Familars???? Which version do you use?

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Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by RockJock »

Ok, which version of the magical familiar do you use? Off the top of my head you have the Rifts version, Mysteries of Magic version(upgradable), Megaversal Builder version(mdc familiars etc), Nightbane version(upgradable), plus things like the Beastmaster, Lemurian, Demon Familiar, and so on which are similar, but not exactly familiars.


Familiar link scroll is another issue. Who can or can't use the scroll? I find it hard to buy that nobody but a mage has the mental/spiritual discipline when you have martial artists, psychics and so on out there.
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

The one from Through the Glass Darkly. Which the the ones in the MoM1 book are a variant of.

Anyone who can read it.
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by eliakon »

I use the spell for most familiars.

If a wizard wants to get fancy they can use the advanced "Spend PPE to build a familiar" rules (which ones will depend on what sort of game is being played. The Nightbane rules are, obviously more suited to that game than others and the options need to be looked at closely)

I don't allow scrolls of the familiar ritual as I don't allow scrolls of rituals, and it is clearly a ritual not a simple spell. The sole exception is that occasionally an Alchemist can make a special one shot device that can allow someone to cast Familiar Link. Occasionally, its very expensive and very rare (i.e. it is a plot device, not something that a PC with the scroll spell can just mass produce)
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by RockJock »

Thanks for the feedback everyone.
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by Library Ogre »

I prefer the TtGD/MoM versions, unsurprisingly.
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by Nekira Sudacne »

I'm not aware that they are differnt. Nothing stops you from using TtGD and MoM modificatins on familiars gained from the spell or Megaverse builder or even demon familiars from the spell or witch pact. They are all mutually inclusive.
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by RockJock »

Thanks Mark, not a surprise at all:).

Nekira, I've had friends argue about which is the "right" familiar rules. SDC animals only, limited MDC animals, boosted with PPE or not, and so on. I was just curious how everyone handled it.
Last edited by RockJock on Mon Jan 16, 2017 8:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by Nekira Sudacne »

RockJock wrote:Thanks Mark, not a surprise at all:).

Nekaira, I've had friends argue about which is the "right" familiar rules. SDC animals only, limited MDC animals, boosted with PPE or not, and so on. I was just curious how everyone handled it.


The Familiar Spell invocation can only net you SDC animals.

The Nightbane process can net you SDC or MDC animals, or even sentient beings, but only if their intelligence is less than average human--any being of human or greater average intelligence cannot bound with this process. Note this essentially means 3d6 intelligence or more: beautiful people, for all intents and purposes a race of minor supernatural humanoids, have an IQ of 2d6+4, while technically still averaging 10-11 IQ, are suitable familiars.

the Greater Familiar invocation can net you any lesser supernatural being or lesser demon as a familiar, with no restrictions on intelligence or attributes so long as they qualify as lesser beings.

The mysteries of magic section mentions upgrades to any familiar, but is mostly discussing those gained through the invocations.

Only Shifters are able to take "greater" supernatural beings and demons as familiars. the art is apparently a class-secret.


My point is that none of these are mutually exclusive. The ability to spend PPE to give a familiar traits found in mysteries of magic and nightbane are seperate from any rules of how to get familiars, because it dosn't matter. Once you gain a familiar, through whatever process, they can be enhanced, regardless of if they are MDC, SDC, supernatural, ect.
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

I your opinion, can genetically modified animals be turned into Familiar? (talk about both formats please)

EDIT: Not talking about ATB, TMNT, HU Mutant Animals, and Lonestar MAs (dogboys, kill cats, etc..).
Last edited by drewkitty ~..~ on Thu May 05, 2016 11:21 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by Nekira Sudacne »

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:I your opinion, can genetically modified animals be turned into Familiar? (talk about both formats please)


the only defining limit appears to be intelligence and size via invocation, so as long as they don't get full human IQ, I don't see why not. Nightbane variety is IQ only but any number of powers will do.


If it becomes a mega hero, then only greater familiar will work.
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by Library Ogre »

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:I your opinion, can genetically modified animals be turned into Familiar? (talk about both formats please)


Sure, provided it falls under the restrictions of the spell or process. I would say (referencing After the Bomb), something like a Bounder might be above what can be handled (since they are actually intelligent, not simply high-end animal), but I wouldn't get too ruffled by it.
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by Nekira Sudacne »

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:I your opinion, can genetically modified animals be turned into Familiar? (talk about both formats please)

EDIT: Not talking about ATB, TMNT, HU Mutant Animals, and Lonestar MAs (dogboys, kill cats, etc..).
then absolutly, provided they still fall within size/IQ limitations
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by RockJock »

What about say, the hounds from Splicers?
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by Nekira Sudacne »

RockJock wrote:What about say, the hounds from Splicers?


1: Are they of Animal Intelligence? Yes or No

2: Are they of human intelligence? Yes or No

3: Are they of proper weight limit for the invocation? Yes or No*

4: Are they Lesser Supernatural? Yes or No

5: Are they Greater Supernatural? Yes or No.


*If Yes, then does a newborn weigh 25 lbs or less?

If 1 and 3 are Yes and the others No, you can use the Invocation.

if 1 is No but 2 and 5 are also No, you can use the Nightbane process

if 3 is No, it just means you can't use the Invocation
*Unless they weigh less than 25 lbs at birth, in which case they can be taken as familiars at birth and kept as they grow. it's a loophole Mysteries of Magic explicitly allows.

if 2 is Yes, you can only have them as familiars if 4 is also Yes, in which case you can only use Greater Familiar

if 4 is Yes, then Greater Familiar can take them as familiars regardless of answers 1-3

if 5 is Yes, then only Shifters can take them as familiars regardless of other Answers


For a Gorehound:
1: Yes
2: No
3: No*
4: No
5: No
*They are created fully grown, not born

Ergo, Gorehounds can only be taken as familiars Via the Nightbane process. :)
Last edited by Nekira Sudacne on Fri May 06, 2016 11:08 am, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by Glistam »

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
RockJock wrote:What about say, the hounds from Splicers?


1: Are they of Animal Intelligence? Yes or No

2: Are they of human intelligence? Yes or No

3: Are they of proper Size for the invocation? Yes or No

4: Are they Lesser Supernatural? Yes or No

5: Are they Greater Supernatural? Yes or No.

If 1 and 3 are Yes and the others No, you can use the Invocation.

if 1 is No but 2 and 5 are also No, you can use the Nightbane process

if 3 is No, it just means you can't use the Invocation

if 2 is Yes, you can only have them as familiars if 4 is also Yes, in which case you can only use Greater Familiar

if 4 is Yes, then Greater Familiar can take them as familiars regardless of answers 1-3

if 5 is Yes, then only Shifters can take them as familiars regardless of other Answers

Pull up the Splicers Gorehound statblock and apply the above Familiar Litmis Test(tm). Show your work, you will be graded :D ;)

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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

Good "Go-No Go" chart NS. :ok:
---
My idea was to use varius text in the books be it Lonestar or the Galaxy Guide, or where ever, on the base/core animal stats to do my own design for a pre connected gene-modifications.

The Splicers' Gorehounds are something I can see Gene splicers (Triax) and the Gene-tech (one of the 3G books). While I can see Lonestar "being able" to produce them, however, they are constrained by CP's directives and policies.

However, they don't really fit into most of the SDC settings.
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

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Gorehound familiars could be scary.
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Re: Familars???? Which version do you use?

Unread post by Axelmania »

I use either of them depending on whether I want to sacrifice SDC or PPE to bond. Or both.

Not sure there's more than just the two approaches.
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