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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2020 3:23 pm
  

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Virtuoso of Variants

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Comment: "Your inferiority complex might be justified."
taalismn wrote:
"'W.P. String Cheese'? Seriously?"
"Well, at least in this game we're more likely to encounter cheese than Davy Crockett nuclear mortars."
"..I LIKED that skill. It had attitude."


(Actually, if you ever read any of the Samurai Cat series, one of his first crossover adventures involves a strangler who uses goat string cheese)
That is a skill which could actually be applied to a game though.

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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2020 3:51 pm
  

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Stone Gargoyle wrote:


(Actually, if you ever read any of the Samurai Cat series, one of his first crossover adventures involves a strangler who uses goat string cheese)
That is a skill which could actually be applied to a game though.[/quote]


W.P. String Cheese* or W.P. Tactical Nuclear Mortar(which would probably fall under Heavy Megadamage Weapons or Weapons Systems anyway)?

(*Bonus damage points if the victim is lactose-intolerant?)

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 5:47 pm
  

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Virtuoso of Variants

Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:18 pm
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Location: Lurking on rooftops like a proper gargoyle should, in and around Tacoma, WA.
Comment: "Your inferiority complex might be justified."
This is why you don't see me writing up silly WP skills right and left. Much of what would be written is redundant.

_________________
"SG, you are a limitless fountain of Butt-Saving Advice. You Rock, Stone and Concrete." ~ TrumbachD
http://wiki.thedeificnmi.com/index.php?title=Main_Page


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:41 am
  

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Stone Gargoyle wrote:
This is why you don't see me writing up silly WP skills right and left. Much of what would be written is redundant.


SG the GM: "Okay...*sigh*....that's the fifth time you've killed somebody with a pretzel, Brad, and the other players are getting sick and tired of it. New house rule: use of 'W.P. Pretzel' does NOT gain you any exp. ANNNDDD before you ask, that also applies to 'W.P. Bubble Gum' and 'W.P. Cheetos'."

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 1:06 pm
  

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Virtuoso of Variants

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Location: Lurking on rooftops like a proper gargoyle should, in and around Tacoma, WA.
Comment: "Your inferiority complex might be justified."
taalismn wrote:
SG the GM: "Okay...*sigh*....that's the fifth time you've killed somebody with a pretzel, Brad, and the other players are getting sick and tired of it. New house rule: use of 'W.P. Pretzel' does NOT gain you any exp. ANNNDDD before you ask, that also applies to 'W.P. Bubble Gum' and 'W.P. Cheetos'."
You've been spying on my games again, haven't you?

_________________
"SG, you are a limitless fountain of Butt-Saving Advice. You Rock, Stone and Concrete." ~ TrumbachD
http://wiki.thedeificnmi.com/index.php?title=Main_Page


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 1:32 pm
  

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Monk

Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2000 1:01 am
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If you are going there...there is a whole MAF based on fighting with raman noodles in the Ramna 1/2 anime series.... :|

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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 3:57 pm
  

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Virtuoso of Variants

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Location: Lurking on rooftops like a proper gargoyle should, in and around Tacoma, WA.
Comment: "Your inferiority complex might be justified."
WP Pretzel got me to wondering whether there is a skill for using curved two-ended blades such as a bat'leth. It combines elements of a sword and a staff, so I was wondering how you would handle such a weapon in a game.

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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 8:03 pm
  

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Monk

Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2000 1:01 am
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Location: Eastvale, calif
My favorate custum WP to add onto a char is WP Frying pan.

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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 9:31 pm
  

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drewkitty ~..~ wrote:
If you are going there...there is a whole MAF based on fighting with raman noodles in the Ramna 1/2 anime series.... :|


The fan fiction/fanon for R1/2 has yielded an INSANE variety of martial arts and W.P.s.*..When creating new martial arts forms, I bear that in mind.

*Including Martial Arts Junk Food(which actually does use Cheetos as a weapon), Netsurfing, Apathy, Flatulence, Accounting, Construction, Hairdressing, Performance Art, etc....
But as I've stated earlier, the Hoka series of sci-fi stories actually has an alien culture that uses giant tiddlywinks as weapons...only they're manhole cover sized and made of heavy bronze.

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 4:19 pm
  

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Virtuoso of Variants

Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:18 pm
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Location: Lurking on rooftops like a proper gargoyle should, in and around Tacoma, WA.
Comment: "Your inferiority complex might be justified."
drewkitty ~..~ wrote:
My favorate custum WP to add onto a char is WP Frying pan.
WP Blunt pretty much covers this though.

_________________
"SG, you are a limitless fountain of Butt-Saving Advice. You Rock, Stone and Concrete." ~ TrumbachD
http://wiki.thedeificnmi.com/index.php?title=Main_Page


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 7:44 pm
  

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Hero

Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2001 1:01 am
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Location: auburn
Stone Gargoyle wrote:
drewkitty ~..~ wrote:
My favorate custum WP to add onto a char is WP Frying pan.
WP Blunt pretty much covers this though.

As does w.p. Utensils

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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 7:53 pm
  

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Virtuoso of Variants

Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:18 pm
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Location: Lurking on rooftops like a proper gargoyle should, in and around Tacoma, WA.
Comment: "Your inferiority complex might be justified."
abe wrote:
Stone Gargoyle wrote:
drewkitty ~..~ wrote:
My favorate custum WP to add onto a char is WP Frying pan.
WP Blunt pretty much covers this though.

As does w.p. Utensils

Never heard of it.

_________________
"SG, you are a limitless fountain of Butt-Saving Advice. You Rock, Stone and Concrete." ~ TrumbachD
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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 10:17 pm
  

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Hero

Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2001 1:01 am
Posts: 1043
Location: auburn
Stone Gargoyle wrote:
abe wrote:
Stone Gargoyle wrote:
drewkitty ~..~ wrote:
My favorate custum WP to add onto a char is WP Frying pan.
WP Blunt pretty much covers this though.

As does w.p. Utensils

Never heard of it.

I believe it’s in rifter #22? I know it’s in the article on cooking mags-damage creatures.


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 3:47 pm
  

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Virtuoso of Variants

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Comment: "Your inferiority complex might be justified."
abe wrote:
I believe it’s in rifter #22? I know it’s in the article on cooking mags-damage creatures.
I'll have to try and locate a copy of Rifter #22.

_________________
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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 5:03 pm
  

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Hero

Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2001 1:01 am
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Location: auburn
Stone Gargoyle wrote:
abe wrote:
I believe it’s in rifter #22? I know it’s in the article on cooking mags-damage creatures.
I'll have to try and locate a copy of Rifter #22.

You can get a copy via amazon.com if it helps.

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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 3:27 pm
  

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Virtuoso of Variants

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Location: Lurking on rooftops like a proper gargoyle should, in and around Tacoma, WA.
Comment: "Your inferiority complex might be justified."
abe wrote:
Stone Gargoyle wrote:
abe wrote:
I believe it’s in rifter #22? I know it’s in the article on cooking mags-damage creatures.
I'll have to try and locate a copy of Rifter #22.

You can get a copy via amazon.com if it helps.
Oh, it helps.

_________________
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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 7:51 pm
  

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Actually, it's Rifter #32, not 22.

You should also be able to find it in PDF format through locations like DriveThruRPG.

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:52 pm
  

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Hero

Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2001 1:01 am
Posts: 1043
Location: auburn
At least I got the article correct


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 12:52 pm
  

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Virtuoso of Variants

Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:18 pm
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Location: Lurking on rooftops like a proper gargoyle should, in and around Tacoma, WA.
Comment: "Your inferiority complex might be justified."
taalismn wrote:
Actually, it's Rifter #32, not 22.

You should also be able to find it in PDF format through locations like DriveThruRPG.
Thanks T. I might buy the PDF and the paper copy depending on my funds.

_________________
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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:42 am
  

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D-Bee

Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:48 pm
Posts: 26
Hey I was checking out the Netbook of Skills and saw Nanotechnology and Nanomanufacturing under the Mechanical skills. Are those official skills in one of the books or are they just fan-creations?

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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 10:11 pm
  

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syntheticlife4m wrote:
Hey I was checking out the Netbook of Skills and saw Nanotechnology and Nanomanufacturing under the Mechanical skills. Are those official skills in one of the books or are they just fan-creations?


I'd have said Splicers, but only the Technojackers would have this skill and for them it's instinctual....but a check of the book shows only 'Machine Technology', so it's fan-creation.

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sun Mar 22, 2020 2:22 am
  

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Hero

Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2001 1:01 am
Posts: 1043
Location: auburn
Throwing your voice (I cannot spell the actual name if my life depends on it)
It’s pretty much what it said it is.
Chance of success:25+pp+4% per level.


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sun Mar 22, 2020 8:26 pm
  

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abe wrote:
Throwing your voice (I cannot spell the actual name if my life depends on it)
It’s pretty much what it said it is.
Chance of success:25+pp+4% per level.



Ventriloquism.
It's been done.
First appeared, to the best of my knowledge, in the Robotech adventure module 'Ghost Ship'.. then System Failure and the Rifts Game Master Guide.
Skill proficiency is 16%+4% per level of experience.
Physical Prowess has NOTHING to do with it(Ventriloquists are not known as Olympic-grade gymnasts or physical acrobats).

And if you do try to describe something that you know has a better name for it, do some online research to find the proper spelling(it helps with working in the rest of it). You never know; your life MAY depend on it.

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Wed May 13, 2020 5:42 pm
  

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Hero

Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2001 1:01 am
Posts: 1043
Location: auburn
Recycling lore:you can recognize recyclable metals, glass & plastics so that you can get maximum profit from recycling centers as well as know which centers pay the most money for the respective materials.
Chance of success is 32 +iq% + 7% per level


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Wed May 13, 2020 9:22 pm
  

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abe wrote:
Recycling lore:you can recognize recyclable metals, glass & plastics so that you can get maximum profit from recycling centers as well as know which centers pay the most money for the respective materials.
Chance of success is 32 +iq% + 7% per level


Recycling appears as a Technical skill in Rifts Ultimate Edition, Rifts Game Master Guide, Beyond the Supernatural, Mutants in Orbit, and Chaos Earth. 30%+5% per level of experience.
I wouldn't consider it to have a 'lore 'aspect for finding centers that offer the most because a little bit of research(yellow pages, internet, local chamber of commerce) will let you find the going rates for metals, local recycling centers, or what scrapyards are offering for materials. Blackmarket/borderline legal/ knowingly Illegal(like stolen copper wiring or swiped silverware) reclamation, I'd consider to be 'Streetwise'.

Managing a successful recycling/salvage business would be a package deal of Recycle, Salvage, Research, Bartering, Business & Finance skills. The average street person could get by with Recycling and Streetwise.

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sat May 23, 2020 7:31 am
  

Explorer

Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 7:48 am
Posts: 186
Apologies if this has been mentioned. I tried search but couldn't find it.

Here's some Weapons Proficiencies. Other than a +1 to their use I'm not sure if they should have any other bonuses or penalties.

W.P. Lever Action Rifle
W.P. Revolver Rifle.
W.P. Volley Gun Pistol (Black Powder)
W.P. Volley Gun Rifle (Black Powder)
W.P. Volley Gun Heavy (Mitrailleuse)
(Black Poweder version Ribauldequin seperate skill)
W.P. Crank Guns (Gatling style guns/Agar gun) (Black Powder version separate skill/Puckle Gun)
W.P. Organ Gun (Nordenfelt gun)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt%27s_ ... ving_rifle
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lever_action
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordenfelt_gun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ribauldequin
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volley_gun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agar_gun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gardner_gun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gatling_gun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitrailleuse
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puckle_gun


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sat May 23, 2020 1:37 pm
  

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Virtuoso of Variants

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Location: Lurking on rooftops like a proper gargoyle should, in and around Tacoma, WA.
Comment: "Your inferiority complex might be justified."
Sambot wrote:
Apologies if this has been mentioned. I tried search but couldn't find it.

Here's some Weapons Proficiencies. Other than a +1 to their use I'm not sure if they should have any other bonuses or penalties.

W.P. Lever Action Rifle
W.P. Revolver Rifle.
W.P. Volley Gun Pistol (Black Powder)
W.P. Volley Gun Rifle (Black Powder)
W.P. Volley Gun Heavy (Mitrailleuse)
(Black Poweder version Ribauldequin seperate skill)
W.P. Crank Guns (Gatling style guns/Agar gun) (Black Powder version separate skill/Puckle Gun)
W.P. Organ Gun (Nordenfelt gun)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt%27s_ ... ving_rifle
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lever_action
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordenfelt_gun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ribauldequin
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volley_gun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agar_gun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gardner_gun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gatling_gun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitrailleuse
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puckle_gun
A gun is a gun. I've always felt that the need to itemize them by type is unnecessary.

_________________
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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sat May 23, 2020 8:36 pm
  

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Stone Gargoyle wrote:
A gun is a gun. I've always felt that the need to itemize them by type is unnecessary.[/quote]

I agree...and many of them fall under the existing Black Powder W.P.
Larger weapons like the crank guns, I'd rule fall under W.P. Heavy.
In fact the best way to go about this, if you were creating, say, a U.S. Civil War character trained to use Mister Gatling's creation, would be to allow it as W.P. Heavy Weapons with the stipulation that it applies only to period weapons(so the character, if somehow transported in time, couldn't service/operate a 1917 Browning .50 caliber machine gun with the same proficiency unless they retrained on the more modern weapon).

Servicing all of them, I'd rule, could be covered by the Gunsmith or Armorer skill.

Still, I'll give Sambot credit for your historical research

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 9:08 am
  

Explorer

Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 7:48 am
Posts: 186
taalismn wrote:
Stone Gargoyle wrote:
A gun is a gun. I've always felt that the need to itemize them by type is unnecessary.


I agree...and many of them fall under the existing Black Powder W.P.
Larger weapons like the crank guns, I'd rule fall under W.P. Heavy.
In fact the best way to go about this, if you were creating, say, a U.S. Civil War character trained to use Mister Gatling's creation, would be to allow it as W.P. Heavy Weapons with the stipulation that it applies only to period weapons(so the character, if somehow transported in time, couldn't service/operate a 1917 Browning .50 caliber machine gun with the same proficiency unless they retrained on the more modern weapon).

Servicing all of them, I'd rule, could be covered by the Gunsmith or Armorer skill.

Still, I'll give Sambot credit for your historical research[/quote]

Thanks. :)

I know its kind of easy to pick up a gun and shoot it but how they operate and reload can vary wildly. And since we have different skills for different types of rifles and pistols I figured, "Why not?" for some. For others I had considered using W.P. Heavy Weapons but its kind of generic for me since it includes everything. Maybe W.P. Machine Gun and then treat it like you said by making it era specific. Kind of like other skills such as photography and computers.

I had forgotten this video so I guess the Mitrailleuse would work under Machine Gun along with Gatling style guns, Argar Gun and Nordenfelt gun
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wApeDr6-Bdo

I would think that the Puckle Gun and Ribauldequin would need a knowledge of Black Powder and machine guns though as the others aren't just black powder. Although do to their age one couldn't necessarily operate the other without some training.

I'm still wondering about a skill for Volley Guns as they're designed to fire multiple rounds at once, and usually so the rounds spread out. Pepper-boxes though rotate their barrels but still fire straight ahead. I kind of wonder if they should have a skill too since they're more complicated. That or it takes longer for them to become completely proficient with that type.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volley_gun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pepper-box

I'd also submit W.P. Pistol-Sword. or Axe. Think Captain Harlock.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pistol_sword


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 2:01 pm
  

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Virtuoso of Variants

Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:18 pm
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Location: Lurking on rooftops like a proper gargoyle should, in and around Tacoma, WA.
Comment: "Your inferiority complex might be justified."
taalismn wrote:
Stone Gargoyle wrote:
A gun is a gun. I've always felt that the need to itemize them by type is unnecessary.


I agree...and many of them fall under the existing Black Powder W.P.
Larger weapons like the crank guns, I'd rule fall under W.P. Heavy.
In fact the best way to go about this, if you were creating, say, a U.S. Civil War character trained to use Mister Gatling's creation, would be to allow it as W.P. Heavy Weapons with the stipulation that it applies only to period weapons(so the character, if somehow transported in time, couldn't service/operate a 1917 Browning .50 caliber machine gun with the same proficiency unless they retrained on the more modern weapon).

Servicing all of them, I'd rule, could be covered by the Gunsmith or Armorer skill.

Still, I'll give Sambot credit for your historical research
I did not mean to ignore the importance of research at all. Can we organize his list by the WP types you mention? That would be helpful.

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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 2:07 pm
  

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Sambot wrote:
I'd also submit W.P. Pistol-Sword. or Axe. Think Captain Harlock.
Gunblades use whichever WP is applicable to the use you are putting it to, either WP Sword or WP pistol, the same way you handle rifles with bayonets.

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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 9:13 pm
  

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Sambot wrote:
[

I'm still wondering about a skill for Volley Guns as they're designed to fire multiple rounds at once, and usually so the rounds spread out. Pepper-boxes though rotate their barrels but still fire straight ahead. I kind of wonder if they should have a skill too since they're more complicated. That or it takes longer for them to become completely proficient with that type.


I don't think there's any skill involved with the volley guns, except in the servicing.
The general idea is 'get as much lead flying towards the mass of enemy troops as possible and hope more rounds hit than miss'. If it were a skill, it would start out as the equivalent of shooting a burst, or even 'spray and pray' shooting wild, with the further penalty that you can't 'walk' the stream of fire up into or over your target.
Remember, these weapons were designed to counter the then-standard tactic of compensating for single-shot infantry weapons by massing as many troops as you could in a single group and volley-blasting away at your opponent.

If anything, effective use of volley-guns would come under Tactics.

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sun May 31, 2020 7:28 pm
  

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Stone Gargoyle wrote:
taalismn wrote:
Stone Gargoyle wrote:
I did not mean to ignore the importance of research at all. Can we organize his list by the WP types you mention? That would be helpful.


That's okay. I tried to organize the list a bit better.

W.P. Lever Action Rifle (uses a lever to reload. Winchester)
W.P. Revolver Rifle. (Rifle version of Pistol Skill Colt Model 1855 Revolving Carbine)
W.P. Pepper-box Pistol (Similar to Revolver only the barrels move)
W.P. Pepper-box Rifle (Rifle version of above)
W.P. Volley Gun (heavy Black powder weapon on a cart with multiple barrels. Ribauldequin)
W.P. Crank Guns (heavy weapon usually mounted on a cart or tripod. Uses a hand crank or lever to fire the weapon. Gatling style guns/Agar gun/Mitrailleuse, Nordenfelt gun. the weapons can be single or multiple barrel.) W.P. Machine Gun or W.P. Heavy could be used instead to use these weapons if in that time period or taken again for these older weapon.
W.P. Black Powder Crank Guns (older version of above uses black powder/Puckle Gun)

I dropped most of the volley guns but I think there should be a note about weapons firing multiple barrels at the same time, including double barrel shotguns. The recoil would be a real pain.

I'm still not sure about using the Machine Gun skill for the cranked guns like the Gatling. Using it for older machine guns would seem to fit fully automatic weapons like the Maxim Gun which was in service at the same time at the Gatling Gun. It doesn't seem to fit the Crank fired weapons as they operate differently. Maybe the W.P. Heavy would be better?

W.P. Gunblades (a combination melee weapon and firearm. WP vary but this skill would allow the character to use the weapon without penalties. The weight of the blade would throw off the aim and such like hitting the trigger accidentally. I know bayonets were mentioned but W.P. Rifle doesn't mean one can use it as it turns the Rifle into a melee weapon. Being able to use a knife doesn't mean a rifle can be used either. You'd need both.



taalismn wrote:
Sambot wrote:
[

I'm still wondering about a skill for Volley Guns as they're designed to fire multiple rounds at once, and usually so the rounds spread out. Pepper-boxes though rotate their barrels but still fire straight ahead. I kind of wonder if they should have a skill too since they're more complicated. That or it takes longer for them to become completely proficient with that type.


I don't think there's any skill involved with the volley guns, except in the servicing.
The general idea is 'get as much lead flying towards the mass of enemy troops as possible and hope more rounds hit than miss'. If it were a skill, it would start out as the equivalent of shooting a burst, or even 'spray and pray' shooting wild, with the further penalty that you can't 'walk' the stream of fire up into or over your target.
Remember, these weapons were designed to counter the then-standard tactic of compensating for single-shot infantry weapons by massing as many troops as you could in a single group and volley-blasting away at your opponent.

If anything, effective use of volley-guns would come under Tactics.


Some fire all at once and others don't. Wiki lumps them all together. I tried to separate them out some in my list above so the Volley Guns fire all at once and the Crank Guns fire with the crank. I don't think Tactics would cover the firing and servicing of volley guns. It doesn't do that with machine guns. What it covers the best places to put and use the machine guns. It'd be the same with Volley Guns.


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sun Jun 07, 2020 9:06 pm
  

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Sambot wrote:
[
Some fire all at once and others don't. Wiki lumps them all together. I tried to separate them out some in my list above so the Volley Guns fire all at once and the Crank Guns fire with the crank. I don't think Tactics would cover the firing and servicing of volley guns. It doesn't do that with machine guns. What it covers the best places to put and use the machine guns. It'd be the same with Volley Guns.


I'll maintain that the weapons you mention, as crew-served weapons, fall under Heavy Weapons, though with the lighter direct-fire carriage-born weapons of the time, some of the heavier volley guns might edge into W.P. Artillery country. The specific use of rifle-caliber rounds, however, has me favoring W.P. Heavy Weapons.
Puckle-Guns and Gatlings, admittedly, once set up, could be operated by one man(at least for one volley/melee of firing), but preparing the cassettes, plates, and cartridges required a team, and volley and 'grinder guns' had somebody ever ready to replace/feed in fresh rounds.

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2020 4:09 am
  

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taalismn wrote:
I'll maintain that the weapons you mention, as crew-served weapons, fall under Heavy Weapons, though with the lighter direct-fire carriage-born weapons of the time, some of the heavier volley guns might edge into W.P. Artillery country. The specific use of rifle-caliber rounds, however, has me favoring W.P. Heavy Weapons.
Puckle-Guns and Gatlings, admittedly, once set up, could be operated by one man(at least for one volley/melee of firing), but preparing the cassettes, plates, and cartridges required a team, and volley and 'grinder guns' had somebody ever ready to replace/feed in fresh rounds.


I generally prefer separate skills but I would be okay with that. Maybe for modern character that skill would need to be taken twice with the second one being antique weapons? Conversely period characters could take the skill again for modern weapons?
Funnily enough Gatling Guns were sometimes replacements cannons using grapeshot. Plus they were as heavy as artillery and could be pulled by horses. As for them being artillery, the wall gun was an an in between weapon but I think its covered by the BP Rifle skill. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wall_gun The Hotchkiss gun though I'm not sure of. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hotchkiss_gun
Most of these could be operated by one person but it'd increase the reload time a lot. Most I think would be a minimum or 2 crew one firing and the other reloading and they'd have a lot of pre-readied "clips" ready to use.


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2020 5:39 pm
  

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Thing was, some of the volley guns needed special cartridges that weren't always readily available through military supply chains.

Oddly enough, one of the Puckle Guns fired square bullets for use against Muslims(I'm assuming they had the Bedouin in mind)... talk about discrimination in warfare....One can imagine some argument over the wrong groups being shot with the wrong ammo. :|

But aside from TransDimensional Turtles and some of the Wormwood related material, there's hardly any coverage of that period of warfare in Palladium games. We go from W.P. Siege Engines to W.P. Artillery, and W.P. Ancient Weapons to W.P. Modern Weapons(Heavy) without any coverage of the experimental phases in between as warfare shifted to the Modern. You wanna play in the Napoleonic or Civil War eras, you have to make do with general coverage by some of the Modern W.P.s or just Black Powder weapons(handguns/rifles) in general.

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:48 am
  

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taalismn wrote:
Thing was, some of the volley guns needed special cartridges that weren't always readily available through military supply chains.


They would have had a few ready to go though along with supplies to reload them. That process would take a bit and I imagine that's what the rest of the troops assigned to the gun, if any, would be doing.

Quote:
Oddly enough, one of the Puckle Guns fired square bullets for use against Muslims(I'm assuming they had the Bedouin in mind)... talk about discrimination in warfare....One can imagine some argument over the wrong groups being shot with the wrong ammo. :|


Yeah I saw that. It is rather discriminatory. Not that I think they'd care. It'd be like, "Oopsie! Oh well. He was a heathen anyway or he wouldn't be fighting us."



Quote:
But aside from TransDimensional Turtles and some of the Wormwood related material, there's hardly any coverage of that period of warfare in Palladium games. We go from W.P. Siege Engines to W.P. Artillery, and W.P. Ancient Weapons to W.P. Modern Weapons(Heavy) without any coverage of the experimental phases in between as warfare shifted to the Modern. You wanna play in the Napoleonic or Civil War eras, you have to make do with general coverage by some of the Modern W.P.s or just Black Powder weapons(handguns/rifles) in general.


Yeah. There's some material scattered about. I know there's one in the Rifter. Most others end up being TK weapons. It's a shame though since there's a lot of interesting and effective weapons that existed. :-(


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2020 8:33 pm
  

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Sambot wrote:

Quote:
Oddly enough, one of the Puckle Guns fired square bullets for use against Muslims(I'm assuming they had the Bedouin in mind)... talk about discrimination in warfare....One can imagine some argument over the wrong groups being shot with the wrong ammo. :|


Yeah I saw that. It is rather discriminatory. Not that I think they'd care. It'd be like, "Oopsie! Oh well. He was a heathen anyway or he wouldn't be fighting us." -(


"He ate spaghetti with the wrong sauce! P PASTA DOESN'T GO WITH GOAT CHEESE!!!! HERESY!"

"HE WENT TO EATON, NOT SANDHURST!!!! DIE, HEATHEN!"

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2020 9:40 pm
  

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Holiday lore-the ability to know about the various holidays around you,but how they came about & how to properly celebrate them!
Chance of success is 25+iq% +8% you have a bonus 15% to know how to celebrate your native holidays.


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2020 2:50 am
  

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abe wrote:
Holiday lore-the ability to know about the various holidays around you,but how they came about & how to properly celebrate them!
Chance of success is 25+iq% +8% you have a bonus 15% to know how to celebrate your native holidays.



You've already posted this, or something very similar to it, before.

I'd consider this to not be a skill, but just common cultural knowledge to anybody who can read a calendar and do a little research, or who has been brought up in a faith-based household, as is appropriate..
And what defines a 'holiday'? Official government recognition and a day off? Do we limit it to religious observances only? How about non-official 'holidays' like National Creampuff Day or Chocolate Chip Cookie Day? Do they count? If I look those up on the internet or a library book, am I using Research, or Lore: Holidays?

If you're looking into a culture from the outside, I'd suggest the little known Palladium Fantasy (High Seas) skill Lore: Culture and Customs, Lore: Religion or the more general Anthropology skill. If a 'holiday' has a magical component, any of the following can apply: Astrology, Lore: Magi, or :Lore: Cults & Secret Societies.


And Abe, would you REALLY use this skill in a game, given its very limited focus?

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


Last edited by taalismn on Thu Jun 11, 2020 8:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2020 2:52 pm
  

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T
abe wrote:
Holiday lore-the ability to know about the various holidays around you,but how they came about & how to properly celebrate them!
Chance of success is 25+iq% +8% you have a bonus 15% to know how to celebrate your native holidays.
Too general. I would think that holidays for religions would be covered by the lore specific to that religion. Otherwise this is just trivia, which is covered by knowing a lot of different lore. You don't need a generic holidays lore skill.

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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2020 12:06 am
  

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Stone Gargoyle wrote:
Too general. I would think that holidays for religions would be covered by the lore specific to that religion. Otherwise this is just trivia, which is covered by knowing a lot of different lore. You don't need a generic holidays lore skill.


Besides, I think there will be other signs of an alien/demon infiltration of society other than they're the ones flying confederate flags on the 4th of July, or cooking ostrich on Thanksgiving. I'm not going to waste a skill choice on this one, especially considering how flexible many holiday customs have become.

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2020 4:21 am
  

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taalismn wrote:
Sambot wrote:

Quote:
Oddly enough, one of the Puckle Guns fired square bullets for use against Muslims(I'm assuming they had the Bedouin in mind)... talk about discrimination in warfare....One can imagine some argument over the wrong groups being shot with the wrong ammo. :|


Yeah I saw that. It is rather discriminatory. Not that I think they'd care. It'd be like, "Oopsie! Oh well. He was a heathen anyway or he wouldn't be fighting us." -(


"He ate spaghetti with the wrong sauce! P PASTA DOESN'T GO WITH GOAT CHEESE!!!! HERESY!"

"HE WENT TO EATON, NOT SANDHURST!!!! DIE, HEATHEN!"



LOL! :D




taalismn wrote:
abe wrote:
Holiday lore-the ability to know about the various holidays around you,but how they came about & how to properly celebrate them!
Chance of success is 25+iq% +8% you have a bonus 15% to know how to celebrate your native holidays.



You've already posted this, or something very similar to it, before.

I'd consider this to not be a skill, but just common cultural knowledge to anybody who can read a calendar and do a little research, or who has been brought up in a faith-based household, as is appropriate..
And what defines a 'holiday'? Official government recognition and a day off? Do we limit it to religious observances only? How about non-official 'holidays' like National Creampuff Day or Chocolate Chip Cookie Day? Do they count? If I look those up on the internet or a library book, am I using Research, or Lore: Holidays?

If you're looking into a culture from the outside, I'd suggest the little known Palladium Fantasy (High Seas) skill Lore: Culture and Customs, Lore: Religion or the more general Anthropology skill. If a 'holiday' has a magical component, any of the following can apply: Astrology, Lore: Magi, or :Lore: Cults & Secret Societies.


And Abe, would you REALLY use this skill in a game, given its very limited focus?




It could be a skill. There's lots of very specific skills in the books. Mostly the older out of print ones but they're there. And there are some people who do specialize in things like that.

Stone Gargoyle wrote:
T
abe wrote:
Holiday lore-the ability to know about the various holidays around you,but how they came about & how to properly celebrate them!
Chance of success is 25+iq% +8% you have a bonus 15% to know how to celebrate your native holidays.
Too general. I would think that holidays for religions would be covered by the lore specific to that religion. Otherwise this is just trivia, which is covered by knowing a lot of different lore. You don't need a generic holidays lore skill.


In away but I would think taking it as a skill would mean that they have a more in depth knowledge than the average person. They're know why a specif day is a holiday while most people just know it is. They wouldn't have as much knowledge though as someone who specialized in a specific holiday. That person would know how the holiday is celebrated world wide.


Thing is, its more a skill an NPC would have. I'd suggest a PC should choose another skill unless they're actually going to use it.


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2020 5:04 pm
  

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Sambot wrote:
In away but I would think taking it as a skill would mean that they have a more in depth knowledge than the average person. They're know why a specif day is a holiday while most people just know it is. They wouldn't have as much knowledge though as someone who specialized in a specific holiday. That person would know how the holiday is celebrated world wide.
Thing is, its more a skill an NPC would have. I'd suggest a PC should choose another skill unless they're actually going to use it.
This is my point: To have in depth knowledge about a holiday, you would need other skills such as History, Religion or Mythology. To simply know the basics about a holiday that everyone else knows is not a skill. Even to know all the holidays, all one would need is Research. To make it a specific skill gives them a general framework to bypass all those other skills I mentioned. And as you point out, it is a useless skill to put in a game, unless of course you plan to run a campaign where a villain or hero bases their activities on holidays.

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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2020 8:16 pm
  

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Sambot wrote:
In away but I would think taking it as a skill would mean that they have a more in depth knowledge than the average person. They're know why a specif day is a holiday while most people just know it is. They wouldn't have as much knowledge though as someone who specialized in a specific holiday. That person would know how the holiday is celebrated world wide.


Thing is, its more a skill an NPC would have. I'd suggest a PC should choose another skill unless they're actually going to use it.


Lore: Religion or straightforward History, might let you know, for example, that Christmas has been moved around date-wise to appeal to the northern pagan converts(from whom many customs have been borrowed). But the way the OP was set up 'the various holidays around you'. Well, I'm aware of not only the major religious holidays, the civil holidays, the memorial holidays, but also the commercial interest holidays(like Seafood Day) and the gag holidays(International Talk Like a Pirate Day' or National Gorilla Suit Day).

But, yes, I can see a villain or a nut bar(or M.O.M/ Crazy) going total immersion in character playing Saint Nick, but I'd figure that to be window-dressing for the character, and not something I'd assign a skill slot to.

I mean, how many times does the Rogue Scholar get in a trivia duel on holiday lore with a bad guy and expect to live if he points out the bad guy is WRONG on some point?

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2020 7:57 am
  

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Stone Gargoyle wrote:
This is my point: To have in depth knowledge about a holiday, you would need other skills such as History, Religion or Mythology. To simply know the basics about a holiday that everyone else knows is not a skill. Even to know all the holidays, all one would need is Research. To make it a specific skill gives them a general framework to bypass all those other skills I mentioned. And as you point out, it is a useless skill to put in a game, unless of course you plan to run a campaign where a villain or hero bases their activities on holidays.


Research would be useful. The others would be as well. Having a Lore: Holiday skill though doesn't bypass the need for those skills. It means that the research was limited to just that subject. It doesn't mean they could research something else because they wouldn't recognize if it was important or not. It'd be like someone taking Law: Tax Law and then being asked to defend someone in a murder case. They may have a Law Skill but they'd be out of their depth in a murder case. Lore: Holidays is the same. They know a lot about Holidays but little if any about Conspiracy Theories or Comic Books, or TV Soap Operas or whatever.




taalismn wrote:
Lore: Religion or straightforward History, might let you know, for example, that Christmas has been moved around date-wise to appeal to the northern pagan converts(from whom many customs have been borrowed). But the way the OP was set up 'the various holidays around you'. Well, I'm aware of not only the major religious holidays, the civil holidays, the memorial holidays, but also the commercial interest holidays(like Seafood Day) and the gag holidays(International Talk Like a Pirate Day' or National Gorilla Suit Day).

But, yes, I can see a villain or a nut bar(or M.O.M/ Crazy) going total immersion in character playing Saint Nick, but I'd figure that to be window-dressing for the character, and not something I'd assign a skill slot to.

I mean, how many times does the Rogue Scholar get in a trivia duel on holiday lore with a bad guy and expect to live if he points out the bad guy is WRONG on some point?


They might but then might not or it may but not give any details. A specific skill though would. It sure sounds like you know more about holidays than I do. :)

I can see assigning a skill though because they're not normal characters. Did you know there's like 60 Study skills? That doesn't include Lore, or History, or Law, where things can overlap a lot. Some are also general and others very specific. They're all given to NPCs though. If a PC were to choose such a skill, I'd expect them to use it. Meaning annoying everyone else about that subject.

The Scholar could tell him, "I don't blame you for not believing me but it's true. It's easily missed but it's right there in XWC volume 24. Look it up. I'll wait here." Then run when he goes to look it up.


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2020 1:30 pm
  

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I still don't think Lore: Holidays is a skill you would get much use out of.

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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2020 8:55 pm
  

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Stone Gargoyle wrote:
I still don't think Lore: Holidays is a skill you would get much use out of.


Unless your entire Palladium RPG campaign setting is just trying to get through the day without choking yourself trying to put your head through a jacket buttonhole or have a conversation that doesn't end with you being ignored as a noob or stuffed into a garbage dumpster

At best I'd say, as with regards to various cooking cuisine skills, just take the general Lore skill and tack on (name of your obsession here) and retain the same percentages and exp, rather than make it a separate and distinct skill on its own.

As it was written, the OP lacked the depth, utility, and game mechanic detail of a serious scholarship skill, or the novelty and cleverness of a gag skill.

_________________
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:38 am
  

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Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 7:48 am
Posts: 186
Stone Gargoyle wrote:
I still don't think Lore: Holidays is a skill you would get much use out of.


I don't think so either. :-D


taalismn wrote:
Unless your entire Palladium RPG campaign setting is just trying to get through the day without choking yourself trying to put your head through a jacket buttonhole or have a conversation that doesn't end with you being ignored as a noob or stuffed into a garbage dumpster

At best I'd say, as with regards to various cooking cuisine skills, just take the general Lore skill and tack on (name of your obsession here) and retain the same percentages and exp, rather than make it a separate and distinct skill on its own.

As it was written, the OP lacked the depth, utility, and game mechanic detail of a serious scholarship skill, or the novelty and cleverness of a gag skill.


The various Lore skills do have their own percentages usually 25%-30% +5% per level.

Considering some skills I've seen PCs have don't even have a description I'm not going to complain about how little his has.


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 Post subject: Re: We Gots The Skills
Unread postPosted: Mon Jun 15, 2020 3:46 pm
  

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Location: Lurking on rooftops like a proper gargoyle should, in and around Tacoma, WA.
Comment: "Your inferiority complex might be justified."
Sambot wrote:
Considering some skills I've seen PCs have don't even have a description I'm not going to complain about how little his has.
I disagree. If you are going to post something it should be well thought out, not some basic framework. Anybody can post the name of a skill and percentages.

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