Blue_Lion wrote:You moved the goal post from will not scratch to will not break.(you first said would not even scratch then when that was shut down will not break/destroy.)
Huh? if you can scratch something, you can destroy it with enough scratches. This...isn't moving the goalpost. they're different ways of saying the same thing: that you can accumulate damage over time it's SDC, no matter how many days worth of melee rounds it takes. It's not moving the goalpost if you simply say the same thing in a slightly different way.
The scale of a real world pyramid striking it with a pick amounts to a scratch.
You will not be able to break it with normal combat rounds.
You would need to slowly scratch your way in.
SDC attacks would be for the most part useless on it only resulting in scratches.
Attacking a MDC pyramid with a pick results/amounts in a scratch.
You would not be able to break it with normal combat rounds.
SDC attacks would be for the most part useless on it only resulting in scratches.
Because you can scratch it logically you can slowly scratch your way in.
Wait, why are you talking about combat rounds again? seriously, why? they have nothing to do with my point. Every pick attack makes a scratch that does X SDC (I'm not sure what the damage roll on a pick is). Therefore the number of combat rounds needed to destroy a pyramid is that number multiplied by however many combat rounds it takes to destroy it. Granted, you're likely to win the fight first, but weather those rounds take place inside of or outside of combat have nothing to do with my point...at all. I'm not moving the goalpost, you're making a claim I never made, and claiming I made it. That's not me moving the goalpost, that's you misunderstanding my point in the first place.
HMMMM-It is almost like MDC do to size might be logical because of scale of the object and effort to destroy.
My statements even showed that by sheer mass earth becomes immune to destroyed by SDC attacks becoming effective MDC do to the scale.(I have given real world examples of attacks by sdc weapons not being effective.)
You where the one to move it outside combat with digging not me.
You attempted to use outside combat actions that take time beyond combat to prove that sdc can damage things that are for the most immune to destruction by SDC attacks. You then accuse me of moving goal post outside combat, when it is your statements that moved it outside combat.
No. I never said anything about combat actions taken beyond combat time. I never MENTIONED combat time. You did. you can go back and read through my posts again to prove it. You can destroy pyramids inside of combat time or outside of it. There's no reason a battle cannot last days or weeks or months or years -- ever hear of a seige?
Digging is not one strike or action it is continued effort.
Source? Nothing says you can't dig in combat. And there's plenty of reasons to dig inside of combat time--ever hear of a foxhole? Keep your head down, hope your buddies cover fire for you, you can tottally do it. This might go down to just a skill roll if your GM wants to abstract it. but if the ground is made of something rougher, he might require you to actually deplete a given value of SDC/MDC in the material to dig a hole. I've had GM's do it both ways. the rules support both methods.
Do you dig with a pick by rolling strike and damage every strike or just make some sort of prolonged skill check if a skill is required? (I would think prolong check. so that would mean you are not inflicting damage when you dig because digging is not combat but prolong action.)
Depends on if what i'm attacking is a building or fortification with SDC/MDC that needs to be depleted doesn't it? Sounds like your mixing up the way you/your GM handles digging with what the rules actually say about digging/mining. the game has discrete SDC values for various things. Digging through them is a valid way to get through them.
IN real life you can not destroy a stone pyramid or hill with most typical sdc attacks.
You can not destroy them by punching them.
You can not destroy them by shooting them with a handgun even if you shoot them 1K times.
Attacking a hill with a sword would not destroy it, attacking a stone pyramid you can break your sword are the rocks.
Right now you whole stance hinges on dissembling earth with tools being treated as combat damage. Doing it outside of combat. But you call me out for addressing non-combat claiming I moved the goal post. (So you stance requires being addressed outside of combat.)
I made no claim about combat time or non combat time. At all. The game does not limit at all anything you can do in combat time, that sounds like a house rule of yours you are confusing with canon. There are penalties for doing certain actions under pressure in combat, but that's all. And you claimed that you can't dig by dealing damage in combat time. What's your source for that? seriously? point me anywhere it says you can't mine through a wall or bust down a door during combat, because if you can do either of those things, you can also destroy a pyramid in combat. it just takes more time. More time than any random fight is likely to last, but that has no bearing on if it's MDC or MDC. So...no, I think you're still wrong, and you misunderstand my point.
You *CAN* resolve digging away a hill with a skill roll.
OR you can accumulate enough damage.
These systems are parallel, not contradicatory, they are different mechanical ways of expressing the same basic actions and it's up to the GM to decide which is the most appropriate to use in any given situation. The problem appears to be you have confused how you personally resolve a vauge mechanical system with what the books actually say, and the books are quite silent on the matter. You have tools you can use with skill rolls, but they also have combat values. You have Walls and doors (A pyramid exterior is a wall) with SDC values.
Do you use construction/demolition skills to make a breech in a wall? or do you just take a take a tool and attack, doing it's SDC value until it's depleted?
the Game leaves it to the GM to decide which is the most appropriate at any given time. You appear to have decided for yourself that certain things cannot be done in combat, but, that's a personal ruling unless you got a source in the books i've missed?
And more importantly, neither mean that SDC structures are MDC. So I still don't know what point you think you are making. Even if I conceeded you can't drag out combat time to lots of combat rounds while you and your buds slowly deal hundreds of thousands of SDC (And to be clear, I absolutely do not conceed that, because you tottally can, but even if I did hypothetically conceed it) it wouldn't help your overall point that SDC in stone in large piles become MDC because...what about restrictions on combat time change SDC structures to MDC? Even if you were right about combat time, it wouldn't help your point.