TW inventions or favorite spells to use?

[Zer0 Kay]

Here's some of my TW technology mods.

Shoulder launched Missile- Teleports warhead to target. No Guidance system or motor=lighter or can replace said components with more explosives=greater damage at equivalent weight of original missile. There should also be a minus to dodge since in the case of targets with early warning capabilities not 6th sense won't get a lock warning and also because there is no travel time.

Silenced Rounds- Especially usefull for Boomguns.

Chameleon-Why does everyone want to put invisibility as a mod it cancels as soon as you attack. Of course you could have both, invisibility so you can move and Chameleon for after you attack.

[Nekira Sudacne]

Here's some of my TW technology mods.

Shoulder launched Missile- Teleports warhead to target. No Guidance system or motor=lighter or can replace said components with more explosives=greater damage at equivalent weight of original missile.

then you need a lot of custom made missiles for more damage.

There should also be a minus to dodge since in the case of targets with early warning capabilities not 6th sense won't get a lock warning and also because there is no travel time.

read again. sixth sense warns 1 minute BEFORE it happens

travel time is irrelevant.

Silenced Rounds- Especially usefull for Boomguns.

except that the rounds make no nose. the gun itself does. you need a modified boom gun itself.

Chameleon-Why does everyone want to put invisibility as a mod it cancels as soon as you attack.

so they can MOVE. you see how slowly you have to move? hell, with camelion no matter how slow you move you can still be seen.

Of course you could have both, invisibility so you can move and Chameleon for after you attack.

THAT'S a good idea

my favorite? Impervious to Energy on any Armor, power armor, robot, or vehicle

[Jason Richards]

Here's some of my TW technology mods.

Shoulder launched Missile- Teleports warhead to target. No Guidance system or motor=lighter or can replace said components with more explosives=greater damage at equivalent weight of original missile. There should also be a minus to dodge since in the case of targets with early warning capabilities not 6th sense won't get a lock warning and also because there is no travel time.

Well that's well and good, but you're missing about half of the issues. This rocket launcher... how do you aim it? You can't just will a missile from the barrell of the launcher into your target. How does it fire? It has to be directed in some way. Again, it can't just "pop" from the barrell of the gun to the target.

Silenced Rounds- Especially usefull for Boomguns.

Canonically speaking, you can't use a TW silencer on a Boom Gun. I'm not sure why, other than game balance issues, but it's in New West.

Chameleon-Why does everyone want to put invisibility as a mod it cancels as soon as you attack. Of course you could have both, invisibility so you can move and Chameleon for after you attack.

For one, there are two types of invisibility... Invisibility: Superior lets you do pretty much whatever you want, plus makes you quiet.

And, as already pointed out, people can see you if you have Chameleon on. For what you're hinting at, Shadow Meld actually works better, provided it's nighttime and you know... in the shadows.

Also, having two TW devices that operated Invisibility and Chameleon would burn twice as much P.P.E. if they were on at the same time. Switching back and forth from one to the other would also get expensive in terms of P.P.E. expended.

[Nekira Sudacne]

Canonically speaking, you can't use a TW silencer on a Boom Gun. I'm not sure why, other than game balance issues, but it's in New West.

you can.

it's just that the silencer discribed wont' FIT on a boom gun. you need a custom job.

[Borast]

Here's some of my TW technology mods.

Shoulder launched Missile- Teleports warhead to target. No Guidance system or motor=lighter or can replace said components with more explosives=greater damage at equivalent weight of original missile.

then you need a lot of custom made missiles for more damage.

Nah...just "modify" some Fusion Blocks...

There should also be a minus to dodge since in the case of targets with early warning capabilities not 6th sense won't get a lock warning and also because there is no travel time.

read again. sixth sense warns 1 minute BEFORE it happens

travel time is irrelevant.

Tell that to the timelords.

Besides, as you imply, the sixth sense ability activates to the threat, not the actual attack. So, the "flash" is of an explosion about to occur, you jink at just the right time (as indicated by the sixth sense), and hopefully you will avoid the worst of the damage.

As for the loss of radar based dodge bonuses, I do agree, since the explosive just suddenly appears and detonates.

Silenced Rounds- Especially usefull for Boomguns.

except that the rounds make no nose. the gun itself does. you need a modified boom gun itself.

Agreed.

All a silenced ROUND would do is create a sonic delay as it left the barrel, however, the concussive effect of the sonic boom would still work, as would the deafening effect for unprotected personnel. A modified barrel would also simply prevent the hearing of the boom, the concussion and deafening effect (from the overpressure) would still occur.

Chameleon-Why does everyone want to put invisibility as a mod it cancels as soon as you attack.

so they can MOVE. you see how slowly you have to move? hell, with camelion no matter how slow you move you can still be seen.

Of course you could have both, invisibility so you can move and Chameleon for after you attack.

THAT'S a good idea
Screw it, just use Invisibility Superior.

my favorite? Impervious to Energy on any Armor, power armor, robot, or vehicle

Don't have a favourite, since I rarely use TW...

[Borast]

Here's some of my TW technology mods.

Shoulder launched Missile- Teleports warhead to target. No Guidance system or motor=lighter or can replace said components with more explosives=greater damage at equivalent weight of original missile.

then you need a lot of custom made missiles for more damage.

Nah...just "modify" some Fusion Blocks...

There should also be a minus to dodge since in the case of targets with early warning capabilities not 6th sense won't get a lock warning and also because there is no travel time.

read again. sixth sense warns 1 minute BEFORE it happens

travel time is irrelevant.

Tell that to the timelords.

Besides, as you imply, the sixth sense ability activates to the threat, not the actual attack. So, the "flash" is of an explosion about to occur, you jink at just the right time (as indicated by the sixth sense), and hopefully you will avoid the worst of the damage.

As for the loss of radar based dodge bonuses, I do agree, since the explosive just suddenly appears and detonates.

Silenced Rounds- Especially usefull for Boomguns.

except that the rounds make no nose. the gun itself does. you need a modified boom gun itself.

Agreed.

All a silenced ROUND would do is create a sonic delay as it left the barrel, however, the concussive effect of the sonic boom would still work, as would the deafening effect for unprotected personnel. A modified barrel would also simply prevent the hearing of the boom, the concussion and deafening effect (from the overpressure) would still occur.

Chameleon-Why does everyone want to put invisibility as a mod it cancels as soon as you attack.

so they can MOVE. you see how slowly you have to move? hell, with camelion no matter how slow you move you can still be seen.

Of course you could have both, invisibility so you can move and Chameleon for after you attack.

THAT'S a good idea

Screw it, just use Invisibility Superior.

my favorite? Impervious to Energy on any Armor, power armor, robot, or vehicle

Don't have a favourite, since I rarely use TW...

[Zer0 Kay]

Nekira Sudacne
then you need a lot of custom made missiles for more damage.

you could simply modify the launcher so you could mount a couple fusion blocks with prox detectors on it and "launch" them.

read again. sixth sense warns 1 minute BEFORE it happens

uh that's why i said not 6th sense as in except meaning that lack of travel time wouldn't pertain to it. unless your saying that because it's a minute that the pilot wouldn't know exactly when to dodge. In which case one could argue that 6th sense doesn't go off unless the character's "life is in great peril" and all psychic powers are relative to the character. The power would know the character's ability to dodge or otherwise avoid the "peril". In other words when the missile is launched the character isn't in great peril. When the missile is in flight the character isn't in great peril. When the missile is within the character's, for lack of a more imaginative term, peril zone then it would go off. With the T-P (no pun intended) launcher the person with 6th sense would likely get the warning when the attacker points the aiming reticule at him.

except that the rounds make no nose. the gun itself does. you need a modified boom gun itself.

WT-F so I take it you beleive that the Jet Fighter makes no noise when it breaks the sound barrier it's the engines?

Magnetic/Gaussian Fields make NO noise. The gun likely only makes a Whaaa Thk or Whaaa Pow sound as the caps charge and discharge.

It is the Flechettes that make the noise as they break the sound barrier.

Speaking of Flechettes how do they stay in a tight formation after their fired they should cone out like a shotgun to a lesser degree causing lesser damage to a single area unless they already considered this but then it would mention an area effect/ meter or mile(km)? And what keeps them from flipping end over end which would cause them to slow and cause less damage?

[Zer0 Kay]

Jason Richards

Well that's well and good, but you're missing about half of the issues. This rocket launcher... how do you aim it? You can't just will a missile from the barrell of the launcher into your target. How does it fire? It has to be directed in some way. Again, it can't just "pop" from the barrell of the gun to the target.

OK let me say it this way you have a standard shoulder fired missile launcher now you put TW T-port. It is aimed through a targeting sight that "memorizes the location of the teleport" you then pull the trigger. I didn't ask to figure it out mechanically it's a frekin TW weapon, rarely ever do they not have a trigger and their usually not "willed". And I didn't say in, you start that and you'll start a tangent on weather or not you can t-port something into a sealed enviroinment. I made that thread so people would do it there not in my other posts.



Canonically speaking, you can't use a TW silencer on a Boom Gun. I'm not sure why, other than game balance issues, but it's in New West.

Really I didn't remember that. Ah game ballance ok. (trans. subject to GM)


For one, there are two types of invisibility... Invisibility: Superior lets you do pretty much whatever you want, plus makes you quiet.

read again. Still can't attack. You may be thinking Improved Invis from D&D.



And, as already pointed out, people can see you if you have Chameleon on. For what you're hinting at, Shadow Meld actually works better, provided it's nighttime and you know... in the shadows.

I'm not hinting at anything. If a GB is 2mi off or even 300m and fires invisibility or invis:sup dissipates and leaves the GB there in all his splendor. If it has Cameleon on it, it is 90%! undetectable if not moving.

Also, having two TW devices that operated Invisibility and Chameleon would burn twice as much P.P.E. if they were on at the same time. Switching back and forth from one to the other would also get expensive in terms of P.P.E. expended.

OK so I'd much rather use double PPE than allow the opponent 100% chance to find me after I fire.

[Zer0 Kay]

Personally, I hate technowizard stuff. Most of it is largely useless and inefficient, and a few things are grossly overpowerful. Oh well. I am just a small, vocal minority.

TW stuff over powerfull? Uh what about:

GB Boom Gun
The GB itself
Phase Weapons
Tri-Beam Weapons
Manyother Tech PA
I-Beam Weapons
ATL-7

Put up an equivallently OP TW item for each.

Rifts should be higher magic than tech. Rifts Earth is the most magic dense location in the Palladium Megaverse. Yet in actuallity Tech in Rifts still outweighs magic.

[Zer0 Kay]

Borast

Nah...just "modify" some Fusion Blocks...

Thank you same suggestion I had


Besides, as you imply, the sixth sense ability activates to the threat, not the actual attack. So, the "flash" is of an explosion about to occur, you jink at just the right time (as indicated by the sixth sense), and hopefully you will avoid the worst of the damage.

again along the same point I had

As for the loss of radar based dodge bonuses, I do agree, since the explosive just suddenly appears and detonates.

exactly


Agreed.

WHAT

All a silenced ROUND would do is create a sonic delay as it left the barrel, however, the concussive effect of the sonic boom would still work, as would the deafening effect for unprotected personnel. A modified barrel would also simply prevent the hearing of the boom, the concussion and deafening effect (from the overpressure) would still occur.

The only complaint I have with this one is again Magnetic/Gaussian Fields do not create noise modifying the barrel wouldn't do anything except make the boom soundless untill the round left the barrel which is most likely where it actually reaches the speed to make the boom. You are however right about the concussion waves of the sonic boom being the culprit of the hearing loss. However that was not the benifit I was looking for. If one can not hear the boom at 2mi (lets see mach 1= speed of sound or approx 1mi/sec. so wouldn't the sound reach the target at the same time as the round? mach 2 approx. 2 mi/sec so wouldn't the the round reach the target 1 second before the sound?) then it is harder to track where the attacker is or how far away.

THAT'S a good idea
Screw it, just use Invisibility Superior.

You do realize that Invis. Sup. dissipates when you attack and for that period while you are anchored to the ground you can be seen and attacked easily. You might be seen with Camo but your 90% untraceable while under Camo (Using Camo as short for Cameleon) and unmoving. Well a GB firing his Boom Gun is fairly unmoving.[/b]

[Zer0 Kay]

Favorite spell: Carpet of Adhesion

Favorite TW Item: Anything I make

Carpet of adhesion has got to be the most useful of all spells in Rifts. It can be used in so many different ways every wizard on the planet should know it.

Most of the listed TW items are either far behind the tech power curve or too costly for the average player character. Those few that don't fall in to those categories are ok. TW wing boards for instance do well.

Thanks for the . Isn't there a TW gun that uses that yet? I wonder if it could be used as a solid mater force field stopping bullets and such?

[Borast]

All a silenced ROUND would do is create a sonic delay as it left the barrel, however, the concussive effect of the sonic boom would still work, as would the deafening effect for unprotected personnel. A modified barrel would also simply prevent the hearing of the boom, the concussion and deafening effect (from the overpressure) would still occur.

The only complaint I have with this one is again Magnetic/Gaussian Fields do not create noise modifying the barrel wouldn't do anything except make the boom soundless untill the round left the barrel which is most likely where it actually reaches the speed to make the boom. You are however right about the concussion waves of the sonic boom being the culprit of the hearing loss. However that was not the benifit I was looking for. If one can not hear the boom at 2mi (lets see mach 1= speed of sound or approx 1mi/sec. so wouldn't the sound reach the target at the same time as the round? mach 2 approx. 2 mi/sec so wouldn't the the round reach the target 1 second before the sound?) then it is harder to track where the attacker is or how far away.

Agreed to a point...the sonic boom occurs where the object breaks the sound barrier. The point where the gauss shell breaks said barrier is about halfway down the barrel of the gun, and since (the shockwave) is propogating at half the speed of the round, once the (assuming the spell covers the shell(s) and a very short distance (2-3cm) beyond it, it would not cancel the entire sonic boom, since it is the wavefront the object creates that causes the sonic effect (at least that is my understanding from my grade 8 physics back in the jurassic ages), and the wave front extends out quite a distance. So, with just the shell "silenced," you'd only cover part of the boom...the part rebounding off the back of the barrel would still be heard - essentially it'd be half as loud.

However, a silenced barrel would prevent any noise from escaping the barrel, nullifying the "boom" aspect altogether, since it neutralises the initial boom, and the echo effect as well.
PLUS, it would be cheaper...you'd only have to do it once, as opposed to for every freakin' shell. (And for a slight increase, you can include a PPE battery to keep the effect going "indefinately"... )

THAT'S a good idea
Screw it, just use Invisibility Superior.

You do realize that Invis. Sup. dissipates when you attack and for that period while you are anchored to the ground you can be seen and attacked easily. You might be seen with Camo but your 90% untraceable while under Camo (Using Camo as short for Cameleon) and unmoving. Well a GB firing his Boom Gun is fairly unmoving.[/b]

Hm, no I did not. I've yet to play a high enough level mage to USE the spell in Rifts, or anyother system.

[Jason Richards]

OK let me say it this way you have a standard shoulder fired missile launcher now you put TW T-port. It is aimed through a targeting sight that "memorizes the location of the teleport" you then pull the trigger. I didn't ask to figure it out mechanically it's a frekin TW weapon, rarely ever do they not have a trigger and their usually not "willed". And I didn't say in, you start that and you'll start a tangent on weather or not you can t-port something into a sealed enviroinment. I made that thread so people would do it there not in my other posts.

Relax, dude. Seriously. I was just pointing out that teleporting missiles at targets is great, but if it's done with TW it has to have some technological basis in reality (if it's good TW, that is). What you said this time around is fine. Using the sight to capture the location works great.

I didn't go off on a tangent about teleporting things inside environmentally sealed areas. You're the only one who has mentioned it.

Canonically speaking, you can't use a TW silencer on a Boom Gun. I'm not sure why, other than game balance issues, but it's in New West.

Really I didn't remember that. Ah game ballance ok. (trans. subject to GM)

Well, there is another reason similar to what I mentioned earlier. You have to have a physcial implementation of the device, or it won't work (or will work with limited effect). Using the TW device isn't just like casting the spell, which is entirely a "magic" effect. You would need some actual way to help dampen the sonic boom of the gun. I can think of some ways to do it, but all would carry with them some negative side effects as well.

read again. Still can't attack. You may be thinking Improved Invis from D&D.

Didn't have it in front of me. I stand corrected.

And, as already pointed out, people can see you if you have Chameleon on. For what you're hinting at, Shadow Meld actually works better, provided it's nighttime and you know... in the shadows.

I'm not hinting at anything. If a GB is 2mi off or even 300m and fires invisibility or invis:sup dissipates and leaves the GB there in all his splendor. If it has Cameleon on it, it is 90%! undetectable if not moving.

For starters, I was just suggesting another way to get the same effect that you were going after. Using Chameleon is fine. I should point out, however, that the Glitter Boy can't fire his boom gun and stay still. The gun recoils, the whole armor sways while the jets compensate. He's going to be very visible during the shot, and for a moment afterward while he stabilizes. Plus, it's not like it's going to be difficult to get a general idea of where it came from anyway. You're not going to find many situations in which the Glitter Boy can actually hide from anything, under any circumstances. That's not what it's designed to do (the standard GB, anyway).

Also, having two TW devices that operated Invisibility and Chameleon would burn twice as much P.P.E. if they were on at the same time. Switching back and forth from one to the other would also get expensive in terms of P.P.E. expended.

OK so I'd much rather use double PPE than allow the opponent 100% chance to find me after I fire.

Again, that's fine. I was just pointing out a drawback. You're also going to be hard-pressed to find a GB pilot that has those types of PPE (or ISP) stores to just throw out 10 here and 10 there to activate all of these TW devices.

[Zer0 Kay]

read again. sixth sense warns 1 minute BEFORE it happens

Sure does, but what sixth sense dont tell you is what the danger is! and remember that...

Were you trying to quote me or Nekira Sudacne? That is what Nekira said. I just mentioned that it wouldn't go off if someone is simply aiming at you or a missile is launched it would only go off if you are actually in danger. So if one is in a PA, GR, Fighter or other vehicle first thing I think they'd try doing is some sort of evasive manuver rather than look around to see what it might be. Dodge first look later.

[Borast]

Crap...

Something just came to mind about the Glitterboy...

The invisibility / chameleon / etc (and / or a TW Ghillie suit) would only protect you for so long. After all, the 7 metre long flash the gun emits kinda gives you away (especially at night!)...

Ah well, another excellent idea ground under the wheels of workability...

(And before anyone screams that there is no chemical propellant to produce said flash...every rail gun in the world today has a muzzle flash. Can't remember the reason, and don't know the physics behind it, but it's true...)

[Zer0 Kay]

Crap...

Something just came to mind about the Glitterboy...

The invisibility / chameleon / etc (and / or a TW Ghillie suit) would only protect you for so long. After all, the 7 metre long flash the gun emits kinda gives you away (especially at night!)...

Ah well, another excellent idea ground under the wheels of workability...

(And before anyone screams that there is no chemical propellant to produce said flash...every rail gun in the world today has a muzzle flash. Can't remember the reason, and don't know the physics behind it, but it's true...)

Were the hell did you get a muzzle flash from? I don't see it in the main book. How is it created? Does Mach 2 some how make things glow. Oh yeah I remember how the F-15 glo...no it doesn't. Wait a minute it must be the immense magnetic field yeah I remember seing a glowing, no wait that was a cartoon showing the INVISIBLE magnetic field for a electromagnet crain.


Doh now I do remember. Their called rail guns because rather than using magnetic rings to launch the projectile like gauss rifles a rail gun uses electric rails. The electric rails produce a magnetic force in the direction of the charge. So the round is in contact between both rails and when it leaves the barrels and breaks contact from the rails there is an arc. So yup your right there is blue muzzle flash from the end of the barrel. However I don't beleive it would be several meters. Why? Because if it was that means that during those seven meters the munitions are still subseptable to the magnetic field which would slow the round down. The distance of the arc could and probably is modified to only go a couple feet past the barrel tip by controlling the rail shut off time. Off course the barrel on the GB looks like it has a flash suppressor so maybe it grounds the arc so it doesn't even go past the end of the muzzle finding the grounds more attractive than the round. Or you can always just put darkness on the shell and barrel. Why both? Well If it's on the round it will exit the barrel and if there is a 7 foot arc whatever is behind the round may still be seen. If it is only on the barrel then after the round leaves the barrel and travels beyond the sphere but still within 7 feet theres an arc. I prefer my arcless explination. Hay any one ever see the USAF rail gun test weapon yet?

http://www.military.com/soldiertech/0,14632,Soldiertech_RailGuns,,00.html

What do you know proof of your muzzle flash and it's not blue? But then again the flame is from the round superheating the air and turning it to plasma ( I beleive) that's what happens when you accelerate the round from 0 to 13,000mph in 0.2 seconds. That's Mach 17.08 wow we already out shoot the "great" Boomgun. The Boomguns measly Mach 2 would only create a muzzle arc not a flash.

Here's one that shows the blue arc
http://www.powerlabs.org/emguns.htm

This page is shows a graphic of a coil gun.
http://www.military.com/soldiertech/0,14632,Soldiertech_TankGun,,00.html

Coil guns wouldn't make an arc because the round isn't in contact with the round. Many games that have both often refer to the rail gun as such but to the coil gun as a Gauss Rifle.

Hope you all enjoy. Oh look at the parent page Military.com under soldier tech if you want to read about the G-11 the US should have adopted to replace the M-16. There is also a new H&K under the G-11 Article called the XM-8 very nice.

[Zer0 Kay]

Ohhh here's a cool one.
http://www.exn.ca/video/?video=exn20040407-plasmaboy.asx

[Svartalf]

Here's some of my TW technology mods.

Shoulder launched Missile- Teleports warhead to target. No Guidance system or motor=lighter or can replace said components with more explosives=greater damage at equivalent weight of original missile.

then you need a lot of custom made missiles for more damage.

Nah...just "modify" some Fusion Blocks...

good idea there ... of course the thing becomes a line of sight gun (somehow it doesn't feel right to tweak a missile launcher so it can deposit fusion blocks just about anywhere)

]

Silenced Rounds- Especially usefull for Boomguns.

except that the rounds make no nose. the gun itself does. you need a modified boom gun itself.

Agreed.

All a silenced ROUND would do is create a sonic delay as it left the barrel, however, the concussive effect of the sonic boom would still work, as would the deafening effect for unprotected personnel. A modified barrel would also simply prevent the hearing of the boom, the concussion and deafening effect (from the overpressure) would still occur.

besiede the fact that the TW silencers from NEW west, indeed officially can't be fitted on a railgun ... tweaking the *rounds* stikes me as stupid : a) TWing up *anything* is a major job, that takes a lot of material, time and PPE. doing so on a disposable item like a gun round (let's suppose the cost &so &sf are similar to those of a grenade) is something like major waste of resources. b) a TW item usually has some crystals and whatever attached to it. doing that to a rail gun round is to invite jams and other major foulups. Also, while any machinegun or railgun is ultra noisy and has huge kick from sending ultra sonic speed rounds, the boom gun is so extreme in the category that I don't think it can at all be dealt with under that angle.

[.

[Jason Richards]

Were the hell did you get a muzzle flash from? I don't see it in the main book. How is it created? Does Mach 2 some how make things glow. Oh yeah I remember how the F-15 glo...no it doesn't. Wait a minute it must be the immense magnetic field yeah I remember seing a glowing, no wait that was a cartoon showing the INVISIBLE magnetic field for a electromagnet crain.

Dude, somebody needs a hug. Chill out. He didn't just insult your mom, he played devil's advocate. You're right. There is no muzzle flash, but since you seem intent on turning this into "why this will work no matter what anybody else says" you should probably address my earlier post.

And, not to burst your anti-invisibility bubble, but Invisibility: Simple CAN be used during combat.

[Svartalf]

Were the hell did you get a muzzle flash from? I don't see it in the main book. How is it created? Does Mach 2 some how make things glow. Oh yeah I remember how the F-15 glo...no it doesn't. Wait a minute it must be the immense magnetic field yeah I remember seing a glowing, no wait that was a cartoon showing the INVISIBLE magnetic field for a electromagnet crain.

You're right. There is no muzzle flash, but since you seem intent on turning this into "why this will work no matter what anybody else says" you should probably address my earlier post.

And, not to burst your anti-invisibility bubble, but Invisibility: Simple CAN be used during combat.

Actually, there is ... yeah, it's not in the books, but all RL railguns to have that electric arc as the projectile leaves the barrle... Kay was even so nice as to provide us with some sites where this is shown.

[Jason Richards]

Were the hell did you get a muzzle flash from? I don't see it in the main book. How is it created? Does Mach 2 some how make things glow. Oh yeah I remember how the F-15 glo...no it doesn't. Wait a minute it must be the immense magnetic field yeah I remember seing a glowing, no wait that was a cartoon showing the INVISIBLE magnetic field for a electromagnet crain.

You're right. There is no muzzle flash, but since you seem intent on turning this into "why this will work no matter what anybody else says" you should probably address my earlier post.

And, not to burst your anti-invisibility bubble, but Invisibility: Simple CAN be used during combat.

Actually, there is ... yeah, it's not in the books, but all RL railguns to have that electric arc as the projectile leaves the barrle... Kay was even so nice as to provide us with some sites where this is shown.

No "significant" muzzle flash, then. He obviously took great offense and went on a rant when the possibility was mentioned.

[Borast]

Were the hell did you get a muzzle flash from? I don't see it in the main book. How is it created? Does Mach 2 some how make things glow. Oh yeah I remember how the F-15 glo...no it doesn't. Wait a minute it must be the immense magnetic field yeah I remember seing a glowing, no wait that was a cartoon showing the INVISIBLE magnetic field for a electromagnet crain.

Dude, somebody needs a hug. Chill out. He didn't just insult your mom, he played devil's advocate. You're right. There is no muzzle flash, but since you seem intent on turning this into "why this will work no matter what anybody else says" you should probably address my earlier post.

And, not to burst your anti-invisibility bubble, but Invisibility: Simple CAN be used during combat.

For the record, I was not insulted, and although I did not follow (any of) the links he provided in his post, I was happy to see that someone understood what I was talking about...even if he did have to kill the knee-jerk "that's not possible" reaction with the sectiion you quoted.

Anyway, I don't know why, but the video I can remember seeing of a rail-gin back in the day involved a gun suspeneded on a 4-point system from a VERY heavy sledge. The gun itself weighed in the neigbourhood of about 5-600kilos, and the sledge something like 2000 kilos. The gun, when fired, flew back to the limit of the chains, and the sledge slid a good half to three quarters of a metre.

They then talked about a model that could be mounted on a truck and fired, but (in addition to all the glass windows in a significant area blowing out) there was the matter of a muzzle flash of almost 2 metres. This gun would have only weighed about 200 kilos. They did explain WHY the railgun had an actual flash (not arc, but still), but I don't remember it having anything to do with a M18+ muzzle velocity. For all I know, it had to do with compression heating of air in the barrel, and if casued a "flash-over" as the compressed air expanded out and away from the muzzle. >Shrug<

Anywho...back to other posts.

[Zer0 Kay]

read again. sixth sense warns 1 minute BEFORE it happens

Sure does, but what sixth sense dont tell you is what the danger is! and remember that...

Were you trying to quote me or Nekira Sudacne? That is what Nekira said. I just mentioned that it wouldn't go off if someone is simply aiming at you or a missile is launched it would only go off if you are actually in danger. So if one is in a PA, GR, Fighter or other vehicle first thing I think they'd try doing is some sort of evasive manuver rather than look around to see what it might be. Dodge first look later.

Lets just say that I'm not quoting anybody, I just hate seeing post after post saying how sixth sense gets them out of danger. (sure if you know what the danger is... but you cannot unless you have lots of "out of game information" to guide you thru safety)

Now sure you sixth sense will go off. without any question, because its warning you that something "might kill you within the next 60 seconds".

And its up to you to spend 15 of the first seconds to see what is happening, and then make a quick judgment call.

You dont know for sure what the danger is.

(and in our game) sixth sense will not go off durring combat because your already in danger.

"So even if you have sixth sense, how would you know if a bomb is teleported on your lap?" from the moment your sixth sense goes off, you dont see the bomb, so what would you do? Jump out of the way? would you also jump out of the way if somebody prowl behind you to stab you in the back? would you also jump out of the way if your chair is a trigger bomb and it goes off the moment you get off?

these are something to think about...

true that but the reaction to the warning should be subject to the characters previous responses to the stimuli. The only thing I have a tiff with is the seat. Sixth sense would go off before you sit because it is your sitting in it that puts you in imminent danger. Or if your normal reaction is to move would the sixth sense go off 1 min before you get up, 1 min before you sit down or one min before it was going to go off causing you to get up? In other word would sixth sense realize when itself was a danger to you and warn you about itself going off?

[Zer0 Kay]

Were the hell did you get a muzzle flash from? I don't see it in the main book. How is it created? Does Mach 2 some how make things glow. Oh yeah I remember how the F-15 glo...no it doesn't. Wait a minute it must be the immense magnetic field yeah I remember seing a glowing, no wait that was a cartoon showing the INVISIBLE magnetic field for a electromagnet crain.

Dude, somebody needs a hug. Chill out. He didn't just insult your mom, he played devil's advocate. You're right. There is no muzzle flash, but since you seem intent on turning this into "why this will work no matter what anybody else says" you should probably address my earlier post.

And, not to burst your anti-invisibility bubble, but Invisibility: Simple CAN be used during combat.

No I need to get laid. Your right he just questioned me, sorry I kinda get into it when someone says I'm wrong so your my next target. I was wrong there is a "muzzle flash" it is an electrical arc. If the Boomgun actually fired at the speed real weapon grade railguns do (mach 17 check the links) then it would create a muzle flash from the round superheating the air also from the armiture turning to plasma. I'll address our earlier post later.

You must be talking about some other Invisibility (Superior) like the Improved Invisibility from AD&D. Not the one listed on pg 178 in the main Rifts rulebook.

[Zer0 Kay]

All a silenced ROUND would do is create a sonic delay as it left the barrel, however, the concussive effect of the sonic boom would still work, as would the deafening effect for unprotected personnel. A modified barrel would also simply prevent the hearing of the boom, the concussion and deafening effect (from the overpressure) would still occur.

The only complaint I have with this one is again Magnetic/Gaussian Fields do not create noise modifying the barrel wouldn't do anything except make the boom soundless untill the round left the barrel which is most likely where it actually reaches the speed to make the boom. You are however right about the concussion waves of the sonic boom being the culprit of the hearing loss. However that was not the benifit I was looking for. If one can not hear the boom at 2mi (lets see mach 1= speed of sound or approx 1mi/sec. so wouldn't the sound reach the target at the same time as the round? mach 2 approx. 2 mi/sec so wouldn't the the round reach the target 1 second before the sound?) then it is harder to track where the attacker is or how far away.

Agreed to a point...the sonic boom occurs where the object breaks the sound barrier. The point where the gauss shell breaks said barrier is about halfway down the barrel of the gun, and since (the shockwave) is propagating at half the speed of the round, once the (assuming the spell covers the shell(s) and a very short distance (2-3cm) beyond it, it would not cancel the entire sonic boom, since it is the wavefront the object creates that causes the sonic effect (at least that is my understanding from my grade 8 physics back in the jurassic ages), and the wave front extends out quite a distance. So, with just the shell "silenced," you'd only cover part of the boom...the part rebounding off the back of the barrel would still be heard - essentially it'd be half as loud.

However, a silenced barrel would prevent any noise from escaping the barrel, nullifying the "boom" aspect altogether, since it neutralizes the initial boom, and the echo effect as well.
PLUS, it would be cheaper...you'd only have to do it once, as opposed to for every freakin' shell. (And for a slight increase, you can include a PPE battery to keep the effect going "indefinitely"... )

THAT'S a good idea
Screw it, just use Invisibility Superior.

You do realize that Invis. Sup. dissipates when you attack and for that period while you are anchored to the ground you can be seen and attacked easily. You might be seen with Camo but your 90% untraceable while under Camo (Using Camo as short for Cameleon) and unmoving. Well a GB firing his Boom Gun is fairly unmoving.[/b]

Hm, no I did not. I've yet to play a high enough level mage to USE the spell in Rifts, or any other system.

Yes the wave does create the boom but the size of the wave depends on the structure causing it. They are actually looking for a shape that minimizes the boom for military aircraft.

The sonic boom is made when the round passes the barrier and does not travel with it. So the instant the sound is made it is nullified especially if it is within the barrel since the barrel would contain most of the wave. The shock wave does continue to follow the object and would likely still deafen anyone it came near due to the sudden change in pressure of the surrounding air. Hmm, properly muffled the Boomgun could lose it's name if it does indeed reach mach within the barrel. The initial wave from breaking the barrier would be shaped by the barrel and shouldn't affect anyone directly to the side of the GB or behind it unlike when there is a boom which travels out in a sphere.

You know though it would be cheaper to just do the gun instead of the rounds though. Why bother with a PPE batery if it is done by some other practitioner of magic that can make a permanent enchantment then you don't need one.

[Zer0 Kay]

I like my TW Garfiled Plush launcher.

Use See Aura to get it locked onto somebody or something, teleport: lesser to get it to the target (its fun to shoot it at the face part of helmets), then top it off with a weak carpet of adhesion to make sure it stays put.

Then it pops up a beacon that has meteor on it. Great spell in my opinion. All you can do is dodge (it's +4 to strike even), but if you have a plushie stuck to yer face, you won't see it.

Smiling_Bandit - Likes to add insult to injury

That is disturbingly awesome it must be a favorite of crazies and other disturbed yet fun people. How is the person going to dodge they may move around a bunch trying to get off the Garfield (tm) but they can't see the attack coming. So is it the Garfield with the suctioncup paws that goes on car windows?

[Zer0 Kay]

Were the hell did you get a muzzle flash from? I don't see it in the main book. How is it created? Does Mach 2 some how make things glow. Oh yeah I remember how the F-15 glo...no it doesn't. Wait a minute it must be the immense magnetic field yeah I remember seing a glowing, no wait that was a cartoon showing the INVISIBLE magnetic field for a electromagnet crain.

You're right. There is no muzzle flash, but since you seem intent on turning this into "why this will work no matter what anybody else says" you should probably address my earlier post.

And, not to burst your anti-invisibility bubble, but Invisibility: Simple CAN be used during combat.

If you read the "rant" is only 1/2 of that post the other half is saying that he is somewhat correct and even giving URL's to actuall sites.

Actually, there is ... yeah, it's not in the books, but all RL railguns to have that electric arc as the projectile leaves the barrle... Kay was even so nice as to provide us with some sites where this is shown.

No "significant" muzzle flash, then. He obviously took great offense and went on a rant when the possibility was mentioned.

[Jason Richards]

And, not to burst your anti-invisibility bubble, but Invisibility: Simple CAN be used during combat.

No I need to get laid. Your right he just questioned me, sorry I kinda get into it when someone says I'm wrong so your my next target. I was wrong there is a "muzzle flash" it is an electrical arc. If the Boomgun actually fired at the speed real weapon grade railguns do (mach 17 check the links) then it would create a muzle flash from the round superheating the air also from the armiture turning to plasma. I'll address our earlier post later.

You must be talking about some other Invisibility (Superior) like the Improved Invisibility from AD&D. Not the one listed on pg 178 in the main Rifts rulebook.

Read my post. Invisibility:Simple can be used during combat.

[Zer0 Kay]

And, not to burst your anti-invisibility bubble, but Invisibility: Simple CAN be used during combat.

No I need to get laid. Your right he just questioned me, sorry I kinda get into it when someone says I'm wrong so your my next target. I was wrong there is a "muzzle flash" it is an electrical arc. If the Boomgun actually fired at the speed real weapon grade railguns do (mach 17 check the links) then it would create a muzle flash from the round superheating the air also from the armiture turning to plasma. I'll address our earlier post later.

You must be talking about some other Invisibility (Superior) like the Improved Invisibility from AD&D. Not the one listed on pg 178 in the main Rifts rulebook.

Read my post. Invisibility:Simple can be used during combat.

oops your right. However all of the technological equipment wondering around like multi optical visors, Radar, IR, UV etc can see you and worse so can all the missiles.