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"Actually, J.H., there are something like 5 Splicers® sourcebooks in the works. The question is, do we release several sourcebooks or do we revamp the core rules first? – KS"

I extracted it from the last weekly update (11-21-2014). I think we should help Kevin with this one so here is the poll.

IMHO: revamp the core rules first, adding ALL the additional released material from the Rifters in one huge SPLICERS Host Armor Edition using the Megaverse Insider program

Release sourcebooks just redo cover art on main

the rifter material we already have access to, if we want it. i vote for releasing more new stuff. the only way i'd favour re-releasing the core book with additional material would be if that was being done by someone other than kevin... the last thing i would want is to add *more* to the bottleneck.

edit: actually, i'm not even clear on what they mean by "revamp the core rules".

so far as i can tell, they're basically up to date with every other palladium setting except for the perception rules. the list of skills doesn't seem to be missing anything. what exactly would they be updating in the first place? as far as it goes, while there are a few things i feel could use tweaking (imo some bio-enhancements are undervalued, and some over, with the result that certain options get picked a lot less often) i can't say that i feel like a core rule revamp feels needed.

if it *would* be all the rifter material that they'd be adding, well, again i'd rather see more new stuff. the stuff we have is awesome, and i would someday love to see a sourcebook of essentially all the rifter material collected (with possibly some re-balancing; no offense to the authors, but some of the rifter stuff just needs a bit of tweaking... like the photon weapons in the gardener article for example are way too good compared to just about everything else - my personal fix would be to remove their special recharge rules from lasers, since that's where most of the problems come from)

I'm Highly in favor of releasing NEW source material as support is clearly and desperately needed. This is the only way Splicers can continue to grow its fanbase, support its devoted following and expand its setting. I am very confident in the material submitted by everyone and with some art already completed, plus a cover for one of the titles, the notion of putting new source material into the hands of Spliceheads seems very feasible.

However, I also see the inevitable dilemma if new source books are released all the while having the current core book remain as is. A newcomer enticed by one of the new sourcebooks learns that they need to also pick up the core book and then it hits them, BAMMMM!... The core book is so dated in comparison to the new sourcebooks, just the art alone can potentially misrepresent this game's presentation and enjoyment.

I'm all for re-doing a cover, updating all the OCCs, Warmounts and some of the machine illustrations (actually already begun ALL of these) and adding more scenario and setting shots. The only other things I can see "fixing" is any errata or unclear rules. Outside of that, I would leave well enough alone and pump this book out, ASAP. It would require VERY little from KS, so no major bottlenecking there and it could draw in new fans for the setting.

Here enters the dilemma with this revamp. If the book is merely an artwork update then how many copies would be purchased by fans whom already have the core book and don't seek new art? This is where new material added makes a revised edition more flavorable to generate "significant" sales and this is also where the KS factor becomes involved and yes that leads to the undesirable bottleneck in PB production in which none of us desire.

My end solution would be to get at least 2-3 source books released in 2015 plus the revised core book before Gen Con. This would lead to a nice relaunch of this game and produce strong results financially and in the fanbase. Following this at least one sourcebook a year thereafter, at least. There is enough source material already written and submitted to fulfill this.

my concern is that "two sourcebooks this year, redo the splicers core book next year, and then another book every year afterwards" is that it completely disregards what palladium has consistently published on a yearly basis. if we got two splicers books next year plus a revised core book, signs point to that being almost all they release for the year. i'd love to see more splicers material. i'd love to see 2 splicers books next year... heck, i'd love to see 5 splicers books next year... but realistically, i don't think we're going to see more than one.

simply put, while some of the material could perhaps use some updating, i really don't see it as being a major issue. i feel like the core rulebook stands up quite well as is, and doesn't really feel like it's lacking anything necessary (which is not the same thing as saying i don't want to see more... i'm just saying it doesn't feel incomplete. more ideas are always welcome).

but then, perhaps i'm in the minority. i for one don't look at the release date of the book i'm about to buy, but if that's something that most people do, i suppose there could be some benefit to revising the core book.

(but i can agree that the cover itself seems to be a problem for most people... i feel like redesigning the cover would be a good idea. my introduction to the setting was actually a rifter article that i bought so i could read up on something else in it, so i never got my first impression from the cover, i got it from the packrat, kraken, and kamikaze missiles ).

This main issue until Robotech RPG Tactics is done and or other book are done like books for BSN source book
and PF sourcebook are done think Splicers is going be last thing company worried about at this time.BSN is been wait for
source book Tome Grotesque Beyond Arcanum.Far longer than us and there pre orders on them as we speak.
Think we be wait at less other 2 yrs before company to us Splicerhead it sad truth but still got the rifters.

I voted more material.... but also what Chuck said about polishing up the core book

Shark_Force wrote:my concern is that "two sourcebooks this year, redo the splicers core book next year, and then another book every year afterwards" is that it completely disregards what palladium has consistently published on a yearly basis. if we got two splicers books next year plus a revised core book, signs point to that being almost all they release for the year. i'd love to see more splicers material. i'd love to see 2 splicers books next year... heck, i'd love to see 5 splicers books next year... but realistically, i don't think we're going to see more than one.

simply put, while some of the material could perhaps use some updating, i really don't see it as being a major issue. i feel like the core rulebook stands up quite well as is, and doesn't really feel like it's lacking anything necessary (which is not the same thing as saying i don't want to see more... i'm just saying it doesn't feel incomplete. more ideas are always welcome).

but then, perhaps i'm in the minority. i for one don't look at the release date of the book i'm about to buy, but if that's something that most people do, i suppose there could be some benefit to revising the core book.

(but i can agree that the cover itself seems to be a problem for most people... i feel like redesigning the cover would be a good idea. my introduction to the setting was actually a rifter article that i bought so i could read up on something else in it, so i never got my first impression from the cover, i got it from the packrat, kraken, and kamikaze missiles ).

SharkForce, I agree that the push for new material outweighs the need for a revised core edition as well. I agree that the core book does stand very well as written. My goal regarding the core book is updating the artwork so that new Spliceheads arent detered by the old cover and artwork. This would likely be their next purchase if they were attracted to a new sourcebook.There is a ton of difference between what is visually represented and what can be currently done. If there is errata within the first edition then it too could be corrected. Not suggesting that there needs to be any major rewrites at all. I have already begun revised illustrations for the core book's OCCs, Warmounts and some machines. I did this in hopes of a new edition plus to boost interest in some of the other OCCs, warmounts and adversaries that seem to need some visual boosting to increase usage. I do believe that 2015 can be a fantastic year for Splicers and be just as prolific to crank out as Dead Reign is for PB.

darkguyver wrote:This main issue until Robotech RPG Tactics is done and or other book are done like books for BSN source book
and PF sourcebook are done think Splicers is going be last thing company worried about at this time.BSN is been wait for
source book Tome Grotesque Beyond Arcanum.Far longer than us and there pre orders on them as we speak.
Think we be wait at less other 2 yrs before company to us Splicerhead it sad truth but still got the rifters.

I understand the concern for BTS support but Splicers is already written for multiple productions to be published and just like Dead Reign, could prove to be an addition to the production capital income for PB versus heavier workloads. BTS requires more comprehensive writing to be completed whereas Splicers is ahead of the game as far as written material, plus some art to boot.

Please don't waste your time revamping the core book.

Give us new material.

--flatline

Premier wrote:

darkguyver wrote:This main issue until Robotech RPG Tactics is done and or other book are done like books for BSN source book
and PF sourcebook are done think Splicers is going be last thing company worried about at this time.BSN is been wait for
source book Tome Grotesque Beyond Arcanum.Far longer than us and there pre orders on them as we speak.
Think we be wait at less other 2 yrs before company to us Splicerhead it sad truth but still got the rifters.

I understand the concern for BTS support but Splicers is already written for multiple productions to be published and just like Dead Reign, could prove to be an addition to the production capital income for PB versus heavier workloads. BTS requires more comprehensive writing to be completed whereas Splicers is ahead of the game as far as written material, plus some art to boot.

Me and wife talk we happy be insider for this this by far is Fav rpg ever and do anything support it.

After reading all the comments I have changed my vote: release the sourcebooks first and if you can, just update the cover and interior art of the main book (Premier advice).

Let the body grow then replace the heart. So yes for the source books.

Sourcebooks then the core revision. The main book revision shouldn't take more than a month to clean up discrepancies, make additions and typeset it. The real issue would be new art, but I'm certain Chuck has a good amount already done.

The Galactus Kid wrote:Sourcebooks then the core revision. The main book revision shouldn't take more than a month to clean up discrepancies, make additions and typeset it. The real issue would be new art, but I'm certain Chuck has a good amount already done.

This,
Plus with a solid Splicers Contributors Squad (SCS) and the best Supporting Fanbase I have seen, is why I feel very confident in the amount of quality product that can be cranked out.

Premier wrote:

The Galactus Kid wrote:Sourcebooks then the core revision. The main book revision shouldn't take more than a month to clean up discrepancies, make additions and typeset it. The real issue would be new art, but I'm certain Chuck has a good amount already done.

This,
Plus with a solid Splicers Contributors Squad (SCS) and the best Supporting Fanbase I have seen, is why I feel very confident in the amount of quality product that can be cranked out.

We got this Splice will flow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Premier wrote:

The Galactus Kid wrote:Sourcebooks then the core revision. The main book revision shouldn't take more than a month to clean up discrepancies, make additions and typeset it. The real issue would be new art, but I'm certain Chuck has a good amount already done.

This,
Plus with a solid Splicers Contributors Squad (SCS) and the best Supporting Fanbase I have seen, is why I feel very confident in the amount of quality product that can be cranked out.

Here here and the Splicers Contributors Squad .... I like that

I am definitely doing my best to add more to Splicers.
The TJ book is nearly completed.
Ive started House of the Red Sands (it will take a bit longer than I anticipated unfortunately)
Im writing a ton of other ideas down for even more Splicer projects

I love this game

Still work on demo kit some of people got school so might be some delays

So look at was going put out next 6 and working Chaos earth stuff.What going take for us get book out

Step one, get some source books out there
Step two, make sure that people honestly feel that this is a 'live' project and not just another dead end
THEN a distant step three you can revise the core rule book.
Honestly though, most of the 'revisions' would make me, as a fan unhappy. I already bought the book, and now I am being told that, before any NEW material comes out, that I should pony up another 30-40 bucks for another copy? Of the newest most up to date core book?
If there are some 'corrections' that need to be made.....well An official Article in the Rifter combined with an Errata page on the Cutting Room Floor would solve 99% of those.
If there is some new material that you want in the core book.....sounds like the makings of a 96pg splat book (which I would happily buy) rather than a revised Core Book (which I likely would never buy until forced)

eliakon wrote:Step one, get some source books out there
Step two, make sure that people honestly feel that this is a 'live' project and not just another dead end
THEN a distant step three you can revise the core rule book.
Honestly though, most of the 'revisions' would make me, as a fan unhappy. I already bought the book, and now I am being told that, before any NEW material comes out, that I should pony up another 30-40 bucks for another copy? Of the newest most up to date core book?
If there are some 'corrections' that need to be made.....well An official Article in the Rifter combined with an Errata page on the Cutting Room Floor would solve 99% of those.
If there is some new material that you want in the core book.....sounds like the makings of a 96pg splat book (which I would happily buy) rather than a revised Core Book (which I likely would never buy until forced)

I agree

More stuff.

Unless you are making a second edition of something, consolidating info isnt needed. Its nice, if you are already doing another project that calls for it...but if there is already 5 books worth of stuff collecting dust waiting to be released...release it already! I already have the Rifters...

Ya hope we get something just bugs me that will now known how BSN and Nightbane fan feel lol.

Having just reread the splicers main book I think the book itself is excellent and really not in any dire need of any revisions. It could use a new cover as much as I love Johnny Z's art and its a fine painting it just does not provide a great hook into the weirdness that is splicers.

I think if they did a cover update release of the main book at the same time as or within a month of a new source book you could get a lot of people to give it that crucial second look and purchase. It really is one of the most fun of the palladium settings. The main book is also really nice currently as it gives enough of the enemy forces information and player information to be a great one item resource to start a nicely fleshed out campaign.

kaid wrote:Having just reread the splicers main book I think the book itself is excellent and really not in any dire need of any revisions. It could use a new cover as much as I love Johnny Z's art and its a fine painting it just does not provide a great hook into the weirdness that is splicers.

I think if they did a cover update release of the main book at the same time as or within a month of a new source book you could get a lot of people to give it that crucial second look and purchase. It really is one of the most fun of the palladium settings. The main book is also really nice currently as it gives enough of the enemy forces information and player information to be a great one item resource to start a nicely fleshed out campaign.

I do agree with everyone regarding the revision of the core book - to some degree-.
However, when I reviewed the older threads when SPLICERS was first released in 2004, there "appears" to be a few minor issues that some general census seemed to post about, that can be easily rectified with a few pages here and there. I have already devised easy fixes for these issues, some that could be implemented in the core book and others that have been imputed into the submitted material. This would require very little time, being the point.

Re: the cover,
I will be more than thrilled to do a cover for the core book. Already have a few ideas in mind. The original cover was actually done by Mark Evans and from what I recollect, there weren't any final designs for Splicers so he went off of what he felt conveyed the written setting. Perhaps at that time he had not seen Guyver, Genocyber, or the like? Perhaps he purposely chose to go the opposite direction of the bio-armor aesthetic into something more scientifically founded? Not sure, but I can say, that because of it, the Proto Dread Armor was devised; and with it a 3rd path for Splicers armor that could be utilized.

Might I also add, that since 2004, I have begun updating the artwork for the Core O.C.C.s, War Mounts, some of the Robots/Drones plus began devising illustrations for the original bio-weapons/enhancements, in hopes of making the core book a bit more tempting, I hope.

Now with all that said, I still vote for also releasing the newly submitted material first and foremost. While these titles are being released, retool - what is necessary - for the core book (nothing major nor extensive) and let it fly as well. So much quality is in the pipeline and this game deserves the support.

Do anyone got and release date for books for this game line for 2015

the only kind of release dates we're likely to get before the books go to the printers are innacurate ones, unfortunately. kevin siembieda is an amazing author, and creates incredible settings... but accurately predicting when something will be finished is not one of his strong points if past experience is any kind of indication.

Premier wrote:I do agree with everyone regarding the revision of the core book - to some degree-.
However, when I reviewed the older threads when SPLICERS was first released in 2004, there "appears" to be a few minor issues that some general census seemed to post about, that can be easily rectified with a few pages here and there. I have already devised easy fixes for these issues, some that could be implemented in the core book and others that have been imputed into the submitted material. This would require very little time, being the point.

And some of the discrepancies have already been addressed in some of the exisiting material from Rifter 50. I know that there were some minor changes here that were called out with the page number in the original Splicers book.

Any new version of the main book might also have additional material for the existing O.C.C.s like the packmaster information from Rifter 59. Alternitively, this information may be left for other smaller sourcebooks.

darkguyver wrote:Do anyone got and release date for books for this game line for 2015

I'm hoping that at least one will be available for GenCon.

The Galactus Kid wrote:

darkguyver wrote:Do anyone got and release date for books for this game line for 2015

I'm hoping that at least one will be available for GenCon.

POH 2015 will be an excellent opportunity to talk to Kevin about the importance of "giving the reins" of the SPLICERS line to people like you, Premier, etc. Otherwise, we will remain in limbo forever...I am making it, my personal mission to try to convince him of how to handle the future of SPLICERS. It's time to reset the future No more "hoping"...

ffranceschi wrote:

The Galactus Kid wrote:

darkguyver wrote:Do anyone got and release date for books for this game line for 2015

I'm hoping that at least one will be available for GenCon.

POH 2015 will be an excellent opportunity to talk to Kevin about the importance of "giving the reins" of the SPLICERS line to people like you, Premier, etc. Otherwise, we will remain in limbo forever...I am making it, my personal mission to try to convince him of how to handle the future of SPLICERS. It's time to reset the future No more "hoping"...

Sounds good to me!

it's not like the splicers books are any more in limbo than the other books. sure, they haven't come out yet. i've just recently reread my copy of rifter #50 and noticed that there are books that they had announced as coming out in that year which still haven't come out, iirc including even rifts.

when kevin says we're going to see several splicers books this year and it doesn't happen, it's not because the splicers books got pushed back a dozen times. it's because he thought he was going to get 12-20 books done this year, but he only got 3-4 books done.

that said, it sounds like a good idea to let him know you're still interested

i'm just saying don't feel like we're being singled out as far as not getting books published that were promised. it's basically entirely because kevin is extremely optimistic about how many books will come out every year, year after year.

Shark_Force wrote:that said, it sounds like a good idea to let him know you're still interested

i'm just saying don't feel like we're being singled out as far as not getting books published that were promised. it's basically entirely because kevin is extremely optimistic about how many books will come out every year, year after year.

I know, but the key here is to convince him that he let this particular and so far, not too successful (from a sales point of view IMHO) line to be handled by others, just like an experiment (it could also help other lines, but it´s not my main goal). He has nothing to loose (I will suggest him to do a Megaversal Insider or Kickstarter) and we have too much to gain

ffranceschi wrote:

Shark_Force wrote:that said, it sounds like a good idea to let him know you're still interested

i'm just saying don't feel like we're being singled out as far as not getting books published that were promised. it's basically entirely because kevin is extremely optimistic about how many books will come out every year, year after year.

I know, but the key here is to convince him that he let this particular and so far, not too successful (from a sales point of view IMHO) line to be handled by others, just like an experiment (it could also help other lines, but it´s not my main goal). He has nothing to loose (I will suggest him to do a Megaversal Insider or Kickstarter) and we have too much to gain

I know that in the meantime, we should get a lot more Splicers love in the Rifter coming up. I have two articles which will probably be in this year, both previews of things upcoming.

Sorry but think got hope to soon there been no words or cover art put in Palladium Books Weekly Update – March 27, 2015.About Splicers mean there All type of Riftes books came out but none talk of Splicers.I given up on it

darkguyver wrote:Sorry but think got hope to soon there been no words or cover art put in Palladium Books Weekly Update – March 27, 2015.About Splicers mean there All type of Riftes books came out but none talk of Splicers.I given up on it

Don't give up on Splicers mate
Myself, Galactus & GuyLedouche are in final edits for the TJ sourcebook, that we hope to submit in the next month or less

I have started my Rifter article: House of the Red Sands, and i will submit it in a few months (started it later than planned)

I would not give up hope when we are finally starting to see movement on a bunch of fronts with finally a new palladium RPG book just came out and is excellent quality. Palladium seems like their pace is picking up a bit and the quality of their stuff over the last few years has been excellent. Really hope splicers gets a nice splashy relaunch is its one of the most different settings out there and has a lot of nifty stuff.

krispy wrote:

darkguyver wrote:Sorry but think got hope to soon there been no words or cover art put in Palladium Books Weekly Update – March 27, 2015.About Splicers mean there All type of Riftes books came out but none talk of Splicers.I given up on it

Don't give up on Splicers mate
Myself, Galactus & GuyLedouche are in final edits for the TJ sourcebook, that we hope to submit in the next month or less

I have started my Rifter article: House of the Red Sands, and i will submit it in a few months (started it later than planned)

This!!!

There should be some more Splicers material in Rifters coming up and maybe even previews of upcoming source material.

So, one of the best ways to show love for Splicers would have been getting people to run games at the Open House- but only 2 Splicers games were submitted. After the Bomb has 5....
There are a few open slots- but the schedule closes soon- get those games in!!
See the Open House Forum for when the slots are here

Now that RIFTS is "expanding" into another company and system (Savage Worlds), my idea of talking to Kevin about releasing the SPLICERS line seems not so out of reach

On another topic: there are only two SPLICERS games for POH and I hope I can get to play in both!