does Armageddon Unlimited imply Rifts' cataclysm was DEMONS?

[Axelmania]

I seem to recall people speculating that maybe the Minion War had some hand in the world war and nuke-launching, based upon them doing something to that effect in this sourcebook.

I think there was also an evil goddess in Pantheons who had a note about how she would be a mistress to 2 nations' presidents and then have them launch missiles at each other and then vanish and laugh...

Couldn't someone like her have been behind causing the world war?

I don't recall this ever specifically being said but... has it ever been explicitly denied?

[Greepnak]

Chaos Earth makes it seem like just a bad case of everything going wrong at the same time. My campaign I am trying to get various gods a lot more involved and incarnate, so I could see that notion being a good story hook though

[kaid]

Yes from chaos earth it seems like a bad case of once the initial trigger event opened the magical flood gates it was a case of everything possible and a great deal impossible things unleashing all at once. It is possible some outside force helped move events along but in the end it was a small scale conflict that happened at just the wrong time and then escalated past any beings ability to control.

Even if some outside force wanted something to happen I can't imagine the cataclysm was their intent because suddenly they would be flooded with other competition of every size and variety to challenge any claim they wanted to make.

[glitterboy2098]

Megaverse builder establishes that the Heroes Unlimited universe is a completely different dimension from rifts earth, with different physics and flow of time. Tolkeen actually attempted to recruit heroes and villains from it to assist them against the CS.

so no, a demon deciiding to play two factions against each other there does not give implications for Chaos earth/rifts earth.

[Nekira Sudacne]

Demons and demon armies have been mentioned as happening around the apocalypse, yes. demons were not just the only thing

[desepchun]

I've always had a idea for a N&SS campaign where someone had developed tech to open gates to other areas of the world. Campaign ends with party trying to stop a nuke from being dropped off in Wash DC, but they fail and resulting explosion takes place in both sides of the gate and through the hole itself causing the Rifts to break open.

Just don't forget the golden rule in Palladium, if you don't like it don't use it.

[Axelmania]

Chaos Earth makes it seem like just a bad case of everything going wrong at the same time.

That's how it's always SEEMED, sure, but I'm kinda wondering if word-of-god humanity alone was ever blamed by this by the authors, explicitly excepting the possibility of outside engineering.

It is possible some outside force helped move events along but in the end it was a small scale conflict that happened at just the wrong time and then escalated past any beings ability to control.

If in the end an outside force caused that perfect conflict and tailored conditions for escalation, that's a pretty big deal. They may not have wanted to control it.

Even if some outside force wanted something to happen I can't imagine the cataclysm was their intent because suddenly they would be flooded with other competition of every size and variety to challenge any claim they wanted to make.

They might see that as worth the enhanced powers they got, without which dominating humans was hard. Isn't being able to annihilate humans with MD blasts and utterly shrug off mundane attacks pretty alluring?

Demons and demon armies have been mentioned as happening around the apocalypse, yes. demons were not just the only thing

I know the Rifts brought everything, I'm more interested in beings already present and engineering the war and the cataclysm happening, what we know in regards to the possibility.

[Greepnak]

Chaos Earth makes it seem like just a bad case of everything going wrong at the same time.

That's how it's always SEEMED, sure, but I'm kinda wondering if word-of-god humanity alone was ever blamed by this by the authors, explicitly excepting the possibility of outside engineering.

It is possible some outside force helped move events along but in the end it was a small scale conflict that happened at just the wrong time and then escalated past any beings ability to control.

If in the end an outside force caused that perfect conflict and tailored conditions for escalation, that's a pretty big deal. They may not have wanted to control it.

Even if some outside force wanted something to happen I can't imagine the cataclysm was their intent because suddenly they would be flooded with other competition of every size and variety to challenge any claim they wanted to make.

They might see that as worth the enhanced powers they got, without which dominating humans was hard. Isn't being able to annihilate humans with MD blasts and utterly shrug off mundane attacks pretty alluring?

Demons and demon armies have been mentioned as happening around the apocalypse, yes. demons were not just the only thing

I know the Rifts brought everything, I'm more interested in beings already present and engineering the war and the cataclysm happening, what we know in regards to the possibility.

I like the ideas here. demons on earth want to make Earth a high-magic zone, succeed astoundingly by manipulating events to all happen in the worst way they could at the worst time.

[Axelmania]

Or evil gods, or alien intelligences. Who says humanity did this on their own?