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Unread postPosted: Sun Apr 28, 2019 12:47 pm
  

Wanderer

Joined: Fri Apr 04, 2014 8:18 am
Posts: 50
So I am making up a Nightbane Sorcerer for a Rifts setting, and like to plan out my characters thoroughly.
Given I'm going Sorcerer, and will have access to most spells in the Rifts settting I wanted to pick Talents with effects that I couldn't reproduce with spells.
I'll comb through the books, but figure some of you guys have already done the same thing.
Any suggestions on which talents a Nightbane Sorcerer should take to get talents abilities you can't reproduce with spells?

Thanks,
Mal


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Unread postPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 1:55 pm
  

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Monk

Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2003 7:22 pm
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Location: 2nd Degree Black Belt of Post Fu
Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
Anti-Arcane is a must for any Nightbane sorcerer. Every spell that has a saving throw automatically has no effect. Note this doesn't mean you automatically save, it means that if it has a saving throw, it has no effect whatsoever. This is important for spells where a save normally only lessens the impact--say a Carpet of adhesion. Instead of only being stuck for a short time you'd not be stuck at all. An anti-magic cloud would have no effect on you whatever. The only magic that works are magic that requires a dodge for save, or those that have no saving throw at all. This is basically a cheat code during sorceror duels because 99% of your opponents magic simply will not work on you.

Doorway is also a big one. While it's true Spellcasters can eventually get Teleportation Superior, it's far more expensive (more PPE than even a Nightbane has) and less accurate.

_________________
Sometimes, you're like a beacon of light in the darkness, giving me some hope for humankind. ~ Killer Cyborg

You can have something done good, fast and cheap. If you want it done good and fast, it's not going to be cheap. If you want it done fast and cheap it won't be good. If you want something done good and cheap it won't be done fast. ~ Dark Brandon


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Unread postPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 2:14 pm
  

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Palladin

Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2007 9:40 pm
Posts: 9419
Comment: Palladium Books Canon is set solely by Kevin Siembieda, either in person, or by his approval of published material.
It really depends on what you are wanting your Sorcerer to do.

Mirror Search is one of the most powerful Divination Tools out there
Sharing the Flesh is one of the top tier Healing tools.
Shadow Pockets? Abduction? Spell Jack?
There are a huge array of Talents that provide all sorts of abilities that will be impossible or nearly so to duplicate with magic. The question becomes more "what sort of sorcerer" are you building, what features do you have (many of the top talents are Elite ones)... what do you want to do and not do.

_________________
The rules are not a bludgeon with which to hammer a character into a game. They are a guide to how a group of friends can get together to weave a collective story that entertains everyone involved. We forget that at our peril.

Edmund Burke wrote:
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."


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Unread postPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:05 pm
  

Wanderer

Joined: Fri Apr 04, 2014 8:18 am
Posts: 50
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Anti-Arcane is a must for any Nightbane sorcerer. Every spell that has a saving throw automatically has no effect. Note this doesn't mean you automatically save, it means that if it has a saving throw, it has no effect whatsoever. This is important for spells where a save normally only lessens the impact--say a Carpet of adhesion. Instead of only being stuck for a short time you'd not be stuck at all. An anti-magic cloud would have no effect on you whatever. The only magic that works are magic that requires a dodge for save, or those that have no saving throw at all. This is basically a cheat code during sorceror duels because 99% of your opponents magic simply will not work on you.

Doorway is also a big one. While it's true Spellcasters can eventually get Teleportation Superior, it's far more expensive (more PPE than even a Nightbane has) and less accurate.


Thanks guys.
I think I'll be playing a jack of all trades, but probably not much combat. I have the mirror-man Morpheus (with plasmoids and angèlic face), and like the idea of playing cab driver for the party. Information and influencing magics. Probably not a stealthy infiltrator given the mirror-man. I like having flexibility over focus in most cases.

Mal


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Unread postPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:21 pm
  

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Monk

Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2003 7:22 pm
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Location: 2nd Degree Black Belt of Post Fu
Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
If you want stealth, Reshape Facade is an excellent choice because it would allow you to, well, do what it says on the tin. Disguise your facade as other people.

This is not nearly as big a problem for a Nightbane Sorcerer as a regular nightbane. while a Nightbane can only use a few talents in facade form, you'd be able to effectively play a shapeshifting wizard, which is always handy for being sneaky.

Plus the defensive Talents tend to also be useable in facade form.

_________________
Sometimes, you're like a beacon of light in the darkness, giving me some hope for humankind. ~ Killer Cyborg

You can have something done good, fast and cheap. If you want it done good and fast, it's not going to be cheap. If you want it done fast and cheap it won't be good. If you want something done good and cheap it won't be done fast. ~ Dark Brandon


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Unread postPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 12:35 pm
  

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Knight

Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2015 1:13 pm
Posts: 5294
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Anti-Arcane is a must for any Nightbane sorcerer.
Every spell that has a saving throw automatically has no effect.
Note this doesn't mean you automatically save,
it means that if it has a saving throw, it has no effect whatsoever.
This is important for spells where a save normally only lessens the impact
--say a Carpet of adhesion.
Instead of only being stuck for a short time you'd not be stuck at all.
An anti-magic cloud would have no effect on you whatever.


Astute! NB107...
    Any magical spell that can be resisted by a save against magic will have no effect on the character.

Of course, one might argue about whether or not RITUALS are similarly included, since "spell" sometimes has a narrow v. broad usage.

also interesting to contrast to another SDC game, Powers Unlimited page 31's "Immune to Magic":
    impervious to any magic spell or illusion where a save vs magic is allowed. Automatically saves.

It's interesting to compare ITM to AA to compare the expressions "has no effect" v "impervious". Do you think they differ?

Also from Rifts Mercenary Adventures: the Magebane on pg 26

    totally impervi­ous to all forms of magic that require a saving throw (automati­cally saves)

This seems to resemble Powers Unlimited in that "impervious" may simply refer to automatically passing savings throws rather than being impervious to the "still affected to a lesser degree if you make the save" secondary effects.

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Doorway is also a big one. While it's true Spellcasters can eventually get Teleportation Superior, it's far more expensive (more PPE than even a Nightbane has) and less accurate.

Pg 108's 2/mile is a pretty sweet cost for short distances. T:Superior (p150) is cheaper for longer distances though: 600 PPE for 300 miles per level works out to 2 PPE for 1 mile/level, so it starts off with an equal ratio to Doorway and improves from there.

The issue of needing to step through a doorway (or carry stuff through) is contrast to being able to transport thousands of pounds within 20 feet without needing to actually carry it (or touch it).

A better comparison might be to Mystic Portal... which appears to be missing from Nightbane! The level 8 Nightlands Portal ritual on page 141 perhaps replaced it? 1 hour and it opens for 1 minute per level...

Doorway didn't have a stated duration for how long it was kept open but I imagine Nightlands 142's disclaimer would apply...
    Unless otherwise indicated, all Talents have a duration of one minute per level of experience, except certain combat oriented talents where the P.P.E. spent powers one attack or effect each time it is used.

That 40+5/mile for portals to Nightlands or back sure is wasteful unless you can't manage to concentrate a 2nd round because the spot on the other side is too dangerous. I'd rather just do cheaper 2/mile portals to a place with a safe alternate, do a 0-mile portal for 40, then keep hopping with 2/mile portals on the other side.

The requirement that you either must have a line of sight or have been there


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Unread postPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 1:19 pm
  

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Monk

Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2003 7:22 pm
Posts: 15307
Location: 2nd Degree Black Belt of Post Fu
Comment: The Munchkin Fairy
T. Superior is better for long distance travel to be sure, in terms of PPE effiency, but far more dangerous. Every time you cast you have to roll a %, and if you fail you have a chance of instant death regardless of your attributes. teleporting to a "Familiar Location" is only 1 in 5000 of dying, but if your teleporting somewhere you've only seen a few times before, it's 1 in 250. This makes Teleport Superior untenable for anything but emergency situations. If you only do it a few times, it'll probablly be safe, but it's got a fatality rate far too high to make for reliable transportation. It might be more inefficent to use Doorway, but it's much safer.

Now to be fair, the odds are 1 in 96 that the average person will die in an automobile accident, but that is averaged over the entire lifespan of a person, every commute to work, shopping, visiting friends, vacations, all the thousands and tens of thousands of road trips the average person takes in a lifetime, only 1 in 96 dies out of tens of thousands of automobile trips.

This is 1 out of every 250 times you teleport superior to go somewhere you've only seen a few times, you simply die. if you simply use teleport superior to commute to work every day, that would quickly fall under the 1 in 5000 as you only fail 1 time in a 100, still, statistically you would die in less than a decade. This is horrifically unsafe. No one would use Teleport Superior for anything but dire emergencies. We ground Airplanes and recall cars for smaller much smaller fatality rates.

_________________
Sometimes, you're like a beacon of light in the darkness, giving me some hope for humankind. ~ Killer Cyborg

You can have something done good, fast and cheap. If you want it done good and fast, it's not going to be cheap. If you want it done fast and cheap it won't be good. If you want something done good and cheap it won't be done fast. ~ Dark Brandon


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Unread postPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 4:32 pm
  

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Knight

Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2015 1:13 pm
Posts: 5294
One thing I'm wondering about: if you have a power active to phase through walls (such as the temporal magic D-Phase spell) shuldn't that protect you against instant death post-teleportation?


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