Achilles Neo-Humans

[Kryzbyn]

I have a question about these wonderful people, mainly their MDC transformation. South America 2 says:

1. Supernatural Transformation: The neo-human can transform himself into a supernatural being. While transformed, the neo-human's strength becomes supernatural, and his S.D.C. and hit points become M.D.C. points! The transformation temporarily halves the neo-human's I.S.P base. Any I.S.P. points over half are "spent" and cannot be regained until the transformation is over. Further more, every hour after the transformation, 2 I.S.P. are subtracted from the character's I.S.P. base, and cannot be regained until after the tranformation is over. When the I.S.P. base is utterly depleted, the transformation ends.
Example: Mentallia, a 6th level neo-human, has 312 I.S.P. She spends 37 I.S.P. on diverse powers during the course of a fight with an Arkhon cyborg (275 points remain). before she decides to undergo the transformation. This reduces her I.S.P base from 312 to 156 (of the 275 points she had, 119 are "lost"). She spends an additional 60 points in the fight (leaving her with 96 I.S.P) and after defeating the Arkhon cyborg, she remains super-charged for 2 more hours. During that time, her I.S.P. capacity is lowered by an additional 4 I.S.P., to 152; this does not affect her current I.S.P. (remains at 96), but even if she meditates, she can't regain more than 152 I.S.P. until the transformation power runs its full duration.

My question is, can the neo-human control the duration of his/her transformation? The line "She spends an additional 60 points in the fight (leaving her with 96 I.S.P) and after defeating the Arkhon cyborg, she remains super-charged for 2 more hours" seems to indicate that it was by choice she stayed transformed for 2 more hours, then willingly ended it. However, the next line "During that time, her I.S.P. capacity is lowered by an additional 4 I.S.P., to 152; this does not affect her current I.S.P. (remains at 96), but even if she meditates, she can't regain more than 152 I.S.P. until the transformation power runs its full duration" implies that he/she cannot.
Now, I've rolled up a first level neo-human who has 426 I.S.P. Using half to transform, that leaves him with 213 I.S.P. If he did nothing else psionicly, and could not end the duration voluntarily, that would make him stuck like that for 106.5 hours, or a little under 4 1/2 days (213 I.S.P./2 I.S.P. per hour).

I believe the neo-human should be able to choose, but others interpret it the other way. What say you?

[Kryzbyn]

Those of you that voted no, why? Am I missing something?

[Giant2005]

I voted yes for obvious reasons.

[runebeo]

They can cancel this ability at the end of each hour if not they would be drained of all I.S.P. in a few days which would make them useless. They need to expend 2 I.S.P. per hour, they can choose not to pay it. I think only Sixth sense is the only psi ability that gives you no choice in paying the cost. I have been playing a Neo-Human for nearly twelve years at I always played it ended at the end of the hour. Read the example she remained charged for 2 more hours, why wouldn't it not read full duration of 78 hours instead of 2 hours?

[Tiree]

I think there is also the rationality "Why not let it run out on it's own" thought process. It is not going to hurt to let it stay active if you already paid for it to be.

As with any ability (unless stated otherwise), I believe it can be canceled at any time - even in the middle of a fight. But even though the Math may argue in favor of canceling the power and reactivating the power, would anyone do so?

[Kryzbyn]

So I guess the concensus is they can dismiss it?

[NMI]

I voted yes for obvious reasons.

What are those obvious reasons?

[NMI]

I would say they could end the "transformation" whenever they wanted. Even if they spent the 2 ISP for an additional hour, they could/should be able to cancel the "transformation" sooner.

[Balabanto]

I voted Yes because the math is too complicated if the answer is no.

[Giant2005]

I voted yes for obvious reasons.

What are those obvious reasons?

Just the general mechanics of the game.
I can't think of a single ability/spell/psionic or anything really that states it cannot be cancelled by the user at will. I don't think this ability would be going against the rule and for good reason - it would be ridiculous for the most powerful psionic race around to not have control over one of their signiature abilities.

[Greg Diaczyk]

I voted No.

In my long running campaign we have a Neo-Human (almost level 12 now) and we ran into this very problem quite early in the campaign and after reviewed the text extensively and argued several perspective/interpretation of the rules we came to the following conclusion.

Once the Supernatural Transformation was activated he was locked into it until he burned through his ISP.

We observed/noted that the Neo-Human can choose to either be a power/control freak (TK, Pyrokinesis, Hypnotic Suggestion, etc.) or become a brawler (Supernatural Transformation). At first he can choose to remain a power/control freak (or jump into being a brawler) but when his ISP reaches that halfway mark he had to decided how he was going to finish the battle (and potentially start the next one...?).

The player saved the Supernatural Transformation as his reserve, except for a few occasions where he wanted to put the brunt of his power up first (in a duel and a couple one on one villain battles) and burned through his ISP pretty quickly.

If we was being conservative he'd use psionic powers but not invoke the Supernatural Transformation (and still have plenty of ISP for the next conflict and still regenerate ISP afterwards).

On a couple occasions, he had a bit of ISP left over after a battle, while still Supernaturally Transformed and he either let it ride its course (had like 4 ISP) or burned through the remainder by using healing or misc. other powers to get 0 ISP and end the transformation.

From our game experience these seemed to round out the character and make him interesting to play (he was a power house but had limitations). The other characters consisted of similar SDC creatures who could transform or had decent equipment (True Atlantean Demon Queller, True Atlantean Ley Line Walker, Swashbuckler with a suit of Power armor (you'll have to wait and see Underseas 2 for this one... ) and a few others who've come and gone over the years.

[Kryzbyn]

That makes sense, but conflicts with the "remains super charged for two more hours" comment in the example.

[MikelAmroni]

I voted No.
Once the Supernatural Transformation was activated he was locked into it until he burned through his ISP.
We observed/noted that the Neo-Human can choose to either be a power/control freak (TK, Pyrokinesis, Hypnotic Suggestion, etc.) or become a brawler (Supernatural Transformation). At first he can choose to remain a power/control freak (or jump into being a brawler) but when his ISP reaches that halfway mark he had to decided how he was going to finish the battle (and potentially start the next one...?).
On a couple occasions, he had a bit of ISP left over after a battle, while still Supernaturally Transformed and he either let it ride its course (had like 4 ISP) or burned through the remainder by using healing or misc. other powers to get 0 ISP and end the transformation.

It doesn't make sense that you'd have to nova (i.e. burn out) with a Neo-human just to use them. In Achilles they are used in a war situation quite often. Having them have to burn everything if they transform would be about the same as saying they had to empty their weapons of all rounds before they could stop firing. Its counter-intuitive and overly harsh. I understand Neo-humans are powerful, but this seems an artifically harsh, and completely against every other published power in the Rifts line that I can think of. I may be wrong, but I would doubt it. But to each their own I guess.

[runebeo]

I think for groups that see the Neo Human as too strong could use this to limit their powers to make them gel with a normal group better. I play my Neo Human that he tries to either hold off using his Transformation unless he's facing a great threat or sometimes my GM says that my character sixth sense often triggers the transformation out of instinct, which on at least two occasion has saved me from rolling up a new character. If your group allows the Neo Humans to control the duration of transformation because of the high cost of the ability is a good drawback and maybe adding a chance of addiction to being empowered could help in limiting their I.S.P. pool If the group considers them too much of a powerhouse. I think Neo Humans are the best race in all of Rifts, they possess great psionic powers, but it's their healing power that truly makes them an asset to any group and that's one thing that Rifts needs most is more healers that can heal more than a few M.D.C.s,

[Mouser13]

I voted No.
Main reason if you allow the person to end it. It become very abuseable.
Basiclly if you allow them to cancel it then no cost for the power has a long has the person cancel it for at least one action in a hour.

[Kryzbyn]

It only ever costs half of thier BASE ISP to use. They can't transform once an hour, unless they rolled incredibly low for ISP.

Can you regain 200+ ISP in one hour meditating?
Meditation allows for 10 I.S.P. per hour of meditation, unless stated otherwise in the OCC...I think 12 for Masters psychics.
So...with 426 ISP, you transform, costing you 213 isp...you fight for say 5 hours using no other psychic abilities (prolly not realistic, but hey), which uses another 10 ISP.
223/12 = 19 hours worth of nothing but meditation. At the most your gonna get one transformation per day, more likely every 2. And that's if they get to control it.
How is this abuseable?
I suppose technicly one could activate for 59 minutes costing half ISP, then activate it again for the other half for another hour...but this makes no sense...

[Mouser13]

It only ever costs half of thier BASE ISP to use. They can't transform once an hour, unless they rolled incredibly low for ISP.

Can you regain 200+ ISP in one hour meditating?
Meditation allows for 10 I.S.P. per hour of meditation, unless stated otherwise in the OCC...I think 12 for Masters psychics.
So...with 426 ISP, you transform, costing you 213 isp...you fight for say 5 hours using no other psychic abilities (prolly not realistic, but hey), which uses another 10 ISP.
223/12 = 19 hours worth of nothing but meditation. At the most your gonna get one transformation per day, more likely every 2. And that's if they get to control it.
How is this abuseable?
I suppose technicly one could activate for 59 minutes costing half ISP, then activate it again for the other half for another hour...but this makes no sense...

Well I think your assuming it has a cost I.S.P. equal to 1/2 or I.S.P base. Don't get me wrong if that how you want to play I'm fine with that. At least that is what I'm reading from your text.

It doesn't technically have to cost any I.S.P. If you are already below 1/2. Seen in example of the 275 points she had, 119 are "lost" part. It only costed her 119 because that is how much she is over the 1/2 the base of 156. if she was say at 100 I.S.P. already it would not have costed her anything.

Example:
Fight with a necromancer has force you to go into the supernatural transformation since your armor was destroyed.
1. Your Max ISP drops 213.
2. You use 30 in the battle more I.S.P. drop you to 183 current I.S.P.
3. You cancel the power after the battle.
4. Your Max ISP goes back up to 426. I'm assuming this is how all play it though their nothing in the power that ever says you get it back.
5. You meditate for a hour get 12 I.S.P bringing your total up to 195 I.S.P.
6. Your attacked by a second wave of troops. You activate your Supernatural transformation.
7. Your MAX ISP drops 213. Or current is still at 195.
8. Your got your Supernatural transformation for free no cost and bypassed the -2 per hour. Repeat the process and you got M.D.C. psionic. This is very abuseable. Since you are in effect getting something for nothing.

So from now on you keep it up 59 mins cancel it for one acton reactive it and your character is M.D.C. most of the time sure it at 1/2 I.S.P., but that still more then most mind melters will have.

[Kryzbyn]

It only ever costs half of thier BASE ISP to use. They can't transform once an hour, unless they rolled incredibly low for ISP.

Can you regain 200+ ISP in one hour meditating?
Meditation allows for 10 I.S.P. per hour of meditation, unless stated otherwise in the OCC...I think 12 for Masters psychics.
So...with 426 ISP, you transform, costing you 213 isp...you fight for say 5 hours using no other psychic abilities (prolly not realistic, but hey), which uses another 10 ISP.
223/12 = 19 hours worth of nothing but meditation. At the most your gonna get one transformation per day, more likely every 2. And that's if they get to control it.
How is this abuseable?
I suppose technicly one could activate for 59 minutes costing half ISP, then activate it again for the other half for another hour...but this makes no sense...

Well I think your assuming it has a cost I.S.P. equal to 1/2 or I.S.P base. Don't get me wrong if that how you want to play I'm fine with that. At least that is what I'm reading from your text.

It doesn't technically have to cost any I.S.P. If you are already below 1/2. Seen in example of the 275 points she had, 119 are "lost" part. It only costed her 119 because that is how much she is over the 1/2 the base of 156. if she was say at 100 I.S.P. already it would not have costed her anything.

Example:
Fight with a necromancer has force you to go into the supernatural transformation since your armor was destroyed.
1. Your Max ISP drops 213.
2. You use 30 in the battle more I.S.P. drop you to 183 current I.S.P.
3. You cancel the power after the battle.
4. Your Max ISP goes back up to 426. I'm assuming this is how all play it though their nothing in the power that ever says you get it back.
5. You meditate for a hour get 12 I.S.P bringing your total up to 195 I.S.P.
6. Your attacked by a second wave of troops. You activate your Supernatural transformation.
7. Your MAX ISP drops 213. Or current is still at 195.
8. Your got your Supernatural transformation for free no cost and bypassed the -2 per hour. Repeat the process and you got M.D.C. psionic. This is very abuseable. Since you are in effect getting something for nothing.

So from now on you keep it up 59 mins cancel it for one acton reactive it and your character is M.D.C. most of the time sure it at 1/2 I.S.P., but that still more then most mind melters will have.

Whoa you lost me.
But my example is how I understand the power to work...and thats how i'd play it.
It costs half your full isp base to activate, and you can't activate it again until you have that much back.
I burn 213 to activate it, use another 100...i'd have to med to get 313 + 2 per hour it was active ISP back before i could use it again.

That cool?

[Mouser13]

We can talk, but the seems fine by me.

[runebeo]

I don't think you can pay half of one or zero. You must have 2 P.P.E. to transform or you could just keep charging endlessly after it wares off.

[Kryzbyn]

Whoa you lost me.
But my example is how I understand the power to work...and thats how i'd play it.
It costs half your full isp base to activate, and you can't activate it again until you have that much back.
I burn 213 to activate it, use another 100...i'd have to med to get 313 + 2 per hour it was active ISP back before i could use it again.

That cool?

The power as written states that it costs nothing to transform. There is no actual ISP cost unless you maintain the power for over 1 hour.

When you transform your base (or maximum) ISP is reduced by half. However it is not actually spent. The example for how the power is used states, in no unclear terms, if your current ISP is higher than half your maximum ISP the difference is "lost" while the power is active.

Meaning if you have 400 ISP maximum, while transformed you only have access to 200 ISP. If during a battle you spend 25 ISP prior to transforming once the transformation is used you still have access to 200 ISP (not 175).

It says that the 175 ISP in excess of your new maximum of 200 (in effect ISP points 201-375) are "lost" while transformed, and return immediately upon the transformation ending.

Thus: I take 1 action to transform. My ISP maximum drops from 400 to 200, my current ISP becomes 200. 59 minutes later I turn off the power. My maximum ISP returns to 400, and since I haven't expended any ISP since I transformed my current ISP resets to 400 also. Repeat ad infinitum.

You lose 1/2 the ISP base when you transform. They cannot be used while tranformed. I'd cal lthat spent.
As written it says the ISP can not be regained until the transformation is over. Not refilled, regained. Which implies to me it has to be med'ed back or through rest at normal rates, like any other "spent" ISP, not just POOF its over you get 1/2 yur ISP back.

[Tiree]

You lose 1/2 the ISP base when you transform. They cannot be used while tranformed. I'd cal lthat spent.
As written it says the ISP can not be regained until the transformation is over. Not refilled, regained. Which implies to me it has to be med'ed back or through rest at normal rates, like any other "spent" ISP, not just POOF its over you get 1/2 yur ISP back.

I have always used this ruling in my games. But the way it is written, as long as you have 2 ISP you can transform. Because you can't split 1 in half, so the minimum is 2. Of course if your that low in ISP you are pretty much suckin' it anyways. So if you had 400 and only transformed and shut off, you can transform roughly 9 times, barring any rest or continuing the transformation for 2 ISP (and rounding up in favor of player)

[Kryzbyn]

I always saw it as "regular price, 4 bucks, 4 bucks, 4 bucks" meaning you can't transform unless the initial pool is split, then its 2 to maintain per hour beyond the first, not 2 ISP to transform. But I must be the odd man out

[sennin]

Here's the thing:

In the example, the Neo-Human has a base of 312 ISP. Before transforming they use 37 ISP, leaving 275. After they transform they have 156 ISP, which is half of their base. If the power costs half of their base to use, they would have had 119 ISP. Do they regain any ISP they had over half their base once they end the transformation? It doesn't specifically say. I would say no. So, when they activate the power, their base ISP is cut in half, and they lose any ISP they had over that amount. The activation does not really have a cost per se.

[Library Ogre]

Wow. That is a horridly-worded power.

My new rule: Every use of it requires 100 ISP, which cannot be regained until the transformation is over. The transformation itself lasts 1 hour, and costs another 100 ISP per additional hour, which also cannot be regained until the transformation is over. Once the transformation ends, you must rest long enough to regain 100 ISP in order to transform again, even if you still have more than 100 points.

[Kryzbyn]

Here's the thing:

In the example, the Neo-Human has a base of 312 ISP. Before transforming they use 37 ISP, leaving 275. After they transform they have 156 ISP, which is half of their base. If the power costs half of their base to use, they would have had 119 ISP. Do they regain any ISP they had over half their base once they end the transformation? It doesn't specifically say. I would say no. So, when they activate the power, their base ISP is cut in half, and they lose any ISP they had over that amount. The activation does not really have a cost per se.

The problem is that this way of running the Neo-human is also broken.

Using your method, I can be an MDC creature 100% of the time, indefinitely as long as I have access to my ISP. In fact if you allow the power to be turned off and don't charge an actual amount (such as what Mark Hall is doing) a Neo-human can maintain its MDC form for 23 hours 58 minutes and 48 seconds a day 365 days a year infinitely.

It works this way:

Mentallia has 400 ISP (I'm using this only because it makes math easier). If I have used zero ISP before transforming the power costs me 200, if I have used 150 ISP it costs me 50, and if I have used 200 ISP it costs me ZERO ISP to transform.

As Mentallia's player I decide that having 200 ISP isn't much of a price to pay for my character to be an MDC creature.

I can maintain the power all day, by turning it off and then on again once an hour. And since the rules don't say that you can't maintain the power while sleeping I have Mentallia spend the 16 ISP needed to stay an MDC creature while she sleeps 8 hours.

So my daily routine is:

1) Wake up (base ISP is 184, current ISP is 184)
2) Turn the power off (Base ISP returns to 400)
3) Turn the power back on (Base ISP becomes 200)
4) Meditate for 1 hour; gain 12 ISP (Base ISP is 200, current ISP is 196)
5) Turn Power off (Base ISP returns to 400, current ISP is 196)
6) Turn Power on (Base ISP becomes 200 again, current ISP is 196)
7) Meditate for 1 hour; gain 12 ISP (Base ISP is 200, current ISP is 200)
Turn the power off (Base ISP returns to 400, current ISP is 200)
9) Turn the power back on (Base ISP becomes 200, current ISP is 200)
Repeat steps 8 and 9 every 59 minutes and 54 seconds for next 16 hours.
Maintain power while sleeping.

I don't get where u think it says POOF you get 1/2 your ISP back when the power ends. Its says it can not be regained until it ends not POOF you get it all back instantly.

[Balabanto]

Mark Hall's rule for Neo Humans will now apply in my game. There's no way I can allow this rabid cheese to infect more dairy masses.

[sennin]

Here's the thing:

In the example, the Neo-Human has a base of 312 ISP. Before transforming they use 37 ISP, leaving 275. After they transform they have 156 ISP, which is half of their base. If the power costs half of their base to use, they would have had 119 ISP. Do they regain any ISP they had over half their base once they end the transformation? It doesn't specifically say. I would say no. So, when they activate the power, their base ISP is cut in half, and they lose any ISP they had over that amount. The activation does not really have a cost per se.

The problem is that this way of running the Neo-human is also broken.

Using your method, I can be an MDC creature 100% of the time, indefinitely as long as I have access to my ISP. In fact if you allow the power to be turned off and don't charge an actual amount (such as what Mark Hall is doing) a Neo-human can maintain its MDC form for 23 hours 58 minutes and 48 seconds a day 365 days a year infinitely.

It works this way:

Mentallia has 400 ISP (I'm using this only because it makes math easier). If I have used zero ISP before transforming the power costs me 200, if I have used 150 ISP it costs me 50, and if I have used 200 ISP it costs me ZERO ISP to transform.

As Mentallia's player I decide that having 200 ISP isn't much of a price to pay for my character to be an MDC creature.

I can maintain the power all day, by turning it off and then on again once an hour. And since the rules don't say that you can't maintain the power while sleeping I have Mentallia spend the 16 ISP needed to stay an MDC creature while she sleeps 8 hours.

So my daily routine is:

1. Wake up (base ISP is 184, current ISP is 184)
2. Turn the power off (Base ISP returns to 400)
3. Turn the power back on (Base ISP becomes 200)
4. Meditate for 1 hour; gain 12 ISP (Base ISP is 200, current ISP is 196)
5. Turn Power off (Base ISP returns to 400, current ISP is 196)
6. Turn Power on (Base ISP becomes 200 again, current ISP is 196)
7. Meditate for 1 hour; gain 12 ISP (Base ISP is 200, current ISP is 200)
8. Turn the power off (Base ISP returns to 400, current ISP is 200)
9. Turn the power back on (Base ISP becomes 200, current ISP is 200)
Repeat steps 8 and 9 every 59 minutes and 54 seconds for next 16 hours.
Maintain power while sleeping.

I was just clarifying the example. I actually think that Mark's fix is fair. I have actually never run into any problems with a Neo-Human because the people I normally game with generally prefer lower power character. Heck, I even started to make a neo-human the other night but didn't finish the character because I knew I probably wouldn't have much fun with it.

[Kryzbyn]

I don't get where u think it says POOF you get 1/2 your ISP back when the power ends. Its says it can not be regained until it ends not POOF you get it all back instantly.

You aparently didn't read what I wrote.

According to the book, and YOUR original post, using the MDC transformation power does not actually cost ISP. Instead it reduces your BASE ISP, by half and it only effects your current ISP if that number exceeds your base.

Thus a Neo-human with 400 base ISP who uses the MDC transformation power reduces his base to 200. If his current ISP total is 200 when he transforms it stays at 200.

Please reread what I last wrote. I never said that the character gains back any actual ISP. I said that his base returned to 400, but his current stayed the same.

Therefor a Neo-Human who doesn't mind having only 200 or so ISP, and doesn't use any psionic powers can be an MDC creature FOREVER.

Where does it say when the trnsformation is over, the base automaticly returns to the full amount, is what I was asking.

[runebeo]

They main problem I have with the race is that the I.S.P. pool is 1D4X100 that could really screw over a character with a low roll during creation, wouldn't 6D6X10 or M.E. X 15 be more balanced.

[Kryzbyn]

Where does it say when the trnsformation is over, the base automaticly returns to the full amount, is what I was asking.

Sorry Kryzbyn, I guess its a matter of understanding my use of terminology.

A character's base ISP is the maximum ISP capacity of the character.
A character's current ISP is the amount of ISP they have at the moment.

When a character has full ISP their current ISP is equal to their base ISP.

In the example it says: "During that time, her I.S.P. capacity is lowered by an additional 4 I.S.P., to 152; this does not affect her current I.S.P. (remains at 96), but even if she meditates, she can't regain more than 152 I.S.P. until the transformation power runs its full duration."

This line in particular refers to the fact that during the transformation the character's base is lowered, not current. And the end of the sentence refers to the fact that even though during the transformation the character has only 152 ISP that once it ends she can meditate so that her current ISP increases above that mark.

Meditation does not effect your base ISP only your current ISP. So if the character's base ISP did not reset after the transformation ended that would mean that those ISP points had been spent permanently and would never be recoverable.

LOL
I understand the difference between current and Base ISP. I understand that the BASE isp, or half of which, is what's "spent" when a ANH transforms. I also understand that while transformed, he can not meditate past half of his base or current base untill the tranforamtion is over.
What I'm saying is, to my understanding, the base may increase back up to full, but the current ISP stays the same, and you have to med to fill back up to your full base. Your current ISP at the end of the transformation doesn't suddenly increase by what you "spent" when you end the transformation, meaning you have to meditate to get all of it back.
EDIT: If you're saying that one could keep doing half of half of half ad nauseum to keep himself transformed, I think that's an awful munchkin-y interpretation and isn't the spirit of what was intended at all.

[Kryzbyn]

LOL
I understand the difference between current and Base ISP. I understand that the BASE isp, or half of which, is what's "spent" when a ANH transforms. I also understand that while transformed, he can not meditate past half of his base or current base untill the tranforamtion is over.
What I'm saying is, to my understanding, the base may increase back up to full, but the current ISP stays the same, and you have to med to fill back up to your full base. Your current ISP at the end of the transformation doesn't suddenly increase by what you "spent" when you end the transformation, meaning you have to meditate to get all of it back.
EDIT: If you're saying that one could keep doing half of half of half ad nauseum to keep himself transformed, I think that's an awful munchkin-y interpretation and isn't the spirit of what was intended at all.

OK, hold on a sec.

If all you do to activate the power is cut your base ISP in half (which is what you and the entry in the book said) then there is no "half of half of half ad nauseum". Your character's current ISP never drops unless it was above half of your base prior to the transformation, or you stay transformed for more than an hour.

Let me see if I can try to explain this differently from before so that it is more understandable.

• My base ISP is 400. My current ISP is also 400.
• I transform. My base drops to 200. My current drops to 200 also.
• I wait 59 minutes, during which time I spend zero ISP.
• I turn the transformation off. My base ISP returns to 400. My current ISP remains at 200.
  
• 10 seconds later transform again. My base drops back to 200. But my current ISP REMAINS at 200.

I can repeat this process all day, and my current ISP never drops below 200.

Do you understand now?

Yeah I do get it. I'm saying that's probably was not what was intended. I think one should have to med back the 200 as a timer between transformations, imho.
But technicly as written that is correct, and yeah, that's way broken.

[Kryzbyn]

Yeah I do get it. I'm saying that's probably was not what was intended. I think one should have to med back the 200 as a timer between transformations, imho.
But technicly as written that is correct, and yeah, that's way broken.

If thats how you wish to handle it, I guess it works. But (sorry devils advocate) in this case (using your 20 hours of meditation rule) would I be able to transform if I only have 350 current ISP? What about 200? Or 37?

I actually think that Mark Hall's solution of giving it a cost (even if you don't agree with the exact amount he has it cost) is the best way to handle the Neo-Human.

Using my rule you could transform anytime you have half your base available. In your example, that cost would laways be 200 ISP, no less.
You have 400 isp, you transform, 200 is gone. U use another 50 isp in the battle. You choose not to spend 2 isp to keep it going, so it ends. Let's say you've meditated back the 50 beyond half you spent, but you are attacked again. You can transform again (cost is 1/2 base ISP, and youve got 200 back) but if you transformed again it would leave you with no ISP and you'd only be transformed for an hour. Conversly, you can med up further or all the way back up to 400 again, then do it, and have some ISP to use as well. Or, If youre expecting the other attack within 10 hours, spend 20 isp to continue your origional transformation.
Difficult choice to make, but for that kind of power...
But, yeah Mark's idea is the best, or even limiting it to once/day would be acceptable.

[runebeo]

Turning into a supernatural being with 3 to 4 hundred M.D.C.s & low supernatural strength is a nice ability, but compared to all the naturally M.D.C. races & monsters on Rifts Earth this don't seem like a really big deal to me. I think half of the I.S.P. pool at the moment is the best way to go with them. I like to think of them as being the next level of human evolution and in Rifts you need to tough guy to hold the mantle of being a young god.

[runebeo]

Turning into a supernatural being with 3 to 4 hundred M.D.C.s & low supernatural strength is a nice ability, but compared to all the naturally M.D.C. races & monsters on Rifts Earth this don't seem like a really big deal to me. I think half of the I.S.P. pool at the moment is the best way to go with them. I like to think of them as being the next level of human evolution and in Rifts you need to tough guy to hold the mantle of being a young god.

Ok, so what do you think of a character with 3 to 4 hundred MDC, low supernatural strength, the ability to heal more damage than any other race or class in the game, Hundreds of ISP, and massive amounts of psionic abilities including a fair selection of super abilities.

I think that THAT is broken powerful.

Well I think it's well put together. After all their named after one of mythology greatest warriors.