Goblin bombs/arrows

Ley Line walkers, Juicers, Coalition Troops, Samas, Tolkeen, & The Federation Of Magic. Come together here to discuss all things Rifts®.

Moderators: Immortals, Supreme Beings, Old Ones

User avatar
(SHIFTY)
Adventurer
Posts: 407
Joined: Fri Sep 10, 2004 6:27 pm

Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by (SHIFTY) »

Hello all. I could not find who or what faction exactly manufactures Goblin bombs/arrows? Is it stormspire or Tolkeen? Thanks
Colonel_Tetsuya
Champion
Posts: 2172
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:22 am

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Colonel_Tetsuya »

Anywhere that makes TW items. TW items are notoriously easy To duplicate, once you have a few to examine
Im loving the Foes list; it's the only thing keeping me from tearing out my eyes from the dumb.
User avatar
Blue_Lion
Knight
Posts: 6226
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2001 1:01 am
Location: Clone Lab 27

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Blue_Lion »

They fist appeared in SoT so they made them but they are to my understanding a general TW item that can be made by almost any tw. So probally every major TW maker produces them.
The Clones are coming you shall all be replaced, but who is to say you have not been replaced already.

Master of Type-O and the obvios.

Soon my army oc clones and winged-monkies will rule the world but first, must .......

I may debate canon and RAW, but the games I run are highly house ruled. So I am not debating for how I play but about how the system works as written.
User avatar
eliakon
Palladin
Posts: 9093
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2007 9:40 pm
Comment: Palladium Books Canon is set solely by Kevin Siembieda, either in person, or by his approval of published material.
Contact:

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by eliakon »

I would assume that unless an item is described as being specific to a specific manufacturer then its a 'generic' item.
Thus anyone can make goblin bombs, or flame blades but you need to go to Stormspire to get those special Rifles and clips or need to go to Atlantis to get their special toys etc.
The rules are not a bludgeon with which to hammer a character into a game. They are a guide to how a group of friends can get together to weave a collective story that entertains everyone involved. We forget that at our peril.

Edmund Burke wrote:The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."
User avatar
Blue_Lion
Knight
Posts: 6226
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2001 1:01 am
Location: Clone Lab 27

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Blue_Lion »

eliakon wrote:I would assume that unless an item is described as being specific to a specific manufacturer then its a 'generic' item.
Thus anyone can make goblin bombs, or flame blades but you need to go to Stormspire to get those special Rifles and clips or need to go to Atlantis to get their special toys etc.

That is my understanding as well.
Other wise PPE clips would not be exclusive to storm spire like the books say they are.
The Clones are coming you shall all be replaced, but who is to say you have not been replaced already.

Master of Type-O and the obvios.

Soon my army oc clones and winged-monkies will rule the world but first, must .......

I may debate canon and RAW, but the games I run are highly house ruled. So I am not debating for how I play but about how the system works as written.
User avatar
(SHIFTY)
Adventurer
Posts: 407
Joined: Fri Sep 10, 2004 6:27 pm

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by (SHIFTY) »

Thank you guys!
Colonel_Tetsuya
Champion
Posts: 2172
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:22 am

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Colonel_Tetsuya »

Blue_Lion wrote:
eliakon wrote:I would assume that unless an item is described as being specific to a specific manufacturer then its a 'generic' item.
Thus anyone can make goblin bombs, or flame blades but you need to go to Stormspire to get those special Rifles and clips or need to go to Atlantis to get their special toys etc.

That is my understanding as well.
Other wise PPE clips would not be exclusive to storm spire like the books say they are.


PPE clips are only exclusive to Stormspire because Stormspire is the only TW manufacturer that tries to sell to non-psychic, non-magic using clients; another TW could make them, theyre just super expensive and few see any point. The ability to do it isnt unique, though. Manoa has PPE clips for their weapons, in SA.

Even Stormspires weapons arent unique to them; Tolkeen manufactured clipless versions (SoT books).
Im loving the Foes list; it's the only thing keeping me from tearing out my eyes from the dumb.
User avatar
taalismn
Priest
Posts: 47908
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 8:19 pm
Location: Somewhere between Heaven, Hell, and New England

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by taalismn »

Be wary of cheap knockoffs, however.
It really sucks to toss a goblin bomb you picked up cheap from an arms merchant with an un-fixed business location, expecting a boom, and finding out you got snookered into buying a cheap plastic forgery.
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------
User avatar
eliakon
Palladin
Posts: 9093
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2007 9:40 pm
Comment: Palladium Books Canon is set solely by Kevin Siembieda, either in person, or by his approval of published material.
Contact:

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by eliakon »

Colonel_Tetsuya wrote:
Blue_Lion wrote:
eliakon wrote:I would assume that unless an item is described as being specific to a specific manufacturer then its a 'generic' item.
Thus anyone can make goblin bombs, or flame blades but you need to go to Stormspire to get those special Rifles and clips or need to go to Atlantis to get their special toys etc.

That is my understanding as well.
Other wise PPE clips would not be exclusive to storm spire like the books say they are.


PPE clips are only exclusive to Stormspire because Stormspire is the only TW manufacturer that tries to sell to non-psychic, non-magic using clients; another TW could make them, theyre just super expensive and few see any point. The ability to do it isnt unique, though. Manoa has PPE clips for their weapons, in SA.

Even Stormspires weapons arent unique to them; Tolkeen manufactured clipless versions (SoT books).

Correction. Another TW may or may not be able to make PPE clips
There is no canon support for the supposition though.
The books do say that the PPE clip is unique to Stormspire though which suggests that RAW they are...well unique.
Especially since the Manoa weapons don't use removable PPE clips, and their tech is explicitly a melding of stone magic and TW that is not replicable by other TWs which doesn't bode well for the claim that PPE cells are easy to copy. Nor is the fact that Tolkeen seems unable to copy the cells and can only make the clipless versions.
There is nothing that I have seen in any book that says that any TW can copy any other TW device. I have no reason to believe that it is any easier to knock of a TW device than it is to reverse engineer other technology... which if you look around the real world can be pretty hard. Sure you can get some stuff right off the bat, but secrets of manufacturing don't show up in final products. You cant look at a finished product and know "ah ha! they use this formula in the catalyst" or "obviously, they use this variation of the spell, with this as the incantation I need" Which is why you see devices with "Unknown spell" or devices listed as "exclusive to X" or the like...
...because they can't be simply duplicated by all and sundry.

Now if you have a canon citation that says otherwise I'm all ears, otherwise it is simply your opinion that they should be able to copy anything vs the book claims that there are exclusive devices...
The rules are not a bludgeon with which to hammer a character into a game. They are a guide to how a group of friends can get together to weave a collective story that entertains everyone involved. We forget that at our peril.

Edmund Burke wrote:The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."
User avatar
Axelmania
Knight
Posts: 5523
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2015 1:13 pm

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Axelmania »

taalismn wrote:Be wary of cheap knockoffs, however.
It really sucks to toss a goblin bomb you picked up cheap from an arms merchant with an un-fixed business location, expecting a boom, and finding out you got snookered into buying a cheap plastic forgery.

If I could get them for 10% of the price, every other one being a dud would be acceptable. Those things are ridiculously expensive, just not economic to fight with IMO.
User avatar
drewkitty ~..~
Monk
Posts: 17737
Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2000 1:01 am
Location: Eastvale, calif
Contact:

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

I would say that any TW can make PPE batteries. But that doe snot mean they can duplicate the spells needed to mesh two TW magic items (a PPE battery/clip & the effect producing TW magic item) to work together. It is these connective/connecting spells which are probably the "trade secret" that storm spire hides to corner the market on PPE clips.

Just my 2 centa-cred
May you be blessed with the ability to change course when you are off the mark.
Each question should be give the canon answer 1st, then you can proclaim your house rules.
Reading and writing (literacy) is how people on BBS interact.
User avatar
Blue_Lion
Knight
Posts: 6226
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2001 1:01 am
Location: Clone Lab 27

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Blue_Lion »

Colonel_Tetsuya wrote:
Blue_Lion wrote:
eliakon wrote:I would assume that unless an item is described as being specific to a specific manufacturer then its a 'generic' item.
Thus anyone can make goblin bombs, or flame blades but you need to go to Stormspire to get those special Rifles and clips or need to go to Atlantis to get their special toys etc.

That is my understanding as well.
Other wise PPE clips would not be exclusive to storm spire like the books say they are.


PPE clips are only exclusive to Stormspire because Stormspire is the only TW manufacturer that tries to sell to non-psychic, non-magic using clients; another TW could make them, theyre just super expensive and few see any point. The ability to do it isnt unique, though. Manoa has PPE clips for their weapons, in SA.

Even Stormspires weapons arent unique to them; Tolkeen manufactured clipless versions (SoT books).

Check your facts the PPE clip does not allow non-psi/mage this ability was never stated and later text(I believe BoM) even said they do not.

The reason no one else can make them is because the design is a secret no one else has the blue prints.
The Clones are coming you shall all be replaced, but who is to say you have not been replaced already.

Master of Type-O and the obvios.

Soon my army oc clones and winged-monkies will rule the world but first, must .......

I may debate canon and RAW, but the games I run are highly house ruled. So I am not debating for how I play but about how the system works as written.
User avatar
Blue_Lion
Knight
Posts: 6226
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2001 1:01 am
Location: Clone Lab 27

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Blue_Lion »

taalismn wrote:Be wary of cheap knockoffs, however.
It really sucks to toss a goblin bomb you picked up cheap from an arms merchant with an un-fixed business location, expecting a boom, and finding out you got snookered into buying a cheap plastic forgery.

You do know goblin grenades do not go boom, they cast spells lvl 1-4. Single use TW.
The Clones are coming you shall all be replaced, but who is to say you have not been replaced already.

Master of Type-O and the obvios.

Soon my army oc clones and winged-monkies will rule the world but first, must .......

I may debate canon and RAW, but the games I run are highly house ruled. So I am not debating for how I play but about how the system works as written.
User avatar
taalismn
Priest
Posts: 47908
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 8:19 pm
Location: Somewhere between Heaven, Hell, and New England

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by taalismn »

Blue_Lion wrote:
taalismn wrote:Be wary of cheap knockoffs, however.
It really sucks to toss a goblin bomb you picked up cheap from an arms merchant with an un-fixed business location, expecting a boom, and finding out you got snookered into buying a cheap plastic forgery.

You do know goblin grenades do not go boom, they cast spells lvl 1-4. Single use TW.



Boom or the magic equivalent. The result is the same...deployed ordnance, expected effect, no effect, sudden realization you've been hosed.
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------
User avatar
Blue_Lion
Knight
Posts: 6226
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2001 1:01 am
Location: Clone Lab 27

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Blue_Lion »

taalismn wrote:
Blue_Lion wrote:
taalismn wrote:Be wary of cheap knockoffs, however.
It really sucks to toss a goblin bomb you picked up cheap from an arms merchant with an un-fixed business location, expecting a boom, and finding out you got snookered into buying a cheap plastic forgery.

You do know goblin grenades do not go boom, they cast spells lvl 1-4. Single use TW.



Boom or the magic equivalent. The result is the same...deployed ordnance, expected effect, no effect, sudden realization you've been hosed.

The magic affects are not boom equivalent.
Magic net, CoA, globe of daylight, blinding flash.
The Clones are coming you shall all be replaced, but who is to say you have not been replaced already.

Master of Type-O and the obvios.

Soon my army oc clones and winged-monkies will rule the world but first, must .......

I may debate canon and RAW, but the games I run are highly house ruled. So I am not debating for how I play but about how the system works as written.
User avatar
taalismn
Priest
Posts: 47908
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 8:19 pm
Location: Somewhere between Heaven, Hell, and New England

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by taalismn »

Blue_Lion wrote:The magic affects are not boom equivalent.
Magic net, CoA, globe of daylight, blinding flash.


Boom, flash, stuck'um, poof....the actual physical manifestation doesn't matter. You're throwing an expendable device that is expected to have an effect on your target, or area. You're using the device rather than some other means, such as beating it with your fists, wrestling it to the ground, shooting it, setting it on fire, blinding it with your sparkling wit, or boring it to death with nitpicking. You're expecting an effect. You're getting none. This throws a crimp in your plans and you're out the credits you wasted on the damn paperweight.
The 'boom' here is entirely metaphorical. Like electricity being referred to as 'juice'.
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------
User avatar
Blue_Lion
Knight
Posts: 6226
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2001 1:01 am
Location: Clone Lab 27

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Blue_Lion »

taalismn wrote:
Blue_Lion wrote:The magic affects are not boom equivalent.
Magic net, CoA, globe of daylight, blinding flash.


Boom, flash, stuck'um, poof....the actual physical manifestation doesn't matter. You're throwing an expendable device that is expected to have an effect on your target, or area. You're using the device rather than some other means, such as beating it with your fists, wrestling it to the ground, shooting it, setting it on fire, blinding it with your sparkling wit, or boring it to death with nitpicking. You're expecting an effect. You're getting none. This throws a crimp in your plans and you're out the credits you wasted on the damn paperweight.
The 'boom' here is entirely metaphorical. Like electricity being referred to as 'juice'.

Boom implies the grenade is a damaging device goblin grenades are based non damaging spells. So in this case boom is some what inappropriate metaphorical implication, so the that is why they are not boom equivalent.
The Clones are coming you shall all be replaced, but who is to say you have not been replaced already.

Master of Type-O and the obvios.

Soon my army oc clones and winged-monkies will rule the world but first, must .......

I may debate canon and RAW, but the games I run are highly house ruled. So I am not debating for how I play but about how the system works as written.
User avatar
taalismn
Priest
Posts: 47908
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 8:19 pm
Location: Somewhere between Heaven, Hell, and New England

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by taalismn »

Blue_Lion wrote:[
Boom implies the grenade is a damaging device goblin grenades are based non damaging spells. So in this case boom is some what inappropriate metaphorical implication, so the that is why they are not boom equivalent.

Blue, the description for Goblin Bombs also includes Fire Bomband Lightning Bomb,. These are DEFINITELY damaging spells. Oh, and Orb of Cold.
They might go FWoosh, FZZarp, or Cwinkle, but these are the equivalents of Boom for the purpose of indicating a grenade-style device going off.
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------
User avatar
eliakon
Palladin
Posts: 9093
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2007 9:40 pm
Comment: Palladium Books Canon is set solely by Kevin Siembieda, either in person, or by his approval of published material.
Contact:

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by eliakon »

Are people seriously arguing over what is the correct sound effect to use for a goblin bomb going off?
:?
The correct answer is "it makes the sound that the Player or GM makes when describing the particular scene that bomb is in in that game."
:lol:
I mean really, its basically like arguing over if when a comic book person punches someone if "biff" "bamp" "Whap" "Ka-Hit" or something else is the correct way to label the panel. The answer of course is "you use what is appropriate for that comic, by that artist/writer, in that scene, at that time."
:bandit:
Done.
Can we move on now?
The rules are not a bludgeon with which to hammer a character into a game. They are a guide to how a group of friends can get together to weave a collective story that entertains everyone involved. We forget that at our peril.

Edmund Burke wrote:The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."
User avatar
Killer Cyborg
Priest
Posts: 27954
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2001 2:01 am
Comment: "Your Eloquence with a sledge hammer is a beautiful thing..." -Zer0 Kay
Location: In the ocean, punching oncoming waves
Contact:

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Killer Cyborg »

"Gob-boom!"
Annual Best Poster of the Year Awards (2012)

"That rifle on the wall of the laborer's cottage or working class flat is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there." -George Orwell

Check out my Author Page on Amazon!
User avatar
taalismn
Priest
Posts: 47908
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 8:19 pm
Location: Somewhere between Heaven, Hell, and New England

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by taalismn »

eliakon wrote:A
I mean really, its basically like arguing over if when a comic book person punches someone if "biff" "bamp" "Whap" "Ka-Hit" or something else is the correct way to label the panel. The answer of course is "you use what is appropriate for that comic, by that artist/writer, in that scene, at that time."?


And if it goes GaleshGaLurgkk!, you're probably reading an old Don Martin strip.

But yeah, disposable TW stuff I figure is harder to test for authenticity before use, unless you got a mage or psychic who can check that sort of thing with fey sense or Object Read. So unless you bought from a known, reputable, and accessible source, be really wary of imitation stuff.
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"

--------Rudyard Kipling
------------
User avatar
Axelmania
Knight
Posts: 5523
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2015 1:13 pm

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Axelmania »

Blue_Lion wrote:Check your facts the PPE clip does not allow non-psi/mage this ability was never stated and later text(I believe BoM) even said they do not.

I think this was based on some kind of "juicers love them" text in FoM? Juicers can have psi though so it might've just meant Juicers with psi?

I'd be interested in knowing the earliest book we can find any explicitly non-psionic (and ob. non-magic too) NPCs with TW stuff they use.
User avatar
Blue_Lion
Knight
Posts: 6226
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2001 1:01 am
Location: Clone Lab 27

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Blue_Lion »

Axelmania wrote:
Blue_Lion wrote:Check your facts the PPE clip does not allow non-psi/mage this ability was never stated and later text(I believe BoM) even said they do not.

I think this was based on some kind of "juicers love them" text in FoM? Juicers can have psi though so it might've just meant Juicers with psi?

I'd be interested in knowing the earliest book we can find any explicitly non-psionic (and ob. non-magic too) NPCs with TW stuff they use.


The earliest tw item that any one can use was in the book titled rifts peg. It had a special tw helm that any one could use and was stated as being special in that case.

The first exapansion on tw use I know off tw to non mage and psi was in new west or was, it also has one class with a random transportation roll to include tw vehicles. Note the rule was that % of people that grew up using tw could use it. Similuar clause in it.

This rule could also explain the flavor text. Or the flavor text could also refer to crew served weapons carried by the juicer as it never exlisitly says the use them.

(One juicer varrent explicitly has psi)
The Clones are coming you shall all be replaced, but who is to say you have not been replaced already.

Master of Type-O and the obvios.

Soon my army oc clones and winged-monkies will rule the world but first, must .......

I may debate canon and RAW, but the games I run are highly house ruled. So I am not debating for how I play but about how the system works as written.
silversarith
D-Bee
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Aug 05, 2017 6:32 pm

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by silversarith »

Last I was aware TW gear could be used by anyone generally. Most of it has buttons and levers and the power source needs you to pump it with PPE, ISP, or take it to a let line to charge it. So a character that isn't a mage or psi could never recharge the flame bolt rifle unless it charges automatically at a leyline, but he can still squeeze the trigger and put bolts downrange.
silversarith
D-Bee
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Aug 05, 2017 6:32 pm

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by silversarith »

Yeah found it, pg 131 on RUE, point 10.
"If the device itself is able to store ppe, the device can be made to function even for a non psi/mage if the Techno wizard wants it to"

That doesn't really say for most items, but it's entirely reasonable for any item that has charges and physical controls to work for normies. Hell, that could get pretty fun with some items with features that you need to be a super to fine tune such as the focus on a camera, but any Joe schmoe can pick it up and click away making blurry photos.
Colonel_Tetsuya
Champion
Posts: 2172
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:22 am

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Colonel_Tetsuya »

silversarith wrote:Yeah found it, pg 131 on RUE, point 10.
"If the device itself is able to store ppe, the device can be made to function even for a non psi/mage if the Techno wizard wants it to"

That doesn't really say for most items, but it's entirely reasonable for any item that has charges and physical controls to work for normies. Hell, that could get pretty fun with some items with features that you need to be a super to fine tune such as the focus on a camera, but any Joe schmoe can pick it up and click away making blurry photos.


There were also examples of TW devices that could be used by anyone in other books preceding RUE; Queenston Harbor has some really great Firebolt muskets and pistols (SB4); The Manoan versions in SA2 could be used by anyone (but only recharged at Ley Lines & Nexus Points, incl. Pyramids). The entire point of Stormspire’s PPE clips was to allow “normies” to use them (and is called out, as Borgs can use them.). New West had several TW items usable by anyone after they were charged. There are others, too, but im feeling too lazy to look. Even more post-RUE (Almost everything in Arzno has a PPE battery.)
Im loving the Foes list; it's the only thing keeping me from tearing out my eyes from the dumb.
User avatar
Axelmania
Knight
Posts: 5523
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2015 1:13 pm

Re: Goblin bombs/arrows

Unread post by Axelmania »

Blue_Lion wrote:The earliest tw item that any one can use was in the book titled rifts peg. It had a special tw helm that any one could use and was stated as being special in that case.

Looking on page 96, I figure you might be referring to the bottom of the left column's Psionic Mind Shield normally only for psionic characters which has a note about being used for non-psychic characters.

But it doesn't actually say anything about ignoring the overall TW rule requiring you to be either psionic or magic (pg 89 "people who are not psychic or mystically oriented can not operate the device at all") so I would figure this note simply means that non-psychic mages are able to use it.

Blue_Lion wrote:The first exapansion on tw use I know off tw to non mage and psi was in new west or was, it also has one class with a random transportation roll to include tw vehicles.

pg 90 the Bounty Hunter's option 3 says Magic Armor: TW or other type.
pg 92 the Gunfighter could start with a "energy pistol or Techno-Wizard pistol"
pg 95 the TW revolver was one of the options from 'weapon of choice'

So if you lacked psi you would probably go with 'other type' or 'energy pistol' or non-TW choice unless you wanted something you couldn't use. Which is possible, people who couldn't use TW could still steal/trade them.

Blue_Lion wrote:Note the rule was that % of people that grew up using tw could use it. Similuar clause in it.

This might have been an expansion on RMBp63's text about Cyber-Knight training:
    This open mindedness makes them one of the few O.C.C.s which can intuitively understand and use items created through technowizardry.

This was mentioned before your rolled for psionic abilities, implying that they could do that even if not psionic. Especially since any OCC could be psionic and use TW if that was the requirement. Since the non-psis lacked ISP and could not cast spells, they would probably have to find someone else to recharge them.

This sort of became a moot point with later devices where you didn't need to know a particular energy spell to recharge the weapons, simply pump in raw PPE. In RMB the only things I recall working that way were the body armor / vehicle enchantments.

20% of Cyber-Knights were non-psionic. Looking at RMB, I could see getting the impression that if you were that 20% you cold not even make the psi-sword. I don't recall when they clarified that even the non-psychic knights could do the swords too, perhaps SoT4 but possibly earlier. I seem to recall an NPC knight who lost his psi and couldn't do the sword in JU though.
Post Reply

Return to “Rifts®”