Antimatter Created at LHC

[Nadrakas]

For those who are interested, the LHC (Large Hadron Collider) were able to create an atom of anti-hydrogen and hold it long enough to be studied. Here is the link http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/eu_switzerland_antimatter

According to a show on the Science Channel, it would take 15 years to produce 1 Gram of Anti-Matter. According to the show that would be enough to destroy a large city (NYC, London, Beijing, etc).

Now, a couple of Pre-Rifts Questions:

1. Where did the NAA build their LHC? Who would be in charge? A seperate agency or NEMA?

2. With the "Golden Age" of cooperation and then the big "breakup" and "mistrust" that followed - not to mention the "New Cold War" - how long before someone built an "Anti-Matter Bomb"?

3. Has Anti-Matter been harnesed to visit the Inner and Outer Solar system (Ala the Rifter adventure for visiting Saturn - can't remember the issue or adventure name at the moment, and I don't have my books in front of me...)

Anyway, "Helmsman, Warp Factor 9."



~ N

[Spinachcat]

Real life is always a problem for sci-fi. What's cutting edge in 2000 is kinda goofy in 2010 and totally retro in 2020.

It's easier to take Chaos Earth as an alternate Earth with its own history than try to make it conform to our own history. Heck, my next Chaos Earth campaign will be on a post-Systems Failure Earth! That's why MDC weapons exist. Man had to make them to wipe out the Bugz!

[glitterboy2098]

1. Where did the NAA build their LHC? Who would be in charge? A seperate agency or NEMA?

well, considering Fermilab in Batavia, IL (near chicago) has been playing around with antimatter since the 1980's, and is only scheduled to stop in 2011 because CERN is more potent...

the only reason CERN is more potent is because it was made bigger, which allows more velocity to be imparted on the particles. but that was a limitation of the electromagnetic control and accellerator tech we have now. by the golden age, with high energy particle beams shrunk down to handheld size and roomtemp superconductors appretly realized...refitting the Tevatron would give it levels above CERN's current ones. why build a new one when you can just refit an existing model?

2. With the "Golden Age" of cooperation and then the big "breakup" and "mistrust" that followed - not to mention the "New Cold War" - how long before someone built an "Anti-Matter Bomb"?

probably "never within the given timeframe". producing antimatter isn't hard. heck, we use it every day for PET scans. the problem is containment of antimatter. magnetic feild generators capable of doing it are massively bulky, even if we had roomtemp superconductors. and concepts like fullerined antimatter have yet to be proven viable.

3. Has Anti-Matter been harnesed to visit the Inner and Outer Solar system (Ala the Rifter adventure for visiting Saturn - can't remember the issue or adventure name at the moment, and I don't have my books in front of me...)

as per Mutants in orbit? no. making an antimatter rocket is actually harder than making an antimatter bomb. bombs are supposed to explode...rockets aren't.

[Nadrakas]

Real life is always a problem for sci-fi. What's cutting edge in 2000 is kinda goofy in 2010 and totally retro in 2020.

It's easier to take Chaos Earth as an alternate Earth with its own history than try to make it conform to our own history. Heck, my next Chaos Earth campaign will be on a post-Systems Failure Earth! That's why MDC weapons exist. Man had to make them to wipe out the Bugz!

Ummm...All of Chaos Earth is, by definition, an "Alternate Earth." For my Stories I like to keep enough "real Earth" History & facts in it to keep it "real & understandable" to the players - especially for a Post Apocalypse setting. Afterall, a world where the British Empire is still ruling the world when the Rifts hit in 2098 would be a loooot different later on (If you follow anything close to Canon...).

(Hmmm...British Empire....a lost British Company of soldiers from the French and Indian wars gets Rifted forward in time to the future - either sometime after the Rifts hit or sometime during the "Rifts Earth" time frame.)

Anyway...everyone runs their own game in a manner that works for them and their players. As long as everyone is having fun, it's cool.


~ N

[Nadrakas]

1. Where did the NAA build their LHC? Who would be in charge? A seperate agency or NEMA?

well, considering Fermilab in Batavia, IL (near chicago) has been playing around with antimatter since the 1980's, and is only scheduled to stop in 2011 because CERN is more potent...

the only reason CERN is more potent is because it was made bigger, which allows more velocity to be imparted on the particles. but that was a limitation of the electromagnetic control and accellerator tech we have now. by the golden age, with high energy particle beams shrunk down to handheld size and roomtemp superconductors appretly realized...refitting the Tevatron would give it levels above CERN's current ones. why build a new one when you can just refit an existing model?

As for Fermilabs creating "Antimatter"...please see Answer # Two.

Granted, the controlling technology would more powerful and efficient, but when it comes to building an "Anti-Matter" bomb, the DOE, who is the controlling agency for all Nuclear Weapons and by extension any "Anti-Matter" weapons, would probably want to keep it a lot quieter than having it at Fermilab (The University of Chicago & University Research Organization are part of the operating staff there...too many people who do not "need to know."). I was thinking New Mexico (DOE is already there) or perhaps Nevada (Area 51) would be other choices. Don't get me wrong, Fermilab would be a good choice for "upgrading" for other research projects...just not building an "Anti-Matter" bomb. Doesn't mean that, even if one or more were built, that they were deployed...so they may still be out there somewhere, waiting to be found (Then again...wasn't there a huge Radioactive area in southern New Mexico right after the coming of the Rifts?)

2. With the "Golden Age" of cooperation and then the big "breakup" and "mistrust" that followed - not to mention the "New Cold War" - how long before someone built an "Anti-Matter Bomb"?

probably "never within the given timeframe". producing antimatter isn't hard. heck, we use it every day for PET scans. the problem is containment of antimatter. magnetic feild generators capable of doing it are massively bulky, even if we had roomtemp superconductors. and concepts like fullerined antimatter have yet to be proven viable.

Hmmm...I don't like to say never on too many things. Tends to backfire sometime -- Titanic being unsinkable; Man will never fly; Tanks are a Fad; Can't build a Nuclear Bomb; Never go faster than a horse; An actor (or an African American) will never be President; etc.

As an Example: On August 2, 1939 Albert Einstein, in consultation with Leó Szilárd, Enrico Fermi (FERMILABs is named after him), Edward Teller and Eugene Wigner, sent President Roosevelt a letter describing - in layman terms - the concept of a Nuclear Chain reaction and there ability to be harnessed into bombs. Roosevelt found it of "such import" that he set up a board, headed by the military, to pursue an Atomic Bomb. August 7, 1945 the United States dropped Atomic Bombs on Hiroshima, Japan - 6 years and 5 days after Einstein sent his letter to Roosevelt, a phenomenal development. A link to an exchange of letters and notes can be found at http://docs.fdrlibrary.marist.edu/psf/box5/folo64.html.

__________

You mentioned both Fermi (Tevitron) and PET.

The Tevitron at Fermi: The Tevitron does create Antiprotons, but it doesn't, by strict definition, create Antimatter. Specifically it uses a portion of a diverted Proton Beam to create the Antiprotons. Once they have enough Antiprotons they load them up in the Tevatron and wait for the fireworks to begin. The information can be found at http://www.fnal.gov/pub/science/accelerator/, specifically under "The Accelerator Chain."

The Positron Emission Tomography (PET): You stated that "we use it every day." If you will forgive me - and I really don't mean to quibble - but, technically when the PET is used, it generates an Antiparticle which is just one part of Antimater, just as a Particle is just one part of Matter. I'll reference the following URL: http://www.positron.edu.au/faq.html#faq3

I apologize if I seem to be splitting hairs, but there is a big difference in particle physics when it comes to creating Antiprotons or Antiparticle, and creating Antimatter, which includes Antiprotons and Antiparticles.

URL located at http://www.positron.edu.au/faq.html#faq5.


Positron: A positron is the antiparticle of the electron. It has the same mass but opposite charge (positive instead of negative). When it annihilates with an electron, they turn into gamma rays.

Antimatter: The world is made up of matter in the form of (mostly) atoms and molecules. Of course, atoms themselves can be broken down into several fundamental particles, the proton, neutron and electron..........For every matter particle, there is a corresponding antiparticle — these antiparticles collectively are what we know as antimatter. They have properties that are similar but opposite to their corresponding matter particles — for example the same mass and the same magnitude but opposite sign of charge. When a particle and its antiparticle meet, they annihilate — disappearing in a burst of energy.

Sorry...CERN created Antimatter first...at least among Humans that is.

3. Has Anti-Matter been harnesed to visit the Inner and Outer Solar system (Ala the Rifter adventure for visiting Saturn - can't remember the issue or adventure name at the moment, and I don't have my books in front of me...)

as per Mutants in orbit? no. making an antimatter rocket is actually harder than making an antimatter bomb. bombs are supposed to explode...rockets aren't.

Yes, according to MIO, they don't exist. A bomb vs a rocket...hmmm...with current missile technology, if we had the right containment technology scaled down to fit in the tip of a missile along with enough Antimatter, then I wouldn't see why a missile wouldn't be a viable weapon. Yes, it's harder to make (electronic guidance systems) than a bomb (Which can be "dumb"), but a missile would a preferred method of delivery...especially if you were the one ordered to drop the Big-A (ntimatter) Bomb. Of course, the Political Will needs to be there to build an Antimatter Bomb...and an International Crisis or two...or three...or more, along with worldwide Political uncertainty, regional wars erupting, cats and dogs sleeping together, and a whole slew of other things going on might just be the thing to spur on investigation into Antimatter Weapons by someone...and not necessarily the US -- could be the EU, the Soviet Union (Hmmm...big, uninhabitable place in the SE near where the old USSR tested their Nukes...), China, etc.

As for MIO...there was so little information, IMO, that I don't see why one of the orbitting communities couldn't be working on something like this (Probably CAN...durn Moon Nazi's!!! ). Heck, the Orbital communities must have methods to monitor Earth based communications. If so, then they are aware of some of the things going on in Rifts Earth...that might spur them to move from "Containment of the Planet" to "Sterilization of the Planet." One good look at Atlantis would scare many people to start dropping rocks on the Splugarth's head.

Anyway, thank you for reading (or not...)

(/soapbox)


~ N ~

[glitterboy2098]

antimatter bombs just aren't efficent enough compared to regular nukes unti lyou get to "space opera" levels of handwave technology, like phaseworld.

Antimatter (be it just antiparticle or actual antiatoms) requires extremely powerful magnetic containment. it doesn't matter how dense the antimatter itself is, since the denser it is, the stronger the contaiment, and thus the heavier and bulkier the containment unit. your looking at, even with 'golden age' type tech, a couple of tons to hold a few micrograms. at best. several times more massive than a nuke of the same rough explosive yeild. and with antimatter, you have to power it continuously...if it loses power or a any part goes out .. "boom". whereas Nukes don't require power while being stored, and if something breaks..it just doesn't work any more.