Overlooked Disaster

[Mech-Viper Prime]

i was watching Mega-disasters earthquake in the heartland, then it hit me, the entire thing was completely missed in Choas Earth
New Madrid Seismic Zone

got me wondering how many unknown or lesser known faultlines would come to life

with the NMSZ, they said it would have 3 magitude earthquakes of 7.0-8.0 back to back

here is the list from USGS lists the states with past earthquake history
state listings

hopefully this help you in your chaos earth games

[RockJock]

I've brought this up on posts before. When there is a big earthquake, and I mean when, not if, it will be bad news. Just think about the fact that the last time there was a major movement the Mississippi flowed north.

[Aramanthus]

Yeah the prediction I last heard about the Madrid fault it that it'll affect about 50 + million people in the central part of the US. And remember none of the buildings in the central area of the US around the Madrid fault are in any way protected from earthquakes unlike other areas of the world that are prone to earthquakes. All I can say is I live in that area. I've kept my fingers crossed about it not happening during my lifetime!

[RockJock]

Buy soybean comodities if it happens:)

[kevinslkt]

Ahh... the very rare Earths elastic band effect, when one continental plate shifts too far it's gotta break somewhere much like an elastic band, like the Great plains.

[Nxla666]

Ya know, I dont need to be reminded of it.

[Mech-Viper Prime]

more and more i think about it when yellowstone blows so Freaking fragging FUBAR, wonder what the odds yellowstone setting it off?

[Nxla666]

more and more i think about it when yellowstone blows so Freaking fragging FUBAR, wonder what the odds yellowstone setting it off?

IF Yellostone has a massive eruption it would probably be like dropping several nukes on the Heartland.

[RockJock]

The New Madrid isn't from a rubberband effect, it is a failed continental rift, just like in Africa.

[RockJock]

It could be worse. They could have gone for St. Louis.

[Rahmota]

You know digging this up a bit because I had a thought related to this:

What if the NMSZ did go on ahead and split open like a ripe melon? Instead of the Yellowstone megavolcanao destroying the plains states/midwest there is now a great big gulf/strait there sort of like the red sea. How would it affect things if St louis was now ocean front property?

Just some intersting thoughts. I still say the more I think about the way its written makes me doubt the ability of anyone surving on noram continent.

[Jason Richards]

FYI, speaking as a structural engineer, seismic design provisions are stricter in the New Madrid area than anywhere in the country (i.e. we design for greater ground accelerations than anywhere else). I mean... granted, a 1,000 year event would still rip the place apart, but in real life we're ready for an earthquake in that region.

Just a fun fact that most people don't know.

[Aramanthus]

Cool! Thanks for the info Jason. I sort of wondered if they were building stronger down there at New Madrid! Thanks for confirming it!

[Jason Richards]

Cool! Thanks for the info Jason. I sort of wondered if they were building stronger down there at New Madrid! Thanks for confirming it!

Glad I can put that Master's degree to good use, informing gamers on how to make their in-game disasters more realistic.

[Warwolf]

Let us also not forget that there was a lot of UNnatural seismic activity during the cataclysm as well. Heck, look at what happened to Manhattan!

[RockJock]

The biggest issue along the Mississippi is the large number of older masonry buildings, and all the wonderful levies we have built.

[Rahmota]

So this region has better earthquake standards than california? Cool.

Jason I didnt realize that. Considering how many mobile/manufactured homes there are around as well as the standard frame construction around Sw Ohio/SE Indiana. Which is arguablely on the fringes of the NMSZ.

[Jason Richards]

The biggest issue along the Mississippi is the large number of older masonry buildings, and all the wonderful levies we have built.

During the Cataclysm, levies the size of the Hoover Dam wouldn't help. Even the best levies are probably built for a 100 year event or so, anyway.

[Jason Richards]

So this region has better earthquake standards than california? Cool.

Jason I didnt realize that. Considering how many mobile/manufactured homes there are around as well as the standard frame construction around Sw Ohio/SE Indiana. Which is arguablely on the fringes of the NMSZ.

"Better" isn't the way I'd say it. The design standards are more strict.

This is one of the charts found in the International Building Code giving horizontal ground acceleration values for one of the two standard critical frequencies for building response spectra analysis. The numbers aren't really worth a lot without their relative equations, but the map should give you some idea of what the most critical areas are of the coterminal United States. The bigger the number, the higher the design threshold for seismic. As you can see, the Midwest sees substantially higher ground accelerations than California.

California engineering is what drives dynamic response research, though, and their requirements for engineers who design structures are more stringent (it requires an advanced license, but I don't think that anywhere in the Midwest does). Licensing requirements for engineers vary from state to state. After the Northridge quake (a relatively minor quake that, because of its unique frequency, did massive amounts of damage), the entire country (and therefore the world) was forced to change the way it viewed seismic design, and California got the bulk of the research funds, just due to the location of the new test case for all earthquake engineering.

You'll see regular stick-framed houses, mobile homes, and all that in Cali as well as in other high-seismic zones because, basically, those buildings aren't engineered. They're especially not engineered for survivability in the event of an earthquake. There are probably some additional rules for home construction, but they would just be window dressing. The good news is that short, stick-framed houses do okay in an earthquake, I think. Still, I'd rather be in a hospital.

[Aramanthus]

I'm from a place further away in Iowa. I know my old home town would be in a world of hurt if the New Madrid fault opened up with all of it's full potential.

[RockJock]

It is a different type of earthquake from Cali and the New Madrid. One is a contact zone, and the other is a aborted rift zone, different forces acting in different ways.

The huge flooding and cracking rifts will wash away the rubble:)

[tmikesecrist3]

It does state in ce that there where earth quakes even on long quit folt lines, not to mention the shock waves form the yellowston event would rippl throw the new madrend reagion..... thow ppl in tn or ky may know noting about the super valcano

[RockJock]

Kentucky gets the added fun of limestone with more holes then swiss cheese to deal with.

[RockJock]

Muhaha! There is really no place on the globe that is safe from natural disasters. If you don't have earthquakes and volcanoes you have hurricanes, tidal waves, flooding, tornados, and mudslides.

[Xar]

So this region has better earthquake standards than california? Cool.

Jason I didnt realize that. Considering how many mobile/manufactured homes there are around as well as the standard frame construction around Sw Ohio/SE Indiana. Which is arguablely on the fringes of the NMSZ.

"Better" isn't the way I'd say it. The design standards are more strict.

Maybe now. I'm from Poplar Bluff, MO, originally. That's right, Whykin. Most of the structures I grew up seeing and that are still there wouldn't stand up to much. Fortunately, I can only think of a couple of buildings with more than 3 stories in the whole Boot Heel area.

[CushionRide]

my hometown is lacrosse wisconsin and i wonder, if i remember correctly the missisippi river gets a bit larger so my town would probably be underwater in rifts, what i do wonder though is why is there a major nexus in west salem, which is about 5-10 miles east of me.. im curious whats up there that would cause a nexus to form

[RockJock]

First, the town is named New SALEM, which is my first guess at why it has ley line activity:) Who knows, there could be a long lost mound there.

[RockJock]

Duck, just become a Warlock, and don't worry about it:)

[Rahmota]

Ah so newer buildings are required to be (supposed to be) built better able to withstand earthquakes. Interesting. I live in a mobile home on cement block piers tied down with 1" cables attached to steel rebar hooks sunk 3 feet into the ground across the frame. It meets the county building code as of 3 years ago. I don't exactly get the comfortable feeling that in an earthquake that it wouldnt take its name very seriously. Some of the other doublewides and trailers around are not much different. Not to mention like was said a lot of the older buildings in this area are just common fieldstone stacked foundations and wood frames, or just brick and morter. And a lot of the newer buildings are just poured concrete shells with some rebar in them.

So I would have to say that a lot of the buildings around here would be rather fubar. Not to mention bridges and water pipes, buried cables, the water table would be affected etc...

Still very interesting.

[RockJock]

Just sort of an FYI that should have been mentioned before. Most home owners insurance policies don't cover earthquakes. It is like say hurricane, or flood insurance in the since that it is an add on to the general policy.

The biggest single problem that you need to worry about is what happens to sediments when they are shaken. You end up with sort of a quicksand situation called liquefaction which magnifies to force on say a building, or foundation. The biggest destruction in northern California earthquakes is in ares that were built on sediments, but they are relatively small. For a comparison, most of Missouri is built on thick layers of river sediment. Jason might be a better source for this, but I think that most of the bridges over the Mississippi, and Missouri would be in serious trouble with much of a quake. I am sure they are better then they were say 20 years ago, but most of the bridges are not particularly new construction, and it is extremely difficult to retrofit most anti sway systems.

[ZorValachan]

back to the topic of 'forgetting' of the New Madrid Fault.

I found it VERY interesting that St. Louis was one of the last places which was affected by the initial ley line 'bursting'. It's even mentioned in one of the CE books that the general went to Chicago and writes that St. Louis was barely touched.... then a little later a distress signal...then BOOM!!, a 200 mile radius around the city up in flames with hordes of demons.

I came to a hypothesis that maybe all the energy from the ley lines, potential new madrid 'explosion', nearby Cahokia mounds was diverted into the Arch and it absorbed it all continuously like a pressure cooker or steam kettle. then when it finally blew, took out a 200 mile radius and made a rift covering the whole arch (devil's gate) that has lasted for 300 years so far!

As a friend commented to me when Rifts first came out. Makes you wonder why they built the Arch like that..as if it was intended to be a portal into another place.


It gives me ideas for my BTS->CE->Rifts storyline

[RockJock]

Since it was always meant to be a symbolic portal I can buy that some crazy Masons or something built a bit more into it. Maybe a mystic, or descendant of old Atlantis helped guide the construction so it did the simmer as you suggested. It would be a fun hook if nothing else.

[tmikesecrist3]

I can buy that as well haveing seen it.... ok a little bet of back ground about me, I do happen to be a druid a mage and an occoultest. and well I have not come across any refrence, to who built it or why, or any back ground on to the arcatcets to sujest that this is more than concidnce, or even what the it is made out of... but it is.... unnurveing. I know thats decriped but there it is... I did not get close enofe to trouch it, but I would think it would be like trying to object read the stones of stonehindge.... "dont do it". but I do wonder if it has something to do with our freak weather in this part of the contry

[Aramanthus]

I'm from Davenport, IA and live in Racine, WI. I know when the Madrid fault goes it'll be bad in both of these places if it a big one. I hope it doesn't go off in our life time. With our luck it'll go at the same time as Yellowstone.

[Aramanthus]

Interesting. I didn't know it was building back up. Now that is scary. Just a good thing it's not a super volcano.

[RockJock]

As long as the hot spot is still there you will have some sort of vent there. Things get a little more complicated when you involve funky plate margins, but the basic idea still applies. There are quite a few volcanic atolls with blown caldera tops. They are fairly common in the Pacific, but take a look at say Satorini in the Med. Normally, subduction zone volcanoes cause big pyroclastic events, while purely hot spot volcanoes such as Hawaii trend toward lava flows.

Take a look at "The Year Without a Summer" to see what a modern, (relatively speaking) pyroclastic density current/flow can do world wide.

[Aramanthus]

I know it's a fairly big volcano, but I still don't think it fits in the same class as Yellowstone! I hope it doesn't go off in our lifetime!!!

[RockJock]

I posted that more in response to Krakatoa. Basically that there are worst things then Krakatoa. The entire Indian Ocean through to the Pacific is littered with most types of volcanoes. Krakatoa was huge, but didn't have as wide reaching world wide effect as Tambora. The whole Indonesian arc is one of the most, if not the most active volcanic region in the world. The thing is you are dealing with a lot of fairly complex vectors with all the plates coming together nearly on top of each other. The two volcanoes are somewhat related, but they are in two different sections of Indonesia with different subduction sources. It isn't a straight "this is caused by the Australian Plate, or this by the Indian, or even this by the Sumantran Trench.

[Library Ogre]

http://www.volcano.si.edu/world/find_regions.cfm

RockJock probably knows of a map like that... but imagine all of those going off at once.

[RockJock]

Mark, if you really want to get your brain doing some mental back flips start to think about how all of the ring of fire locations interact with each other. Take pressure off one corner, and it builds somewhere else. There is an idea floating out there saying that if we can ever get enough data on all the players then we could accurately predict the exact where, if not the when for major events. Granted, the same is said about predicting weather, all a function of eliminating enough variables to make the mathematics solvable. I do know one thing. I don't want to be around when they all put their angry eyes in at the same time.

[Library Ogre]

Mark, if you really want to get your brain doing some mental back flips start to think about how all of the ring of fire locations interact with each other. Take pressure off one corner, and it builds somewhere else. There is an idea floating out there saying that if we can ever get enough data on all the players then we could accurately predict the exact where, if not the when for major events. Granted, the same is said about predicting weather, all a function of eliminating enough variables to make the mathematics solvable. I do know one thing. I don't want to be around when they all put their angry eyes in at the same time.

Remember, however, that Pre-Rifts Earth was actually somewhat short of all the energy that would take part of that equation. A lot of it was PPE, that might overload an otherwise stable system (i.e. what pre-Rifts scientists thought would happen became much worse, because they couldn't account for the massive influx of energy they didn't know about).

[Aramanthus]

Nice link. Thank you for sharing it. I understand your point. I'm glad that those two volcano's are on different plates. The ring of fire would be a scary event if it all went off at the same moment.

[Aramanthus]

That is quite a list of things nature throws at you all up there in Nova Scotia. I've been told by a relative who went up there and hunted moose that it is a beautiful place to live. I suppose that when nature is unleashed in the coming of the Rift's it's going to be a deadly place to be.

[Aramanthus]

I just saw the thing on the UFO crash at Slag harbor. Very interesting.

[Lt Gargoyle]

The Dooms day people who are looking for a reason to cause mass hesteria and panic. Not to mention destruction.

If you got a match I got the gas and theres the building.

[Aramanthus]

I'm one of those people who don't believe that we are a doomed species. I think we might have problems, but nothing we can't overcome.

[Lt Gargoyle]

I believe that the people in the time of great disasters who are stupid will die. It is also my believe it is the way of the food chain. In the animal kindom the weakest of the Species dies. With the human species we lose the weakest from thier own stupidity. We have few natural predators. So for us it is purly a person with brain power.

But I do see there being those who will trive on the chaos of the situation and throw in with it to watch the world burn.

I'm one of those people who don't believe that we are a doomed species. I think we might have problems, but nothing we can't overcome.

Me either I'm not saying I would risk my life to save others, but i would at least not hinder them.

[Aramanthus]

I agree with what you are saying about the weakest ones and the ones who are only around to cause chaos.

[Lt Gargoyle]

The lack of drinking water. With the heavy ash from the valcanos and the mass earth quakes rerouting rivers and streams, non contaminated drinking water will be in short supply and very high demand.

[Aramanthus]

That is very true, since that is also one of the most important things for survival that we need.