"Most Powerful" magic OCC/RCC?

[Nekira Sudacne]

Don't forget the new air warlock magic in Mysteries of Magic that includes line-of-sight teleportation!

[Talavar]

I have to second demi-god ley line walker or temporal wizard with elemental magic as their demi-god power as the most powerful (I'd say shifter for the OCC, but that's verboten in this thread). You've got a great selection of standard invocations for utility and protection, then elemental magic to bust heads. Discounted, superior and single attack-casting Call Lightning and Fireball, depending on element selection, then world-enders like River of Lava or Tornado at the not that high a level of 7. Awesome.

[Tor]

TMNT, like HU, never really used OCCs specifically... but the educational backgrounds or power categories are essentially the rough equivalents...

In which case, I'd submit the Time Lord from Transdimensional. It doesn't matter how much power you build up if your opponent can just go back in time when you were weak (or not even born) and wipe you from existence.

Though I'm not clear on how this works in regard to paradoxes. Can we not take actions that would cause them? (ie killing someone removes them and thus your reason for going back in time to kill them, so you can't actually make intended changes to the past, only unintended changes)

Perhaps if we make an intended change to the past, it splits the timeline and creates new dimensions? You create a new timeline that does not produce the you that wanted to go back and make the change, but you did not change your own timeline.

[Nekira Sudacne]

TMNT, like HU, never really used OCCs specifically... but the educational backgrounds or power categories are essentially the rough equivalents...

In which case, I'd submit the Time Lord from Transdimensional. It doesn't matter how much power you build up if your opponent can just go back in time when you were weak (or not even born) and wipe you from existence.

Though I'm not clear on how this works in regard to paradoxes. Can we not take actions that would cause them? (ie killing someone removes them and thus your reason for going back in time to kill them, so you can't actually make intended changes to the past, only unintended changes)

Perhaps if we make an intended change to the past, it splits the timeline and creates new dimensions? You create a new timeline that does not produce the you that wanted to go back and make the change, but you did not change your own timeline.

The Transdimensional TMNT book goes into explicit detail on those very questions. which makes sense sinse they're also the book where time lords are discribed and stated.

[say652]

temporal warrior. stay for the whole 14 year contract and poof. bad ass!! you cant spell badass without an Si.( sorry for the duck dynasty joke really.lol)

[Mouser13]

Chaing-ku Dragon Hatchling temporal wizard

[Tor]

I'm not clear on how this works in regard to paradoxes. Can we not take actions that would cause them? (ie killing someone removes them and thus your reason for going back in time to kill them, so you can't actually make intended changes to the past, only unintended changes) Perhaps if we make an intended change to the past, it splits the timeline and creates new dimensions? You create a new timeline that does not produce the you that wanted to go back and make the change, but you did not change your own timeline.

The Transdimensional TMNT book goes into explicit detail on those very questions. which makes sense sinse they're also the book where time lords are discribed and stated.

I must've forgotten where it does that, pg in particular? Explanations jump around a lot in that.

[londonbaz]

Lord Magus.

Good man, staying loyal to our Avatar

[flatline]

Lord Magus.

Good man, staying loyal to our Avatar

I always confuse the FoM magic users. Is the Lord Magus the one that can never learn high level spells but slowly transforms into a supernatural creature?

--flatline

[Ectoplasmic Bidet]

Lord Magus.

Good man, staying loyal to our Avatar

I always confuse the FoM magic users. Is the Lord Magus the one that can never learn high level spells but slowly transforms into a supernatural creature?

--flatline

Yes.

[FluidicAztec]

This might be a little outside of what the OP limited the choices to, but I'd have to say a Nightbane Sorcerer OCC is one of the most potent I've ever seen. If you pick just a couple of powerful talents coupled with the PPE starting at 3D6x10+20+PE and another 2D6+6 per level added to the ability to pick spells like any other Sorcerer is pretty amazing. All of this on top of the Morphus! And if this character is used in Rifts the relative power goes crazy (MDC, Supernatural PS, Spells, Talents). In Rifts the character has access to some pretty amazing spell choices.

Also, as previously mentioned, the Smoker from Manhunter is pretty cool. Not sure if it's the most powerful, but it's up there.

[flatline]

Do they still sell Manhunter?

--flatline

[say652]

Temporal Warrior due the full 14 year contract and you are a juicer/mage!

[FluidicAztec]

Do they still sell Manhunter?

--flatline

Try Amazon. Just search for Rifts Manhunter. You can get it used pretty cheap. It's a really cool book. Not laid out very good and there is so much missing...but the whole concept of intergalactic bad guy robots and all these bounty hunter type OCCs is cool. It had a lot of potential, but as written is kinda rough. But if you want uber tough Robot villian it doesn't get any better. Sorry, went off topic...

On topic...The Smoker is cool cause he's super versatile with spell selection but focuses on destructive and defensive type spells which he casts at half cost. He also has a horror factor, can see magic (including things made invisible with magic and, sense magic. I would rule that they could use combat magic out of the Rifts Mercenary Adventures book.

[Damian Magecraft]

Do they still sell Manhunter?

--flatline

Try Amazon. Just search for Rifts Manhunter. You can get it used pretty cheap. It's a really cool book. Not laid out very good and there is so much missing...but the whole concept of intergalactic bad guy robots and all these bounty hunter type OCCs is cool. It had a lot of potential, but as written is kinda rough. But if you want uber tough Robot villian it doesn't get any better. Sorry, went off topic...

On topic...The Smoker is cool cause he's super versatile with spell selection but focuses on destructive and defensive type spells which he casts at half cost. He also has a horror factor, can see magic (including things made invisible with magic and, sense magic. I would rule that they could use combat magic out of the Rifts Mercenary Adventures book.

what book is this one out of?

[FluidicAztec]

Do they still sell Manhunter?

--flatline

Try Amazon. Just search for Rifts Manhunter. You can get it used pretty cheap. It's a really cool book. Not laid out very good and there is so much missing...but the whole concept of intergalactic bad guy robots and all these bounty hunter type OCCs is cool. It had a lot of potential, but as written is kinda rough. But if you want uber tough Robot villian it doesn't get any better. Sorry, went off topic...

On topic...The Smoker is cool cause he's super versatile with spell selection but focuses on destructive and defensive type spells which he casts at half cost. He also has a horror factor, can see magic (including things made invisible with magic and, sense magic. I would rule that they could use combat magic out of the Rifts Mercenary Adventures book.

what book is this one out of?

Rifts Manhunter

[The Beast]

I can't believe nobody mentioned the Ludicrous mage.

Never heard of it nor does it appear in the OCCs listed in the GMG. Is it from a Rifter?

--flatline

Rifter 9.5.

Do they still sell Manhunter?

--flatline

Only used, though I did find a copy in decent shape at the store I went to today.

[warrenthewanderer]

Alchemists

[say652]

1) Temporal Warrior
2) Temporal Wizard
3) Nazca LineMaker
4) Mystic
5) Phase Mystic, yes not technically a ppe based mage but.........

[flatline]

I have to admit I'm surprised to see the number of posts nominating the Mystic.

The Mystic's inability to purchase spell magic has always been a deal breaker for me. I consider them to be among the weakest casters in the game for that one reason.

--flatline

[say652]

the combination of spells and psionics plus 1 super psionic ability is what put them on the list for me.

[Nekira Sudacne]

Most off the wall but lethal caster I've ever created was a Machine person/CosmoKnight. Yes I said it. Machine person/Cosmoknight. Cosmoknights get an awesome and underestimated amount of PPE that usually gets spent quickly and permanently, but a smart player can use this PPE boost to give PPE reserve to a character that usually didn't have it. In this case, a Machine Person. The trick to this is that the character has to meld with a Magic Construct such as one would find in Tolkeen. The MP/CK then learns the spells as Programs, and runs them through the battery and other components as a Computer Operation skill check. Converting spells to computer program is easy but time consuming with the right skills and as an added bonus, casting gains experience like a skill check, because it is. You are not only limited to your own imagination and spell finding abilities. Heaven forbid you figure out how to give it ISP or Chi...

There are no magic constructs with computer programs. Techno-wizardy devices explictly have no computers or programs to learn from

[say652]

the Mystically bestowed powers in HU deserve a mention in this also.

[Subjugator]

A Splugorth.

[Tor]

If we're allowing Splugorth then wouldn't the random AI generation table also qualify?

[Mouser13]

if RCC are allowed. Then spirt monster. Allows 2 spells from any magic type. I believe power comes from options so the one with the most options going to be powerfull.

Example Unverisial balance, Magicial Adren Rush, and giant. Not normally easy to get but togather are broken. Worst use of rules that is 106x your MDC. best it 900x your mdc.

In truth I think it really how much power you GM will let you get away with. I tried to play in a game in which I played a temporal wizard and was really really under powered, because I was not allow any of the spells/ combos/ to make me equal to the other characters(They have all be friends for 10+ years and so could get away with it).

[drewkitty ~..~]

The way the title is used for this topic, they used RCC correctly to mean a Racial Class. So if you mean "Are Races allowed?". Most people have just been restricting themselves to just classes, but a few have been making Race+OCC suggestions.

[Sir_Spirit]

Disciple of the Old One Xy with a pact of union. You know all spells and have every psionic power...


Just cuz he transformed doesn't mean the essence shards of his witches did....

[Blue_Lion]

Raw power I would go with the High magus. Decent skills all high level magic and access to temporal magic. The do have a few key low level spells, but other than that lack lower power spells. Add to that they make the magical automatons of Dwemor and the one the pilot is very strong.

[Mlp7029]

So you don't find use for Forgery, but find Ley Lines all the time?

Not ALL the time, but with reasonable frequency. enough it definatly comes in handy, as opposed to forgery, which has never come in handy. i'm not saying we never needed a forgery, i'm saying it seems to always be faster to buy it than to wait for the party member with the skill to try to pass the abursdly hard roll.

And 6th level is pushing the half point of the entire leveling curve, so being better until 6th is a pretty big deal.

Not really. you start hitting levels 4 and 5 after just a few months of regular playing and level six within six months. after that, it's a few years of playing at the medium to high levels. I've played in several games that lasted 2-3 years and one for 7 years and counting. the low levels blow by pretty fast, after that the difference between classes become clear, and apparent, because if you picked the frontended class, you got to outshine the others for a little while, then spend years being behind the curve.

And how well does that Metamorph work against dog boys or anything with Sense Magic? Not super well I'd wager.

it works as well as any other magic, really. at which point both classes are down to skills, and as I said, the ley line walker just has them beat. the ley line walker can have every skill the gypsy wizard does for sneaking around and more besides.

Or just use mystic invisibility spell, which either can learn, at which point dog boys become absolutely useless

The thing is that the Gypsy's skills fall back in situations where their spells are impractical and gives them an innate counter to the things that normally counter anti-magic tech in terms of stealth spells.

You seem to be conviently ignoring the part where I pointed out the ley line walker can have all the same skills with the exception of disguise and forgery and, again, because they come up so rarely the much more consistantly useful ley line walker powers just outshine the gypsy wizard thief. One is trivially duplicated with magic, the other is actually easier to buy than to DIY, so moot.

It might be a difference of perspective. if you don't play games that reach mid to high levels, then front-ended classes are always better. I've played games where a juicer would have actually died of old age, so what I value is very much long-term growth over being the best at first level.

What is the mystic invisibility spell and what book is it in?