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I was looking back on a character I rolled up recently and noticed something.

After all my attributes were rolled and O.C.C. skills picked, all my attributes received some kind of bonus except one: Physical Beauty.

Of course P.B. doesn't really come into play with most campaigns, but in the interest of common sense, fairness and adding a more fun element to the game, bonuses to P.B seem completely logical.

Physical Beauty should not just mean the symmetrics of your face but also the musculature, leanness (or whatever floats your boat) of the body.

Here are some quick and simple guidelines/suggestions for applying bonuses to P.B.

Any comments or missed skills anyone can think of, let me know. We'll see if we can hammer out something fitting.


Domestic
Dance +2

Physical
Acrobatics +2
Athletics +1
Body Building +2
Boxing +1
Gymnastics +2
Running +1
Swimming +1
Wrestling +1
Aerobic Athletics +1
Kick Boxing +1
Physical Labor +1

I based the numbers loosely on their "real world" effect AND on the physical improvements they provided (ex. Boxing 2, Acrobatics 4, Gymnastics 4).
Body Building is the exception since it is literally building a better body. Wrestling, Running & Athletics could be +2 under these parameters.

The bonuses from Physical skills should either: max out at 6, be cumulative but you only get a +2 bonus once (so if you have Body Building and Gymnastics you get a +2 for one and a +1 for the other- everything else is +1 from there) or stack them till the wheels fall off; who cares it's RIFTS!

Dance is separate under the Domestic skills (a catch to sneak in some extra points). Trained dancers have lean, shaped bodies complimenting the physical form.
(I was thinking while Dancing one could get a 10% bonus to MA or just make it a skilled roll like everything else)

This is the foundation for PB bonuses. No slight is meant to any of the physical skills; if you/the GM wants to adjust the numbers the way you feel, go for it.


Like always, I encourage any comments. Or if anyone knows about this subject having already been brought up, let me know!

Thanks to all!

Yeah PB needs some bonuses, in concept it should apply to the entire body not just the face you're born with.

TheYell wrote:Yeah PB needs some bonuses, in concept it should apply to the entire body not just the face you're born with.

Thanks The Yell! That makes since to me. You are wise and a credit to all humanity!

Hey The Yell! Do you have any suggestion or ideas? Let me know!

Rifter 19 has an article called "Go Mental" which has skills that give bonuses to PB.

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:Rifter 19 has an article called "Go Mental" which has skills that give bonuses to PB.

Drewkitty, always good to hear what you have to say. I'll look into that. Thank you much!!

Strange my copy of HU and HU2 has PB with a charm impress bonus. I have seen different uses for that bonus from being used as a distraction against the opponents to being used as distraction against the heroes.

SpiritInterface wrote:Strange my copy of HU and HU2 has PB with a charm impress bonus. I have seen different uses for that bonus from being used as a distraction against the opponents to being used as distraction against the heroes.

Right. PB does provide a bonus to charm. These bonuses would provide, more than likely, a bonus to that as well. The point of this is nothing increases PB directly. Since there are so many skills that improve the body, there should be.

Characters receive crazy bonuses for so much, why not that?

dread samurai wrote:

SpiritInterface wrote:Strange my copy of HU and HU2 has PB with a charm impress bonus. I have seen different uses for that bonus from being used as a distraction against the opponents to being used as distraction against the heroes.

Right. PB does provide a bonus to charm. These bonuses would provide, more than likely, a bonus to that as well. The point of this is nothing increases PB directly. Since there are so many skills that improve the body, there should be.

Characters receive crazy bonuses for so much, why not that?

Because it is a game that is largely written for combat bonuses and less focus is given to that aspect of that aspect of the game.

Realistically, even with getting physically fit and streamlining one's proportions through physical activities, there is only so much it will actually do to make one look better. Sadly, there are some aspects of beauty that no amount of physical fitness can improve... at least not to the degree that is being suggested by taking these skills (and we all know that sooner or later, a player is going to try to take all of the skills that could improve PB to make a character inhumanly beautiful without the need for a super power... even worse if they take them in addition to such powers).

Sadly, to achieve the dramatic change you think can be done by merely getting physically fit more often requires some form of plastic surgery. Once you get to a certain point of fitness, there is really little that additional physical training will do for your appearance... and in many cases the additional muscle mass one would put on may actually make you less attractive.

Additionally... some things can only be changed by plastic surgery... such as burns and other forms of blemishes (large moles or unattractive birthmarks) that could reduce one's PB... things that no amount of physical fitness can make beautiful.

I would set a limit that the most one's PB can be improved through physical fitness is double the starting attribute (the more beautiful one is to start with, the more one has to work with) to a maximum of PB 20 (which is probably more than would realistically be possible) without cosmetic surgery (which I would also limit to a maximum improvement of 5 pts... again there is a limit to what even a plastic surgeon can realistically improve). This means that even the least attractive starting character (PB 3) could improve to higher average looks (+3 from physical fitness, +5 from extensive cosmetic surgery) to a PB of 11 (12 with the Wardrobe and Grooming skill), while an average person (PB 10) could get movie star looks (+10 from fitness, +5 from surgery, +1 from grooming) for a total PB of 26... and those with already outstanding looks (PB 16+) will see only marginal improvement through fitness, while surgery and grooming are their main ways to improve (and even those are limited in their effectiveness).

Stone Gargoyle wrote:

dread samurai wrote:

SpiritInterface wrote:Strange my copy of HU and HU2 has PB with a charm impress bonus. I have seen different uses for that bonus from being used as a distraction against the opponents to being used as distraction against the heroes.

Right. PB does provide a bonus to charm. These bonuses would provide, more than likely, a bonus to that as well. The point of this is nothing increases PB directly. Since there are so many skills that improve the body, there should be.

Characters receive crazy bonuses for so much, why not that?

Because it is a game that is largely written for combat bonuses and less focus is given to that aspect of that aspect of the game.

True, there is very little that gives bonuses to IQ or MA, there are more things that give an ME bonus. However there are a couple of powers that give PB bonuses. As Stone stated the game is geared for direct combat.

SpiritInterface wrote:

Stone Gargoyle wrote:

dread samurai wrote:

SpiritInterface wrote:Strange my copy of HU and HU2 has PB with a charm impress bonus. I have seen different uses for that bonus from being used as a distraction against the opponents to being used as distraction against the heroes.

Right. PB does provide a bonus to charm. These bonuses would provide, more than likely, a bonus to that as well. The point of this is nothing increases PB directly. Since there are so many skills that improve the body, there should be.

Characters receive crazy bonuses for so much, why not that?

Because it is a game that is largely written for combat bonuses and less focus is given to that aspect of that aspect of the game.

True, there is very little that gives bonuses to IQ or MA, there are more things that give an ME bonus. However there are a couple of powers that give PB bonuses. As Stone stated the game is geared for direct combat.

I said that also. I know the game is designed for combat but they have skills that are for rounding out your character. That's all this is; an additional way to round out your character.

Razorwing wrote:Realistically, even with getting physically fit and streamlining one's proportions through physical activities, there is only so much it will actually do to make one look better. Sadly, there are some aspects of beauty that no amount of physical fitness can improve... at least not to the degree that is being suggested by taking these skills (and we all know that sooner or later, a player is going to try to take all of the skills that could improve PB to make a character inhumanly beautiful without the need for a super power... even worse if they take them in addition to such powers).

Sadly, to achieve the dramatic change you think can be done by merely getting physically fit more often requires some form of plastic surgery. Once you get to a certain point of fitness, there is really little that additional physical training will do for your appearance... and in many cases the additional muscle mass one would put on may actually make you less attractive.

Additionally... some things can only be changed by plastic surgery... such as burns and other forms of blemishes (large moles or unattractive birthmarks) that could reduce one's PB... things that no amount of physical fitness can make beautiful.

I would set a limit that the most one's PB can be improved through physical fitness is double the starting attribute (the more beautiful one is to start with, the more one has to work with) to a maximum of PB 20 (which is probably more than would realistically be possible) without cosmetic surgery (which I would also limit to a maximum improvement of 5 pts... again there is a limit to what even a plastic surgeon can realistically improve). This means that even the least attractive starting character (PB 3) could improve to higher average looks (+3 from physical fitness, +5 from extensive cosmetic surgery) to a PB of 11 (12 with the Wardrobe and Grooming skill), while an average person (PB 10) could get movie star looks (+10 from fitness, +5 from surgery, +1 from grooming) for a total PB of 26... and those with already outstanding looks (PB 16+) will see only marginal improvement through fitness, while surgery and grooming are their main ways to improve (and even those are limited in their effectiveness).

Razorwing, I agree. Logically, exercise can only take you so far. Your ideas are good as well. One of the ideas I stated was only allowing the physical skills to boost you by 6 or 7 points and that's it. That makes the most since.

Then again, it is Rifts and so much is already over the top. Who doesn't take as many skills as they can to boost PP or PS?

Personally, I like the, "max out at 6" & "only getting the 2 point bonus for physical skills once."

Thanks Razorwing, you always have well thought out ideas.

Honestly, like everyone knows PB doesn't really come into play. At most a player/GM might use this if he/she feels clever & would have fun incorporating it into a game.

I got the impression PB in the game referred to one's face. No disrespect, but when I'm say... assessing a girl's physical beauty... I'm looking at more than the face. Whatever you're into, you get my point.

The more over the top for all the more fun it can be for all. It's all to make the characters the most as possible; for anyone that wants.

PB refers to the whole package of how the char looks.

The player is responsible for filling out the details of the exact features (hair/eye/skin pigmentation, hair length, body type, whether or not the char is more hansom, pretty, or beautiful, etc…).

Then there are things like clothing and make-up which can effect the viewer's perceptions. (skills covering these are in the 'Go Mental' article.)

Dragon Queens (woman that are beautiful but have a mean/evil look about them) are a reflection of the char's PB & MA and the char's attitudes. Which again the player is responsible for describing the char's demeanor.

As I stated before I have seen GMs use PB as both a help and hindrance in combat. It all comes down to how imaginative the GM is. Having "well rounded" characters is all well and good but it doesn't mean squat if it isn't used in the game.

*looks at everyone as to remind them to check to see if they have un-viewed PMs*

I like this idea... Though I would simplify it...

Every 3 Physical skills, awards +1 to PB
Or every 4 physical skills, awards +1 to PB (most likely, my choice)

I wouldn't include dance. This limits the amount of bonus to PB directly and would be less than the +6 cap mentioned by the OP (and without all the splanin' about said cap). Also, I agree that physical fitness is one part of beauty, but bone structure is more important (science might prove this too, but I'm too lazy to find the link) that is why I'd be in favor of less bonuses per physical skill taken... Many thanks to the OP though for getting my brain thinkin' on it.