Alternate Timelines

[Tor]

I could see that happening in the comics but the cartoons seemed too PG for that.

[taalismn]

I could see that happening in the comics but the cartoons seemed too PG for that.

Sorry, I was using 'cartoon' and 'comic' interchangeably, though the proper term for the motion-action media would be 'animation'(after all, 'political cartoons' are understood to be static media ).

[SolCannibal]

There we go. An alternate universe where all the Rifter material exists in Rifts Earth. It either exists in the context the article was written in, or if it conflicts it is something that was rifted in. Everything from the Rifter is here, including the events of all the stories and adventures.

Some of which may require duplicate and co-existing persons and organizations. Let the dimensional avatar wars begin!

Considering the presence of Fadetowns and temporal disruptions like those in Dinossaur Swamp, co-existing duplicates in Rifts Earth ain't even all that improbable as a thing. Bring it!

Also - ALL Rifter material, even those of different settings like Palladium, BtS, HS and others? Could make things interesting.

[Glistam]

The Golden Age of Man was not a time of technological innovation, but rather a period where magic was re-discovered and began to flourish across the globe. Though magical energies were low this clean, renewable resource which was proven to exist (and, it was discovered, was theorized by Victor Lazlo a century earlier and his books see a resurgence in sales) paves the way for a Golden Age of Man. Spells are unearthed, discovered and in some rare cases, successfully created! The logic of science bears down upon the nature of magic and great strides are made in this abundant, yet low-powered, resource.

The coming of the Rifts in this timeline was not caused by the spark of conflict, but rather by a botched (or wildly successful...?) ritual experiment which sought to augment the power of the Ley Lines. The results prove disastrous for Humanity but with magic already at their disposal they are better able to fend off the inhuman invaders and deal with the portals which constantly appear everywhere. Though modern society collapses the dark ages only last about 80 years before society begins to recover and rebuild. From the ashes of the old world rise the beginnings of a new world, powered by the now crazy-powerful magical energy engulfing the planet.

Dimensionally displaced visitors bring with them knowledge of magic that humankind had lost. Some of the budding societies embrace it, while others shun it and focus on the human innovation which was interrupted by the Dimensional Storm (this world's term for the Coming of the Rifts), while some others move away from magic entirely and begin to focus solely on technology again.

The results 200 years later ("modern day" in Rifts) are three basic factions:

• Those that innovated with magic to become Techno-Wizards, Shifters, Chaos Mages, and other non-traditional type mages.
• Those that stuck to established magical traditions to become Sorcerers, Arcanists, Ley Line Walkers, Mystics, Diabolists, Summoners, and other traditional style mages
• Those who shunned all magic to embrace technology to become the equivalent of the Coalition (though with lower tech levels, on par with what in normal Rifts would be Northern Gun's tech levels).
• Then there's also those caught in the middle, who don't identify fully with any one faction.

[taalismn]

[Considering the presence of Fadetowns and temporal disruptions like those in Dinossaur Swamp, co-existing duplicates in Rifts Earth ain't even all that improbable as a thing. Bring it!
.

Thanks for reminding me of the possibilities of fadetowns.

[Jefffar]

Just a reminder to keep to the topic at hand folks. If you wanted to discuss something else, such as, say, the official status of material in the Rifters, I recommend starting alternate threads to do so.

[taalismn]

Atlantis has been set up from the very beginning as a trap meant to lure in the Splugorth and their allies. Once a sufficient number of Splugorth and their minions/associates have settled on Atlantis, and reached a certain 'critical mass of evil', the island-nation will mystically self-destruct, dissolving into the underlying dimensional matrix. The alien intelligence who set this doesn't particularly care about the collateral damage(the millions of innocent slaves that will also be killed, nor the unbalancing of power on Rifts Earth), just that an ancient score with the Splugorth will be settled, or the equivalent of a full roach motel disposed of.

[Zer0 Kay]

Just a reminder to keep to the topic at hand folks. If you wanted to discuss something else, such as, say, the official status of material in the Rifters, I recommend starting alternate threads to do so.

THANK YOU!!

[taalismn]

The New German Republic invades England with an eye towards denying the use of the island to the Splugorth for purposes of supplying the Gargoyles. Now German garrison-towns dot southern England, and German is becoming the trade language of choice amongst the English. Patriots of 'Merry Old England' however, continue to defy the German mecha-knights.

[eliakon]

The real King Arthur returns in his nations hour of need. He rallies the various forces and England pulls through the dark ages intact. This means that England never falls from being a Golden Age level nation, and the assistance of the British knights and the RAF turn the tide in the France, preventing the Gargoyles from ever establishing themselves. Europe's success as a bastion of humanity and technology means that the orbital community doesn't sever their links with the Euro down station.

[Bill]

The New German Republic invades England with an eye towards denying the use of the island to the Splugorth for purposes of supplying the Gargoyles. Now German garrison-towns dot southern England, and German is becoming the trade language of choice amongst the English. Patriots of 'Merry Old England' however, continue to defy the German mecha-knights.

This needs a post-apocalyptic hero taking on the identity of Robin Hood and an actual lost WWII RAF squadron reappearing to battle the Hun on the homefront.

[SolCannibal]

[Considering the presence of Fadetowns and temporal disruptions like those in Dinossaur Swamp, co-existing duplicates in Rifts Earth ain't even all that improbable as a thing. Bring it!

Thanks for reminding me of the possibilities of fadetowns.

You're welcome. So don't forget kids... Remember Fadetowns!!!

Hard to believe this due to CS pro-human anti-alien tendencies, unless Naruni had the good sense to only use human or human-disguised merchants.

Then if the d-bee secret every came out, by that time the CS may have figured out how to make force fields or at least stockpiled them and suddenly all the SAMAS out there have them

One, the CS back then in Joseph's time was not quite as paranoid and distrusting as it is under Karls rule.

Two, the Uteni have limited shapechanging powers - they would still be blue and bald, but could be a step up or two....

Three, such a deal with the current CS almost happened, if not for NE refusal to sign for exclusivity in the sale of products - i think it is mentioned in passing on either Mercenaries or Naruni Wave, would check it if i had the books with me. Anyway even without hindsight that was kind of a bad move in NE's part, as not many other groups in Rifts Earth could buy hardware in the scale of the CS and none that would be quite as close and willing to take on a potential rival for them like Splynn's Atlantis...

[taalismn]

The New German Republic invades England with an eye towards denying the use of the island to the Splugorth for purposes of supplying the Gargoyles. Now German garrison-towns dot southern England, and German is becoming the trade language of choice amongst the English. Patriots of 'Merry Old England' however, continue to defy the German mecha-knights.

This needs a post-apocalyptic hero taking on the identity of Robin Hood and an actual lost WWII RAF squadron reappearing to battle the Hun on the homefront.

Or the return of Margaret Thatcher as a mutant able to turn herself into living iron.

[Zer0 Kay]

The New German Republic invades England with an eye towards denying the use of the island to the Splugorth for purposes of supplying the Gargoyles. Now German garrison-towns dot southern England, and German is becoming the trade language of choice amongst the English. Patriots of 'Merry Old England' however, continue to defy the German mecha-knights.

This needs a post-apocalyptic hero taking on the identity of Robin Hood and an actual lost WWII RAF squadron reappearing to battle the Hun on the homefront.

Or the return of Margaret Thatcher as a mutant able to turn herself into living iron.

har de har har

Lol just made me think of something a mass driver named Ralph it goes bang, zoom, right to the moon

[taalismn]

"What do you mean, the last outpost of the British Empire that still survived and is loyal to us is the Falklands?"
"Well, it seems several RAF and RN units holed up there when it was protected from the tidal waves of Atlantis rising by ley line energies, and well, the ley lines also mutated the resident penguins, seals, and sheep, that think they're British citizens. They'd somehow managed to fight off anybody who claims otherwise."
"Have the Silver River Republics contested this?"
"Not a peep from them, ma'am. They may not believe the islands still exist."
"Well, we'll take what we can get, I guess."

[Zer0 Kay]

"What do you mean, the last outpost of the British Empire that still survived and is loyal to us is the Falklands?"
"Well, it seems several RAF and RN units holed up there when it was protected from the tidal waves of Atlantis rising by ley line energies, and well, the ley lines also mutated the resident penguins, seals, and sheep, that think they're British citizens. They'd somehow managed to fight off anybody who claims otherwise."
"Have the Silver River Republics contested this?"
"Not a peep from them, ma'am. They may not believe the islands still exist."
"Well, we'll take what we can get, I guess."

har har, so I take the Caribou of the Netherlands can now fly and some occasionally have glowing noses.

[taalismn]

[

har har, so I take the Caribou of the Netherlands can now fly and some occasionally have glowing noses.

The irradiated ones, maybe.
Cherenkov radiation.
(this reminds me of some of the jokes about traces of fallout from Soviet nuclear tests near the Arctic Circle showing up in the moss eaten by Laplander livestock...)

[SolCannibal]

The New German Republic invades England with an eye towards denying the use of the island to the Splugorth for purposes of supplying the Gargoyles. Now German garrison-towns dot southern England, and German is becoming the trade language of choice amongst the English. Patriots of 'Merry Old England' however, continue to defy the German mecha-knights.

This needs a post-apocalyptic hero taking on the identity of Robin Hood and an actual lost WWII RAF squadron reappearing to battle the Hun on the homefront.

Or the return of Margaret Thatcher as a mutant able to turn herself into living iron.

I don't know - something tells me the lady might be more amenable to ....a power suit.

[taalismn]

[

I don't know - something tells me the lady might be more amenable to ....a power suit.

You mean...a union jacket?

[Kagashi]

[eliakon]

The great Millennium trees sprout in North America instead of Europe. Following the known rule of cool.....instead of a neo-Nazi regime we end up with a peaceful hippy beatnik culture out of the 60s and 70s across most of North America. Dog Boys (and other mutant animals) are "our furry friends" and not seen as expendable servants but as equals. Juicers are not seen as so bad "its just drugs man" though MoM is still a problem "They are like, crazy man"

[taalismn]

The great Millennium trees sprout in North America instead of Europe. Following the known rule of cool.....instead of a neo-Nazi regime we end up with a peaceful hippy beatnik culture out of the 60s and 70s across most of North America. Dog Boys (and other mutant animals) are "our furry friends" and not seen as expendable servants but as equals. Juicers are not seen as so bad "its just drugs man" though MoM is still a problem "They are like, crazy man"

The vampires and xiticix would OWN North America.....

[Bill]

Naw, man...we'd learn to communicate with our buggy friends and convince their queen that harmony is better than conquest. They might even find the Millennium Trees a more favorable habitat than their own hives.

As for the blood-suckers, the trees would be a huge asset to keep them at bay. Millennium druids backed up by furry friends and psistalkers ought to keep them from harshing anybody's mellow.

[Tor]

Even if the Xiticix were to commandeer millenium trees instead of building their own towers (though I think they would want underground parts, which could compromise the stability of the roots) I thought they had to kill things to create sludge to feed their babies, would not seem like they could coexist easily with other races.

[SolCannibal]

The great Millennium trees sprout in North America instead of Europe. Following the known rule of cool.....instead of a neo-Nazi regime we end up with a peaceful hippy beatnik culture out of the 60s and 70s across most of North America. Dog Boys (and other mutant animals) are "our furry friends" and not seen as expendable servants but as equals. Juicers are not seen as so bad "its just drugs man" though MoM is still a problem "They are like, crazy man"

The vampires and xiticix would OWN North America.....

In a place where Millennium trees dominate to the point of stimulating the formation of a neo-druidic society - honestly, i think the vamps would be completely boned to an epic level.

Xiticix might be a problem, but Psi-Stalker bands would still be around and the number & variety of Juicer and MoM processes and experiments possibly greater, so things might not be quite as advantageous to them either.

I would actually be more curious about what would be contact with NGR and Republic of Japan (or their rough equivalents) be in such a reality...

[Tor]

Even with their boosted "we can fight naked by being MDC when punched by vamps" abilities, I think Psi-Stalkers would still have a lot of trouble dealing with them. Vamps can just ditch battle by going mist or bat and go regen in some hidden place, they can whittle down the Stalkers like that if they fight smart. I bet all the rep Stalkers get for being vamp-killers is by beating stupid Wilds who don't think.

[SolCannibal]

Even with their boosted "we can fight naked by being MDC when punched by vamps" abilities, I think Psi-Stalkers would still have a lot of trouble dealing with them. Vamps can just ditch battle by going mist or bat and go regen in some hidden place, they can whittle down the Stalkers like that if they fight smart. I bet all the rep Stalkers get for being vamp-killers is by beating stupid Wilds who don't think.

The vamps greater problem might be the prevalence of Millenium Trees as population and spiritual centers, not to mention a possible lack of big urban communities to twist into feeding grounds while using crime and violence as cover for their predations.

[taalismn]

[

I would actually be more curious about what would be contact with NGR and Republic of Japan (or their rough equivalents) be in such a reality...

"So, California ended up taking over America?"

[SolCannibal]

On a little aside that i don't know if counts as an alternate timeline or just a weird addition to canon....

I've been toying with scaling up fadetowns and places like Yucatan to a ridiculous level with the idea of a "Ghostworld" appearing and disappearing from the area between Mars and Jupiter where the Asteroid Belt roughly is, further complicating and messing up with the arrangement and flow of ley lines & PPE across the solar system as it comes and goes from our space.

The very few people aware of this phenomena have little idea of what pattern there is to its comings and goings - and some of these go as far as to suspect that it's not always the same planet...

[SolCannibal]

On a little aside that i don't know if counts as an alternate timeline or just a weird addition to canon....

I've been toying with scaling up fadetowns and places like Yucatan to a ridiculous level with the idea of a "Ghostworld" appearing and disappearing from the area between Mars and Jupiter where the Asteroid Belt roughly is, further complicating and messing up with the arrangement and flow of ley lines & PPE across the solar system as it comes and goes from our space.

The very few people aware of this phenomena have little idea of what pattern there is to its comings and goings - and some of these go as far as to suspect that it's not always the same planet...

[Slight001]

I thought they had to kill things to create sludge to feed their babies, would not seem like they could coexist easily with other races.

Actually they don't need the sludge it just accelerates the growth cycle. The change in rate seems to have suffered from palladium's editing flaws however as iirc we are given two sets of numbers for how long it takes to develop into adults.

[Kagashi]

The great Millennium trees sprout in North America instead of Europe. Following the known rule of cool.....instead of a neo-Nazi regime we end up with a peaceful hippy beatnik culture out of the 60s and 70s across most of North America. Dog Boys (and other mutant animals) are "our furry friends" and not seen as expendable servants but as equals. Juicers are not seen as so bad "its just drugs man" though MoM is still a problem "They are like, crazy man"

Hmmm, do the mutant animals have strange human fetishes called "smoothies"?

[Kagashi]

On a little aside that i don't know if counts as an alternate timeline or just a weird addition to canon....

I've been toying with scaling up fadetowns and places like Yucatan to a ridiculous level with the idea of a "Ghostworld" appearing and disappearing from the area between Mars and Jupiter where the Asteroid Belt roughly is, further complicating and messing up with the arrangement and flow of ley lines & PPE across the solar system as it comes and goes from our space.

The very few people aware of this phenomena have little idea of what pattern there is to its comings and goings - and some of these go as far as to suspect that it's not always the same planet...

Now...thats just a damn cool idea. Perhaps its the dwarf planet Ceres. Its suddenly populated with intelligent beings and a life sustaining atmosphere. Problem is, when they fade out of existence leaving Ceres as the rocky and icy dwarf planet we know, their perception of time stops, so when they come back in, the planets are all in different spots than a moment before and they see Earth as an invasion force that threatens their existence that has grown quickly in the past few years. This of course spawns their desire to explore space and build a defense force. Unfortunately, Arkhons from the 74 PA invasion had retreated to to Ceres after their defeat from the orbital communities and established a base camp on Ceres and find themselves in combat with the native species that lives there when they fade in. The native species believes the Arkhons came from Earth (well...cause they kinda did).

[SolCannibal]

On a little aside that i don't know if counts as an alternate timeline or just a weird addition to canon....

I've been toying with scaling up fadetowns and places like Yucatan to a ridiculous level with the idea of a "Ghostworld" appearing and disappearing from the area between Mars and Jupiter where the Asteroid Belt roughly is, further complicating and messing up with the arrangement and flow of ley lines & PPE across the solar system as it comes and goes from our space.

The very few people aware of this phenomena have little idea of what pattern there is to its comings and goings - and some of these go as far as to suspect that it's not always the same planet...

Now...thats just a damn cool idea. Perhaps its the dwarf planet Ceres. Its suddenly populated with intelligent beings and a life sustaining atmosphere. Problem is, when they fade out of existence leaving Ceres as the rocky and icy dwarf planet we know, their perception of time stops, so when they come back in, the planets are all in different spots than a moment before and they see Earth as an invasion force that threatens their existence that has grown quickly in the past few years. This of course spawns their desire to explore space and build a defense force. Unfortunately, Arkhons from the 74 PA invasion had retreated to to Ceres after their defeat from the orbital communities and established a base camp on Ceres and find themselves in combat with the native species that lives there when they fade in. The native species believes the Arkhons came from Earth (well...cause they kinda did).

Interesting options too, though i would imagine the natives of "Ghostworld" as being aware, at least in part, that some weird stuff happens with their planet, specially if already scrapped the space age tech level like late to mid 20th century Earth. And as i suggested, there might be different ghostworlds that come and go depending on the astrological arrangements and stuff - meaning that in some very wierd occasions there could be two or more extra planets making their path in the Belt and messing up PPE through planetary configurations even further.

[Bill]

Even if the Xiticix were to commandeer millenium trees instead of building their own towers (though I think they would want underground parts, which could compromise the stability of the roots) I thought they had to kill things to create sludge to feed their babies, would not seem like they could coexist easily with other races.

The grubs feed on nectar from the trees instead and metamorphosis into beautiful butterfly-people. And we all live happily ever after in a peaceful tree worshiping utopia under the benevolent eye of our beautiful butterfly guardians...

[SolCannibal]

Even if the Xiticix were to commandeer millenium trees instead of building their own towers (though I think they would want underground parts, which could compromise the stability of the roots) I thought they had to kill things to create sludge to feed their babies, would not seem like they could coexist easily with other races.

The grubs feed on nectar from the trees instead and metamorphosis into beautiful butterfly-people. And we all live happily ever after in a peaceful tree worshiping utopia under the benevolent eye of our beautiful butterfly guardians...

I think i saw a He-man or She-ra episode like that back when i was a kid in the 80s....

[Kagashi]

On a little aside that i don't know if counts as an alternate timeline or just a weird addition to canon....

I've been toying with scaling up fadetowns and places like Yucatan to a ridiculous level with the idea of a "Ghostworld" appearing and disappearing from the area between Mars and Jupiter where the Asteroid Belt roughly is, further complicating and messing up with the arrangement and flow of ley lines & PPE across the solar system as it comes and goes from our space.

The very few people aware of this phenomena have little idea of what pattern there is to its comings and goings - and some of these go as far as to suspect that it's not always the same planet...

Now...thats just a damn cool idea. Perhaps its the dwarf planet Ceres. Its suddenly populated with intelligent beings and a life sustaining atmosphere. Problem is, when they fade out of existence leaving Ceres as the rocky and icy dwarf planet we know, their perception of time stops, so when they come back in, the planets are all in different spots than a moment before and they see Earth as an invasion force that threatens their existence that has grown quickly in the past few years. This of course spawns their desire to explore space and build a defense force. Unfortunately, Arkhons from the 74 PA invasion had retreated to to Ceres after their defeat from the orbital communities and established a base camp on Ceres and find themselves in combat with the native species that lives there when they fade in. The native species believes the Arkhons came from Earth (well...cause they kinda did).

Interesting options too, though i would imagine the natives of "Ghostworld" as being aware, at least in part, that some weird stuff happens with their planet, specially if already scrapped the space age tech level like late to mid 20th century Earth. And as i suggested, there might be different ghostworlds that come and go depending on the astrological arrangements and stuff - meaning that in some very wierd occasions there could be two or more extra planets making their path in the Belt and messing up PPE through planetary configurations even further.

Like seasons. Winter (Ice/Cold) world, Summer (Fire/lava) world, Spring (Earth-like) world, and Fall (Wind/Air). Perhaps dominated by elementals of the like element. When not in ghost form, its just the normal, icy, rocky planetoid...but is dominated by the Yang version of elementals...Void Elementals (use mostly Space magic and abilities and are masters of control the absence of any of the four elements).

[SolCannibal]

On a little aside that i don't know if counts as an alternate timeline or just a weird addition to canon....

I've been toying with scaling up fadetowns and places like Yucatan to a ridiculous level with the idea of a "Ghostworld" appearing and disappearing from the area between Mars and Jupiter where the Asteroid Belt roughly is, further complicating and messing up with the arrangement and flow of ley lines & PPE across the solar system as it comes and goes from our space.

The very few people aware of this phenomena have little idea of what pattern there is to its comings and goings - and some of these go as far as to suspect that it's not always the same planet...

Now...thats just a damn cool idea. Perhaps its the dwarf planet Ceres. Its suddenly populated with intelligent beings and a life sustaining atmosphere. Problem is, when they fade out of existence leaving Ceres as the rocky and icy dwarf planet we know, their perception of time stops, so when they come back in, the planets are all in different spots than a moment before and they see Earth as an invasion force that threatens their existence that has grown quickly in the past few years. This of course spawns their desire to explore space and build a defense force. Unfortunately, Arkhons from the 74 PA invasion had retreated to to Ceres after their defeat from the orbital communities and established a base camp on Ceres and find themselves in combat with the native species that lives there when they fade in. The native species believes the Arkhons came from Earth (well...cause they kinda did).

Interesting options too, though i would imagine the natives of "Ghostworld" as being aware, at least in part, that some weird stuff happens with their planet, specially if already scrapped the space age tech level like late to mid 20th century Earth. And as i suggested, there might be different ghostworlds that come and go depending on the astrological arrangements and stuff - meaning that in some very wierd occasions there could be two or more extra planets making their path in the Belt and messing up PPE through planetary configurations even further.

Like seasons. Winter (Ice/Cold) world, Summer (Fire/lava) world, Spring (Earth-like) world, and Fall (Wind/Air). Perhaps dominated by elementals of the like element. When not in ghost form, its just the normal, icy, rocky planetoid...but is dominated by the Yang version of elementals...Void Elementals (use mostly Space magic and abilities and are masters of control the absence of any of the four elements).

The theme you suggested really made me think of this.

[taalismn]

I agree with the fadeplanet idea...
That.
Just.
ROCKS!

[SolCannibal]

I agree with the fadeplanet idea...
That.
Just.
ROCKS!

Thanks for the appreciation..

I thought of calling it FADEWORLD but something in the back of my head kept telling me that might not be the best of ideas...


But to add a little something useful the post...

In one of many Earths were the supernatural was nearly gone and the shadow of atomic apocalypse reared its ugly head, an ignored but dedicated esoteric society watched the skies, collecting what dwindling magic they could, as a desperate last resort against the rampant misuse of technology. Though their power was limited, it gave them an edge in predicting (and containing) the actions of foolish rulers, demented generals and incompetent bureaucrats through subtle or not so subtle means.

But then came strange mixed signs, confused and entwined predictions of atomic holocaust and a cataclysmic return of magic in an unseen. The society was disturbed, confused and lost - Which could they stop? What could they stop? What should they stop? Could they stop anything? And so, without no sign of a best course to take but certain of the importance of action, they tried everything, each cell doing as its conscience said and cordination (and time) allowed.

- Many started operations of misdirection, confusion and sabotage in circles high and low of dozens of governments with varying degrees of success or failure in stoping, redirecting or at least stalling the missile attacks.

- A number hacked key places and leaked or spammed warnings of the coming nukes across the online channels, hoping at least a few would see the truth and run for the hills.

- And some few, those who saw the twin dooms as inevitable and related, possibly understanding the reasons why... those gathered in the places of power, preparing for the crashing of the walls of reality with ritual preparations and artifacts of power, hoping against hope to interact with the titanic forces gathering and, maybe, just maybe to dillute or redirect a fraction of the onrushing waves of magic about to wash way the world of man. And if their sacrifice failed to contain the tsunami, it might at least arm any surviving brothers and sisters of the occult with places and objects of power of their own. To fight with fire.

Basically, a Chaos Earth-style scenario where some suicidally brave occultists managed a little of the first rush in the Time of the Rifts (or its equivalent) into certain circles of power, stone pyramids, obelisks and artifacts, lots and lots of artifacts and PPE battery style relics, some of them turning into something akin to Rune Weapons due to the "massive PPE and selfless sacrifice of makers" combination, with maybe some super-hero style survivors in the mix...

[Nox Equites]

Even with their boosted "we can fight naked by being MDC when punched by vamps" abilities, I think Psi-Stalkers would still have a lot of trouble dealing with them. Vamps can just ditch battle by going mist or bat and go regen in some hidden place, they can whittle down the Stalkers like that if they fight smart. I bet all the rep Stalkers get for being vamp-killers is by beating stupid Wilds who don't think.

Wilds think, like demented five year olds. Psi-stalkers have the advantage of instinctive hunting knowledge of their prey and the simple ability to know if the vamp is still nearby. Besides mist form is still vulnerable to water. Vamps advantages are numbers and toughness.

On topic: Instead of being near Tampico they set up shop providing oil to Housetown. They make a killing off of supplying the Pecos bandits with fuel. The shorter trade routes means they have a lower overhead and can become oil barons of Texas. Unfortunately that is one less group to distract the Vampire Kingdoms. Perhaps Splugorth have to encourage competition near their canon location to keep an eye on fang faces.

Instead of making a deal with Haktla the demon lord Enumu made a deal with a vampire kingdom further north. Thus Haktla has less of a foothold in Colombia and another kingdom gets the advantages of controlled rainfall to boost agriculture and regional dominance. This could result in all-out-war but who messes with the city supported by a weather manipulator?

Instead of Cyber-knights there is a martial order of priests to a Palladium deity. They fulfill the same role but the cultural results are very different. More people believe in extra dimensional powers and with this example there are lots of new priests because the stat requirements are more lenient.

[Zer0 Kay]

On a little aside that i don't know if counts as an alternate timeline or just a weird addition to canon....

I've been toying with scaling up fadetowns and places like Yucatan to a ridiculous level with the idea of a "Ghostworld" appearing and disappearing from the area between Mars and Jupiter where the Asteroid Belt roughly is, further complicating and messing up with the arrangement and flow of ley lines & PPE across the solar system as it comes and goes from our space.

The very few people aware of this phenomena have little idea of what pattern there is to its comings and goings - and some of these go as far as to suspect that it's not always the same planet...

neither. It is an addition to your idea. Unless your writing a book up it isn't an addition to canon.

[SolCannibal]

On a little aside that i don't know if counts as an alternate timeline or just a weird addition to canon....

I've been toying with scaling up fadetowns and places like Yucatan to a ridiculous level with the idea of a "Ghostworld" appearing and disappearing from the area between Mars and Jupiter where the Asteroid Belt roughly is, further complicating and messing up with the arrangement and flow of ley lines & PPE across the solar system as it comes and goes from our space.

The very few people aware of this phenomena have little idea of what pattern there is to its comings and goings - and some of these go as far as to suspect that it's not always the same planet...

neither. It is an addition to your idea. Unless your writing a book up it isn't an addition to canon.

Sorry, i didn't mean "addition to canon" literally, my bad.

Should have said "don't know if it counts as alternate timeline or just as weird addition/homebrew to vanilla setting" probably.

That said has anyone ever tackled the stuff from Mutants In Orbit again in a Rifter?

[Zer0 Kay]

On a little aside that i don't know if counts as an alternate timeline or just a weird addition to canon....

I've been toying with scaling up fadetowns and places like Yucatan to a ridiculous level with the idea of a "Ghostworld" appearing and disappearing from the area between Mars and Jupiter where the Asteroid Belt roughly is, further complicating and messing up with the arrangement and flow of ley lines & PPE across the solar system as it comes and goes from our space.

The very few people aware of this phenomena have little idea of what pattern there is to its comings and goings - and some of these go as far as to suspect that it's not always the same planet...

neither. It is an addition to your idea. Unless your writing a book up it isn't an addition to canon.

Sorry, i didn't mean "addition to canon" literally, my bad.

Should have said "don't know if it counts as alternate timeline or just as weird addition/homebrew to vanilla setting" probably.

That said has anyone ever tackled the stuff from Mutants In Orbit again in a Rifter?

I don't think so.

They need to tackle a whole book for space and they should so use that Fadeplanet. Maybe planet x it on the opposite side of the sun from the Earth.

Yeah... get on it.

[Nox Equites]

What if all military bots and PA were built to with GB materials? Tech would overwhelm magic without massive changes to spells. Not everyone has Annihilation to cast on a whim. Mages would have to be sneakier than they already need to be to succeed. Or you have an arms race between the factions. More anti-tech spells would be developed to level the field.

The coming of the Rifts kicked off the super volcano under Yellowstone. What if it never settled down and regularly belches ash clouds that ruin farming for years at a time? The population rebound is much slower as people fight over prime farm land. When it isn't destroying farming the rich soil grants boom crops to those that survive. In some places Tri-tops are nuisance critters because that plains grow so well in good times that the herds are stupendously huge.

[Subjugator]

The CS is beset by plague and nearly wiped out. Lazlo comes in and saves them via...MAGIC! The CS maintains resentment and says Lazlo planned it that way and caused the plague...the war is even more bitter and weakens them both. The Xiticix take a stronger hold on North America than before, and Splynncryth has to take notice.

[Slight001]

The splugorth assaulted north america destroying Free Quebec and Chi-Town. Without these centers of power the coalition fell apart. The city states went independant unable to maintain contact with each other and without an agreed upon leader they generally couldn’t get along. The splugorth withdrew to atlantis their work destabilizing North America done.

With the death of his fellow god and foil Bradford dives into his work designing new lifeforms and ever more extreme creations. His forces are soon highly effective killing machines. The Pecos Empire falls, Emperor Lazor revealed to be a dragon is dead, and Bradford rules. His creations hold back the growing tide of vampires from the south.

Iron Heart rarely as capable as the rest of the coalition with their people terrified makes a deal with the devil. The vanguard pull ranks and head for Iron Heart, once there they systematically gain control of Iron Heart and begin preparing the nation to take the next steps. All the while a masterful propaganda campaign sways the public to the need to embrace magic as their only salvation. Rumors persist that Ernst Vinien is alive and leading the vanguard.

[SolCannibal]

- Nostrous Dunscon, seeing the writing on the wall and the internal dissent taking form around him, decides to relent of his campaign of war against Chi-town and start to prepare his official statements to calm down things. Then, a few weeks later, the forces of Chi-Town do an unilateral preemptive strike on the city of Dweomer, devastating considerable parts of the city in the proccess though at a cost to themselves.

The mighty Lords of Magic fail to provide for their own, proving petty and fractious at their people gratest time of need - divided between roaring for the blood, accusations of betrayal and taking their people away of the bloodshed, their power and wisdom prove fickle and amount to very little in the end. Bretan Dzir does his utmost to assure the escape of as many innocents as he can, while paranoid, spiteful and weakened Leizak D’zir falls in the steps of the Dunscons palace, cursing Nostrous name amidst the corpses of his bodyguards after failing to kill him. The shocked leader rallies his forces to save what they can of the doomed city, while warning the leaders in Tolkeen and calling for help, in time only to see Coran D’zir, berserk with grief, pain and loss, dying amidst the mayhem and bands of enemies.

Dweomer falls, but its victory proves the doom of Chi-town, as a Federation of Magic hurt, vengeful, and wrathful but united and forewarned in loss and grief advances toward the Great Lakes. Chi-Town fights long and hard in the long months of the siege, but fall and burn it does and in time New Dweomer, City of Winds would rise over the ruins of old Chicago as hallmark and memorial both. The Federation consolidates itself while its neighbors eye it with aprehension but choose the path of diplomacy instead of repeating the fallen citadel's folly.

Meanwhile survivors of the destruction take their own path and persist:

- Some move to other city-states and go on with their own lives, sometimes remembering - or speaking - of how their past rulers intolerance and paranoia brought their own doom.

- Others try to make new lives but take with them tales of the ruthlessness of the alien and the horrors of magic, that wonder destined to be man's next great folly and ruin as once the abuse of science was.

- And those who in their anger and spite found no solace or home anywhere - refugees, wanderers, vagabonds, marauders.

Those became a nomadic force of evil, a host of raiders and bandits clans preying on D-bees, magician and betrayers of humanity out of hate as much as want. Cabbots, Proseks, Bradfords and many other clan bands, an army of walking dead and their children, collecting weapons, secrets of science and techonology wherever they found, the Host of Fire-Blackened Bones, supported in secret by mysterious factories and man-made titans of steel that fed on the dreams of their makers to grow into a metal god... or demon.