find a character that already exists even if you had no idea it did. Plus why even care if someone's character has things in common with a more popular character? Not like someone should play a character they hate because 'well at least it's not got anything in common with those heroes'.

[say652]

its fine to draw from or even straight up rip off another idea, but please change the costume change the name and deny where you stole from.

[Nightmask]

its fine to draw from or even straight up rip off another idea, but please change the costume change the name and deny where you stole from.

Really shouldn't call it stolen; inspired by, borrowed from, homage to and so on are better choices. Where do you think Palladium got its inspiration for the various power categories and abilities for Heroes Unlimited but from popular (and not so popular) super-hero comics?

[say652]

i dont think what happens in dc/marvel or what powers their characters have or dont have should matter here.

[Nightmask]

i dont think what happens in dc/marvel or what powers their characters have or dont have should matter here.

Then you need to discard your Heroes Unlimited book because much of what it contains is a product of what's been seen in some fashion in Marvel and DC comics. Improbable aiming skills? A good couple dozen marvel heroes and villains have those. Elasticity/malleability? Plenty of Marvel and DC characters are the source of that power. Regeneration? I'm sure I don't need to mention the poster child of THAT power. Do I need to list the likely inspiration for the nigh-indestructible shield and rope available to the Super-Soldier category?

Palladium may not allow direct references to characters from other companies particularly in ways that appear to be trying to convert them into Heroes Unlimited terms but the game couldn't exist without the various powers and iconic power categories that they draw inspiration for from Marvel and DC. They made this game possible (along with Champions, Gurps Supers, and all the other super-hero genre RPG around).

[Stone Gargoyle]

True, and the fact is that if the company that became DC comics had not put out the first superhero comics in 1938, the genre would not exist. You have to credit them with the creation of superhero comics, and even mention them to compare some things to now and again. But you don't have to make them the focus of your game just because the powers are based on things that were written in comics.

[NMI]

Agreed i would love to see somebodies H.U. character using H.U. rules but come on people stop trying to stat some one else's character. In the world of the blind the one eyed man is king.

Where is someone currently with a recent post trying to post a Marvel or DC character?

[say652]

Agreed i would love to see somebodies H.U. character using H.U. rules but come on people stop trying to stat some one else's character. In the world of the blind the one eyed man is king.

Where is someone currently with a recent post trying to post a Marvel or DC character?

Can anyone stat the, well you stopped that one quick.

[NMI]

Well perhaps, people like a specific character from the comics, regardless of brand and they dont know how to best "emulate" said person in THEIR games.

[say652]

i like this system it offers so much creativity.

[wyrmraker]

We have access to both the original Marvel system and HU2. I can honestly say that attempting a full conversion from one system to the other is destined to fail. As I am currently about to start a HU2 game, I have one guy who has been trying to convert one of his Marvel concept characters to HU2, and it took me a while to show him how such a conversion just wasn't feasible.

Granted, Marvel and DC both are the foundations for modern super-powered heroes. These companies are the definitive examples of the genre. But Heroes Unlimited is so dramatically different (and lower powered, to be honest) that a conversion tends to range from ridiculously difficult to outright impossible.

[Bill]

Just to be contrarian, I think it's because Palladium has failed to deliver their own signature characters in comic book series for the fans to emulate. Not that it would really stop folks from trying to make their favorite characters, but I think it would be better to redirect people than to tell them just to quit it.

[Nightmask]

Just to be contrarian, I think it's because Palladium has failed to deliver their own signature characters in comic book series for the fans to emulate. Not that it would really stop folks from trying to make their favorite characters, but I think it would be better to redirect people than to tell them just to quit it.

Well there are certainly plenty of good but struggling artists around who could do some excellent comics for Palladium, they just have to get around the advertising and sales problems (since Diamond is very anti-small press and slants things more and more in favor of marvel and dc).

[Sir Dellis]

Just to be contrarian, I think it's because Palladium has failed to deliver their own signature characters in comic book series for the fans to emulate. Not that it would really stop folks from trying to make their favorite characters, but I think it would be better to redirect people than to tell them just to quit it.

DC and Marvel had a few year headstart on the superhero gig over Palladium. In the 80s, when I started gaming, I played never played HU. I used a different point based superhero game that made it alot easier to replicate DC/Marvel characters.

IMO, HU2 is better for creating fresh new heroes, not based on the comics while other systems are best for replicating your Marvel characters that we all love.

[Tor]

Just to be contrarian, I think it's because Palladium has failed to deliver their own signature characters in comic book series for the fans to emulate.

Not sure what this means, we know there are lots of HU NPCS in the HU sourcebooks, you mean you want them to be put into comic adventure format to make them more endearing? Like that Lone Star comic which ran in the Rifter?

HU2 is better for creating fresh new heroes, not based on the comics while other systems are best for replicating your Marvel characters that we all love.

That may depend on the hero. Obviously official RPGs which give stats for them are going to be more designed to suppor their specific ideas, but a lot of chars could be done pretty easily in HU also.

That's ignoring the obvious tribute NPCs scattered in the sourcebooks.

[Bill]

Yes, I think they should get some adventure stories. Both the detailed NPCs and the characters that only appear in art. I think it would deepen fan interest in the HU universe and reduce the impulse to convert external characters. Obviously, it wouldn't totally eliminate the behavior; but I really make the existing universe more appealing.

[badges89]

Well in the campaign that im starting up in my group i have a british supersoldier, an alien smuggler with darkness control extraord pp, bend light, and body weapons, and a stage magician that is a magic user, and its all based during ww2 and in dealing nazi occultism

[Tor]

Hm well... someone could get writing some HU novels or comics based on the sourcebooks...

We should keep in mind there was the 'Justice Machine' sourcebook back in the 80s that was based on a comic series.

[gaby]

Well ther Ok,but I like the Global Guardians PBEM,it run from 1994 to 2006,it was a Great Source for info.
I think ther a Bulterverse wiki now,you can make your Superheroes and Supervillains ther.

[green.nova343]

Just to be contrarian, I think it's because Palladium has failed to deliver their own signature characters in comic book series for the fans to emulate. Not that it would really stop folks from trying to make their favorite characters, but I think it would be better to redirect people than to tell them just to quit it.

About the closest was Gustovich's Justice Machine, which actually had its own Palladium sourcebook. But that was decades ago, & unfortunately the license has long lapsed.

As a palladium site devoted to palladiums Heroes Unlimited why are separate companies with their own games constantly referenced? I mean the Heroes Unlimited system offers so much stuff to work and create with(so does every other palladium world book) why are other peoples creations constantly referenced? I would love to see more original characters using Heroes Unlimited rules(even if a blatant ripoff which is fine as long as it has a different name and costume.)

Ummm... for the same token that we think of LotR/Hobbit when it comes to fantasy, Star Trek/Star Wars/Dr. Who when it comes to sci-fi, etc. We want to pay tribute & homage to the classics that first sparked our interest in these genres, & Palladium gives us a game outlet to exploit ourselves.

But there's a big difference between being inspired by a source & blatently copying it. The first is OK, the second is discouraged.

[Mercdog]

I like doing conversions of Marvel characters as sort of a mental exercise, but never with the intent of using them in a game. But then, I do the same thing with just about anything that strikes my fancy when I get a little bored.

[Damian Magecraft]

As a palladium site devoted to palladiums Heroes Unlimited why are separate companies with their own games constantly referenced? I mean the Heroes Unlimited system offers so much stuff to work and create with(so does every other palladium world book) why are other peoples creations constantly referenced? I would love to see more original characters using Heroes Unlimited rules(even if a blatant ripoff which is fine as long as it has a different name and costume.)

why reference the Big 2 in comics?
because they are a point of commonality for any one playing in the genre.
It grants us a point of reference we can all understand when discussing certain Tropes common to the genre.

[Snake Eyes]

I like doing conversions of Marvel characters as sort of a mental exercise, but never with the intent of using them in a game. But then, I do the same thing with just about anything that strikes my fancy when I get a little bored.

Agreed, i've done a few, still do in fact.......there's a few that have converted somewhat evenly, others, not so much.

Also agree, none will ever be used in a game (don't ask)

[jaymz]

As a palladium site devoted to palladiums Heroes Unlimited why are separate companies with their own games constantly referenced? I mean the Heroes Unlimited system offers so much stuff to work and create with(so does every other palladium world book) why are other peoples creations constantly referenced? I would love to see more original characters using Heroes Unlimited rules(even if a blatant ripoff which is fine as long as it has a different name and costume.)

why reference the Big 2 in comics?
because they are a point of commonality for any one playing in the genre.
It grants us a point of reference we can all understand when discussing certain Tropes common to the genre.

Precisely

[say652]

Android X
alien android from a world without an atmosphere.
entire race possesses super abilities
invulneribility
flight:wingless
energy expulsion:laser
energy expulsion:ice

came up with this original concept after trolling this post.

Warning: User warned for violating Forum policy on NO CONVERSIONS. - NMI

[BookWyrm]

As a palladium site devoted to palladiums Heroes Unlimited why are separate companies with their own games constantly referenced? I mean the Heroes Unlimited system offers so much stuff to work and create with(so does every other palladium world book) why are other peoples creations constantly referenced? I would love to see more original characters using Heroes Unlimited rules(even if a blatant ripoff which is fine as long as it has a different name and costume.)

why reference the Big 2 in comics?
because they are a point of commonality for any one playing in the genre.
It grants us a point of reference we can all understand when discussing certain Tropes common to the genre.

Agreed.

[arthurfallz]

As a palladium site devoted to palladiums Heroes Unlimited why are separate companies with their own games constantly referenced? I mean the Heroes Unlimited system offers so much stuff to work and create with(so does every other palladium world book) why are other peoples creations constantly referenced? I would love to see more original characters using Heroes Unlimited rules(even if a blatant ripoff which is fine as long as it has a different name and costume.)

I'm looking to make up a main battle tank, something like a World War II german tank.
I'm looking to create a more subtle, less flashy wizard like Gandalf from The Lord of the Rings.
I'm looking to make a gadgets and detective sort liked Batman.

They're all common, cultural references. The thing is that two of them (Gandalf and Batman) are the IP of other businesses. So offering stats on them is of course forbidden. But to use them as references is just obvious: they are cultural refernces, and while some people love making their own heroes, villains and worlds, others want to emulate and copy. As long as they don't break forum rules doing it, what's the harm?

Perhaps if you framed you rhetoric more like "why are people constantly trying to convert Marvel and DC Heroes into Heores, rather than making original characters and posting them to build up interest / a database of examples". What Marvel and DC are doing will never be irrelevant for me, a comic book super hero enthusiast, but I've found that they rarely function well in their own resident games, never mind being converted to a system not meant for them (like Heroes Unlimited).

No disrespect intended. You seem like you like the Palladium product, but you can be zealous without being derogatory.