How does anyone actually control flying PA?

[slade2501]

This might sound funny, but I've been thinking and I'm really curious about how a pilot actually flies a suit of power armor. there are no throttles, control sticks or pedals like in a conventional aircraft. is it voice controlled? eye movement? toe or finger twitch controls? Arm positioning is my bet (move arm forward for speed, back for brakes, up or down for increase or decrease elevation).

[Vincent Takeda]

A very small joystick for ye bumhole... Thats why power armor pilots are always smilin.

[Warshield73]

In the RMB page 220 there is an illustration of the GB pilot (a very small copy is on page 73 of RUE) that shows a "Neural Sensor Helmet". Now this is just in the GB but we decided that this is how most robots and PA are controlled with eye and voice commands on top of that. Not perfectly cannon but close.

We have also said that people with a Universal Headjack can use it in the same way with vehicles like jet packs, hover bikes, and even robots & PA.

[slade2501]

In the RMB page 220 there is an illustration of the GB pilot (a very small copy is on page 73 of RUE) that shows a "Neural Sensor Helmet". Now this is just in the GB but we decided that this is how most robots and PA are controlled with eye and voice commands on top of that. Not perfectly cannon but close.

We have also said that people with a Universal Headjack can use it in the same way with vehicles like jet packs, hover bikes, and even robots & PA.

Ah, cool. that's excellent. I was reading the Sidewinder Bandito arms fluff and it just suddenly dawned on me "how the heck do they control the flight mode?"

[guardiandashi]

In the RMB page 220 there is an illustration of the GB pilot (a very small copy is on page 73 of RUE) that shows a "Neural Sensor Helmet". Now this is just in the GB but we decided that this is how most robots and PA are controlled with eye and voice commands on top of that. Not perfectly cannon but close.

We have also said that people with a Universal Headjack can use it in the same way with vehicles like jet packs, hover bikes, and even robots & PA.

Ah, cool. that's excellent. I was reading the Sidewinder Bandito arms fluff and it just suddenly dawned on me "how the heck do they control the flight mode?"

I never really thought about it much, but I would go with a couple different control systems.
the headjack/neural interface is a good option if you have it.
if not you would likely have a combination of negative feedback, and definable "virtual controls"
the "virtual controls would likely be a combination of a HUD with essentially 3d game controllers, but some of the controls being "virtual" meaning you don't actually hold a joystick, but instead you move your hands/feet as if you were manipulating controls that don't actually exist, except that they do in the sense that your gauntlet, and or foot sensors detect you making gestures that you have configured to indicate that you are manipulating the flight controls.

for example you move your left foot like you are manipulating the gear shifter on a motor cycle and you toggle on/off the thrusters /rocket pack, maybe you maneuver 1 hand like you are holding a flight control stick make a fist a certain way, and trigger various weapons, look and blink, or toggle a bite/chin switch to trigger various functions. etc.

note I am taking some of these suggestions from a variety of sources such as the Robert Heinlein novel "starship troopers" where the character was talking about the controls for the power armor the MI (Mobile Infantry) used in the novel. some of the fist gestures were from a description of how some of the elemental power armor worked in Battletech. ETC.

[glitterboy2098]

basically the same way you control a hangglider... shifting your limbs and center of gravity around. only the suit reads the motions so you don't have to do it very far. odds are, that most of the flight control is via leg and hip motions, leaving the arms somewhat free to use the weapons.

[Warshield73]

In the RMB page 220 there is an illustration of the GB pilot (a very small copy is on page 73 of RUE) that shows a "Neural Sensor Helmet". Now this is just in the GB but we decided that this is how most robots and PA are controlled with eye and voice commands on top of that. Not perfectly cannon but close.

We have also said that people with a Universal Headjack can use it in the same way with vehicles like jet packs, hover bikes, and even robots & PA.

Ah, cool. that's excellent. I was reading the Sidewinder Bandito arms fluff and it just suddenly dawned on me "how the heck do they control the flight mode?"

I never really thought about it much, but I would go with a couple different control systems.
the headjack/neural interface is a good option if you have it.
if not you would likely have a combination of negative feedback, and definable "virtual controls"
the "virtual controls would likely be a combination of a HUD with essentially 3d game controllers, but some of the controls being "virtual" meaning you don't actually hold a joystick, but instead you move your hands/feet as if you were manipulating controls that don't actually exist, except that they do in the sense that your gauntlet, and or foot sensors detect you making gestures that you have configured to indicate that you are manipulating the flight controls.

for example you move your left foot like you are manipulating the gear shifter on a motor cycle and you toggle on/off the thrusters /rocket pack, maybe you maneuver 1 hand like you are holding a flight control stick make a fist a certain way, and trigger various weapons, look and blink, or toggle a bite/chin switch to trigger various functions. etc.

note I am taking some of these suggestions from a variety of sources such as the Robert Heinlein novel "starship troopers" where the character was talking about the controls for the power armor the MI (Mobile Infantry) used in the novel. some of the fist gestures were from a description of how some of the elemental power armor worked in Battletech. ETC.

We actually had this discussion back in the day, with similar sources, but since most flying PA's use there arms and hands for weapons (rail guns, laser rifles, mini-missile launchers, etc.) it seems like hands are too busy to use even virtual controls.

[Eagle]

For Christmas my nephew got one of those hoverboard things. I tried it out, and it took me maybe 20 minutes to get the hang of it (as in, riding around the living room without falling off). Small little movements with your feet control the thing.

A power armor suit would probably be more complex than that, but if I had to make something up, that's what I'd go with. Little gestures that most people wouldn't notice or know to do. Tilt your head to the side, squeeze with your ring and pinky fingers on your left hand, that kind of thing. The suit would have auto-balancing systems that translated your little motions into acrobatic flight. There's probably also some failsafe where you can put the suit on auto-pilot for a bit in case you really need to stretch, or you get a cramp and need to move your foot around.

[kaid]

Given we already have monkeys controlling robotic arms with their thoughts I assume with future tech armor the armor can with a combination of eye tracking/sensors in the helmet watching brain activity/sensors in the armor itself pretty well flies where you want it to when you want it to. I am guessing some some of the power armor training to learn to use them involves figuring out how to control the signals your body is sending out so you don't have the SQUIRREL face plant at 170 MPH problem.

[Proseksword]

Combat helicopters already use a system where the chin turret is linked to the movement of the gunner's head, and moves to focus on whatever is looked at. I assume that something similar is used whereby head & minor leg movements are used to control thrust vectors.

[dreicunan]

Just assume that the system worked in Heinlein's Starship Troopers (the book, not the missed the mark worse than Ben Affleck needs acting school movie) was made reality.

[glitterboy2098]

Heinlein's suits (which were based off previous literary examples, just better described) were only capable of jet boosted jumping. not flight.

[Colonel_Tetsuya]

Just assume that the system worked in Heinlein's Starship Troopers (the book, not the missed the mark worse than Ben Affleck needs acting school movie) was made reality.

Minor derailment here....

But the movie was a VERY deliberate send-up/mockery of Heinleinks book. They didnt miss the mark, so much as the mark was making fun of Heinlein’s obvious love of fascism.

[dreicunan]

Just assume that the system worked in Heinlein's Starship Troopers (the book, not the missed the mark worse than Ben Affleck needs acting school movie) was made reality.

Minor derailment here....

But the movie was a VERY deliberate send-up/mockery of Heinleinks book. They didnt miss the mark, so much as the mark was making fun of Heinlein’s obvious love of fascism.

Well, a half-assed mockery by a guy who admits that he didn't make it through the whole book. After all, Heinlein most definitely did NOT love fascism, and the government in the boom is not fascistic. It is actually a democracy with franchise limited to those whi have become citizens through service and who can only exercise that right after their service is complete. It did indeed miss the political point: that franchise which must be earned through service (which anyone capable of understanding the oath can do) would produce a better system of government than franchise given freely. Agree or disagree with that position, limiting franchise in a democracy is not fascism (after all, the Athenians didn't let everyone vote!).

[ShadowLogan]

pg39 of the Rifts Main Book (not sure if this survived into RUE) states "possess a design element, which creates a symbiotic link between the pilot and the machine." (Under Determining the # of Attacks per Melee and Combat Bonuses).

So I'd go with some level of neural control (as suggested in the GB lineart).

[slade2501]

pg39 of the Rifts Main Book (not sure if this survived into RUE) states "possess a design element, which creates a symbiotic link between the pilot and the machine." (Under Determining the # of Attacks per Melee and Combat Bonuses).

So I'd go with some level of neural control (as suggested in the GB lineart).

Thats fantastic. Never say that bit. "A Design Element" I like that a lot. very hand-wavey.

[Warshield73]

pg39 of the Rifts Main Book (not sure if this survived into RUE) states "possess a design element, which creates a symbiotic link between the pilot and the machine." (Under Determining the # of Attacks per Melee and Combat Bonuses).

So I'd go with some level of neural control (as suggested in the GB lineart).

I was looking for this for over an hour on Saturday, I remembered the gist of the quote but not it's exact wording, so using search on the PDF was out, or where it was. Thanks for finding it.

[slade2501]

pg39 of the Rifts Main Book (not sure if this survived into RUE) states "possess a design element, which creates a symbiotic link between the pilot and the machine." (Under Determining the # of Attacks per Melee and Combat Bonuses).

So I'd go with some level of neural control (as suggested in the GB lineart).

I was looking for this for over an hour on Saturday, I remembered the gist of the quote but not it's exact wording, so using search on the PDF was out, or where it was. Thanks for finding it.

its true, i looked it up right after I read that comment. Never noticed it myself but as a trope lover is simply tickles me silly. I love a good hand wave, as most forms of fiction, like a good magic trick, require the reader to not look too closely at the material, or to ask the obvious question. it prevents a "voodoo shark", an attempt to Handwave it rather than disrupt the story — except the Hand Wave itself is a Plot Hole.

"The suit has a design feature (which we wont mention but it DOES the job) that lets the pilot control the machine, becoming more than mere, mortal man!"

Its like when Heinlein describes in Starship Troopers how the mobile infantry trooper controls his armor :

"And that is the beauty of a powered suit: you don’t have to think about it. You don’t have to drive it, fly
it, conn it, operate it; you just wear it and it takes its orders directly from your muscles and does for you what your muscles are trying to do. This leaves you with your whole mind free to handle your weapons and notice what is going on around you... which is supremely important to an infantryman who wants to die in bed."

[kaid]

pg39 of the Rifts Main Book (not sure if this survived into RUE) states "possess a design element, which creates a symbiotic link between the pilot and the machine." (Under Determining the # of Attacks per Melee and Combat Bonuses).

So I'd go with some level of neural control (as suggested in the GB lineart).

I was looking for this for over an hour on Saturday, I remembered the gist of the quote but not it's exact wording, so using search on the PDF was out, or where it was. Thanks for finding it.

its true, i looked it up right after I read that comment. Never noticed it myself but as a trope lover is simply tickles me silly. I love a good hand wave, as most forms of fiction, like a good magic trick, require the reader to not look too closely at the material, or to ask the obvious question. it prevents a "voodoo shark", an attempt to Handwave it rather than disrupt the story — except the Hand Wave itself is a Plot Hole.

"The suit has a design feature (which we wont mention but it DOES the job) that lets the pilot control the machine, becoming more than mere, mortal man!"

Its like when Heinlein describes in Starship Troopers how the mobile infantry trooper controls his armor :

"And that is the beauty of a powered suit: you don’t have to think about it. You don’t have to drive it, fly
it, conn it, operate it; you just wear it and it takes its orders directly from your muscles and does for you what your muscles are trying to do. This leaves you with your whole mind free to handle your weapons and notice what is going on around you... which is supremely important to an infantryman who wants to die in bed."

I think power armor piloting is very like that. It also is why it requires training because the capability of the armor is so far beyond normal for a person they have to learn how to move and react correctly without the armor overreacting to the input. It also is why trained operators can perform martial arts to an even higher degree of skill than normal when wearing them. Even in our modern aircraft we are starting to create a lot of these control/targeting technologies it is really not hard to believe at all that reasonable exoskeletons will be manageable in the not very distant future. The biggest problem with making power armor is the power part of it. If you can get a power source strong enough the rest is a manageable technical challange.