Rifts Earth and Cars

[samalle]

Hey guys, I'm new to the Rifts world and to being a GM. Looking to set up an atmosphere for a group I'm running who's never really heard of Rifts.

Could anyone tell me about manufacturing facilities? How common is all of this technology? How common is it to find a car riding around? Or to see Robotic Power armor you might be able to steal? One of the players finds it hard to believe that in this post apocalyptic world you'd be seeing new cars being built, he's envisioning the only real cars we see are hold overs from before the apocalypse.

For that matter, could anyone tell me how common gas, standard American Unleaded fuel, in this world?


I'm actually setting up the scenario with the group out on an outing together in America as of today. Just driving down the road, then they get spit out of a rift into Rifts Earth. Characters have to be built with things from this world, but magic/psychic characters will feel their power awaken after they crash through the rift. Now they must navigate this world with whatever was in their car when they crossed the rift, including figuring out new technology.

[Nekira Sudacne]

Gasoline powered vehicles are still common for civilian craft, as old as the Rifts main book they'd have common vehicles like the Big Boss ATV have prices for gas powered, electric, and mini nuclear reactors power generated.

Manufacutring abilities vary wildly. Some communities have a solid technological base like Impshming, but that's the exception rather than the rule.

[Colonel_Tetsuya]

People need transport, that simple, so new vehicles are made.

Remember that Rifts isn't actually post-apocalyptic. Its post-post apocalypse. There are now civilizations out there that are recovering/have recovered/are well established, that have manufacturing capability.

Now, does the average own or village out the wilderness have the ability to just manufacture a car? Probably not (though it really isn't that hard when you dont have the TSA and federal agencies telling you what is safe or not. A basic automobile is actually pretty simple). But an Operator could probably build one out of scraps no problems. If he hes got a battery, an engine (if electric), or just an engine (if liquid fuel), and some sheet and scrap steel.... he can probably build something that goes. It would be a weird mishmash of high technology and low (brakes are probably going to be fairly primitive, wire-pull-clamp (no hydraulics), etc) but it will go from point A to point B in relative safety (as far as that goes in Rifts Earth) and itll carry stuff and people.

The more established towns (any place with a machine shop with a lathe, router, etc) can make a car no problem. Might take a while, but, again, its really not that hard.

And the very civilized places, like Ishpeming, the Manistique Imperium, Kingsdale, Lazlo (and its satellites), Golden Age Weaponsmiths (a sorta pseudo-nation based around their operations, at least), Los Alamo, Fort El Dorado (before it became CS El Dorado), and the Colorado Baronies and Black Market (specifically Bandito) have factories capable of mass production.

For the super high level of materials science available to Rifts Earth, cars are pretty simple. Manistique, in particular, primarily makes its money from manufacturing civilian vehicles, trucks, and farm equipment (this is noted a bit in early books, and outright stated in NG1 and 2, and Aftermath). They export it all over the continent.

Now, that doesn't mean every Tom Dick and Harry has a car. A wilderness town might have half a dozen cars/trucks in the whole village. Maybe the farmers have simple tractors (which double as slower moving trucks by puling large trailers), maybe not even every farmer (maybe they share). A lot of places still work on muscle power (though the whole of Rifts Earth is somewhat weirdly high and low tech. Your farm might not have running water, but you have a solar panel or two, a few electric lights with batteries, maybe a small computer that your family has had for 50+ years, and an old Laser Rifle to run off monsters. But you also cook over a fire, heat your house with firewood, etc.).

Once a town gets to a certain size, and wealth, then vehicles probably become quite a bit more common, and since they can be built out of MDC materials, wear and tear are less of an issue. Some families might have "Cars" that theyve had for 100+ years that are still going. The local Operator probably keeps them all running.

As for Robots and Power Armor... thats an entirely different thing.

Most towns dont have any. Or if they do, its the only one in town and probably belongs to the local protector, who might be a retired adventurer or similar.

Probably though, no robots or PA, but a few guys in light to medium MDC armor, with basic rifles to defend the town.

Larger towns where adventurers and mercenaries gather, however, might see dozens or hundreds of robots and PA sitting around. As to wether you can steal them... well, good luck. Dont get caught.

Its worth noting that Kevin initially pushed Rifts Earth as MOSTLY tiny villages in the middle of nowhere with nothing, but as the setting evolved, there are canon places pretty much everywhere that are high tech or at least can service high tech - until you get east of the Appalachians into the East Coast and Dinosaur Swamp, (and even then, once you get north into Canada) its hard to go more than 100-150 miles without being at least relatively near someplace with a decent amount of technology or at least the ability to service it. (For instance, the Colorado Baronies dont have any high tech factories, but they have enough high tech repair shops, parts, and trade through them that they can service your high tech equipment with no problems, and the local Operators and Techno-Wizards can certainly build a decent amount of stuff from scratch and parts). That persists as you go west until you get past the New Rockies (at least, we assume, since the West Coast other than Arizona (Arzno) has never been detailed), which are similarly empty as the East coast.

So, basically, in any area where you're adventuring, until you get well north into the depths of Canada, you're probably not too far from someplace that builds, services, or trades in technology - or if you're on the far coasts. But all of the "Domain of Man" (as noted in various books) is fairly close (no more than 150-200 miles, generally) from someplace with a decent amount of tech.

[taalismn]

Of course, even if you got cars, finding good ROADS is another problem. Most tech-towns likely have good quality paved roads, but only a short distance outside town. Unless they have a neighbor they do regular business with, that can share the cost of paving, maintaining, and patrolling, the interstate highway system is a thing of the past. Oh, the roads and trails are well-beaten down and regularly cleared, but paving is nonexistent outside weapons range of the town walls.

I imagine the CS(and maybe Free Quebec) has the closest to a highway system, but it's monitored, patrolled by the military(being a highway patrolman I can see as a beginning assignment SAMAS and Flyboys), and the military and industry has priority on it. Anybody else likely has to pay a toll, if they're allowed on the pave ways at all.
And frankly, the local monsters have probably twigged to the idea that paved and maintained roads mean TRAFFIC, and a. good chance of snagging a meal, so paved roads become buffet platters attracting predators.

[Colonel_Tetsuya]

Of course, even if you got cars, finding good ROADS is another problem. Most tech-towns likely have good quality paved roads, but only a short distance outside town. Unless they have a neighbor they do regular business with, that can share the cost of paving, maintaining, and patrolling, the interstate highway system is a thing of the past. Oh, the roads and trails are well-beaten down and regularly cleared, but paving is nonexistent outside weapons range of the town walls.

For a decent portion of the continent, this is absolutely the case. I'd rather doubt that a lot of towns (even large ones) have paved roads. The Colorado Baronies dont, except for the MAJOR thoroughfares. Everything else is packed dirt and gravel.

Keep in mind that most "Cars" in the wilderness towns are probably trucks with a decent amount of torque and a decent ground clearance to deal with muddy roads and ruts.

I imagine the CS(and maybe Free Quebec) has the closest to a highway system, but it's monitored,

I'd imagine they do, but it is not detailed. However, since Northern Gun and the Manistique Imperium have a highway network between them, which IS detailed, its fair to assume the CS and FQ (as a former CS State) have fairly well developed roads at least between major settlements and probably well maintained "back roads" quality gravel roads even to the outlying farming settlements.

patrolled by the military(being a highway patrolman I can see as a beginning assignment SAMAS and Flyboys),

FQ may use their military (especially in the wilder parts of FQ, they definitely do, as detailed in the FQ Worldbook, but in closer to the civilized parts, maybe they use their police), but the CS almost assuredly uses the ISS for this. Which doesn't mean they aren't SAMs and guys on Skycycles, they just arent RPA Elites and Flyboys, theyre ISS Peacekeepers instead. Towards the frontiers (especially in CS Missouri, which is mostly farmland) it might be taken over by the actual military, but near any remotely large population center, its the ISS. Thats their entire purpose. (Its detailed in WB11 that the ISS has sole authority to police, and the military has to be invited in to help by the local ISS commander and governor except in times of actual attack. Otherwise they cant do anything related to policing. Only Emperor Prosek himself can override this - not even the General Staff can do it.)

and the military and industry has priority on it. Anybody else likely has to pay a toll, if they're allowed on the pave ways at all.

I doubt its a toll road. One of the benefits of being a CS Citizen is that your government gives you roads! But Military Priority? 100%. People who aren't citizens might have to pay a toll... but those people also almost assuredly AVOID the road because the road is well patrolled and theyd have to explain themselves to CS officials constantly. And given that they might have D-bees, unregistered psychics, monsters, etc, they want nothing to do with that.

And frankly, the local monsters have probably twigged to the idea that paved and maintained roads mean TRAFFIC, and a. good chance of snagging a meal, so paved roads become buffet platters attracting predators.

Anywhere that isn't heavily patrolled, this is a certainty. The NG Highway is extremely well patrolled (patrols going by every hour or so) and it is STILL occasionally attacked by monsters or brigands, who try to do a smash and grab and evade the NG Cops.

[taalismn]

[quote="Colonel_Tetsuya
I doubt its a toll road. One of the benefits of being a CS Citizen is that your government gives you roads! But Military Priority? 100%. People who aren't citizens might have to pay a toll... but those people also almost assuredly AVOID the road because the road is well patrolled and theyd have to explain themselves to CS officials constantly. And given that they might have D-bees, unregistered psychics, monsters, etc, they want nothing to do with that..[/quote]


Yep, and you can't complain to anybody in authority about the Coalition State Police species-profiling you. They tend to show the police body cams of them beating you up as entertainment.
The CS version of 'Cops'? From a sentient-rights viewpoint it gets ugly FAST.

[guardiandashi]

In a lot of ways Rifts is full of contradictions and wierd stuff.

in one town the highest tech transportation is shanks Mare (IE better get walking) in another town they may have internal combustion engine vehicles (likely multifuel versions that can run on anything from gas to alcohol to Diesel. ) in another town they will have solar chargers and electric vehicles, and in yet another town they might have nuclear powered vehicles. with all these towns relatively near each other.

as a rule of thumb there are few if any major roads, consider it much like the old west days, and the wagon trains headed west. as mentioned there are no real roads, that go from place to place. with that said you will also run into random chunks of roads/interstate highways from today, that may or may not be headed in your general direction.

in "civilized" places like coalition territory, you are a lot more likely to find real roads that are more than a trail, pathway that a lot of vehicles have used. all the way from dirt roads, up to the equivalent of a modern highway road.
with mdc weapons I also would expect to see places where people used energy weapons to clear a path rather than go around.
other places you will find a lot of things like sky cycles and no roads at all but just nav beacons.

[Shark_Force]

honestly, while i wouldn't expect a lot of roads like modern ones, i do expect there'd be a heck of a lot more dirt roads (poorly maintained) all over the place. stone age people managed to make roads with stone tools and maybe a few pack animals. look at civil war maps some time... there were actually a lot of roads, even through heavily forested areas, and people didn't have tractors or construction vehicles to build them, they had to make them with basic tools and probably a fair bit of help from draft animals).

again, i'm not talking about paved or even gravel or macadamized, but a dirt road wide enough to get a wagon down, and in between major cities wide enough that you can have a couple of wagons or vehicles pass each other would probably be fairly common. they'd be terrible in wet conditions, you'd probably have to clear any obstructions like fallen trees yourself (and bandits probably *create* such obstructions specifically to force people to get out of their vehicles, making that task extra nerve-wracking), and you're definitely not going to be enjoying the experience if you try to drive down them at top speed in a wheeled vehicle, but there should be roads.

there is, ultimately, going to be an optimal path to take to travel between two given locations. if a location is important enough that it will see regular travel, people will gradually trample down anything along that path, and people who need to pass that way often will probably eventually take steps to make it easier (ranging from cutting a trail through dense woods to building some basic form of bridge across small gaps and such, or at least filling it in enough that it doesn't make an area impassable).

this is even more true when you remember that sometimes, the people passing through will be operating vehicles with unlimited energy weapon usage or MD melee attacks, and can probably smash down a bunch of trees and shove them to the side or reduce them to ashes at a fairly impressive rate, at which point any further traffic will keep that area clear. heck, with a vibro-blade, even a person on foot could probably create a moderately clear path with ease, just by cutting trees off at the stump in such a way that they fall away from the trail you're creating.

so again: i wouldn't expect paved roads with ditches on either side to keep the water from flooding the area, or any sort of maintenance unless it's either private property or within the area that a community claims for itself. but there will probably be roads wide enough for a car to get through (although off-road suspension is definitely recommended), along the routes where people normally travel (conveniently, that also means that those roads will likely lead to places like fords where you can cross rivers, or even bridges if you're lucky).

and, of course, some areas will simply be relatively free of obstructions regardless; there's a lot of flat terrain with only low-lying brush in north america (to be clear, by low-lying brush i mean "not trees"; there will still probably be plants that are 4-5 feet tall which you would be ill-advised to drive a car through). in the deserts, you could probably drive around most obstructions relatively easily (there are plants, but they're usually fairly spread out).

once we've established that there will be roads (and again, it only makes sense), i would expect to find some services along those roads... again, nothing like driving down the modern highways, but you will probably find clearings suitable for campsites. some of them may have crude shelters (lean-tos or thatch buildings and the like), or frames for crude shelters if the group have some basic stuff like tarps or put in the effort to basically thatch those buildings themselves, as well as fire pits and latrines (and they'll probably be near drinking water, too). they may on occasion even find an inn of some sort, probably attached to a facility that sells fuel and possibly food and other basic supplies (but those will mostly be part of a village, guarded by the same thing that protects the village; anything in the wilderness needs to double as a fort capable of keeping mega-damage threats at bay, so expect that only along major trade routes, if even that).

so i'd say give them a decent off-road capable vehicle and they should be able to move around alright even through areas with heavy vegetation. not at full speed, and not without interruptions to clear the roads or dig themselves out of mud on occasion, but they should be able to travel in a modern vehicle across most of north america. provided, of course, that they don't get killed by something else that is travelling across north america.