Breaking Rifts.

[ShadowLogan]

I think you have a strangely high estimate of how often SAMAS get damaged.
I'd say that the vast majority of them are used in routine patrols in settled territory.

Now I do not dispute that Axel assumes a high number (majority), but combat damage isn't the only reason you'd send a machine to the repair bay.

Some of the SAMAS are going to be there just for routine maintenance and updates (software patches, new hardware versions, etc) if we look at real world systems. In the real world Aircraft have an expected lifetime (expressed in hours), but they still require maintenance. The SAMAS isn't going to be much different in that way.

I disagree, but let's not focus on that.
The question is what is our current rough pilot-to-vehicle ratio, and would it be a good judgment for a SAMAS-pilot-to-SAMAS ratio?

The CS likely also has suits dedicated for training operations (which likely include both Friend and Foe roles), some of those suits are also likely reserve units to replace units undergoing maintenance or to cover for other losses (pilot error, desertion, black market sales, etc).

Sure.
More than 200k out of 3.2 million?

I don't think we can use the # of SAMAS to determine a pilot:unit ratio. Such a ratio is going to be arbitrary. We don't know what ratio the CS decides upon, or the factors that go into it. I don't think there is any way one can even determine it since we have to determine what qualifies as a pilot.

For example A CS Grunt by their OCC description in RMB/RUE has Robot Combat: Basic. Which technically allow them to operate the SAMAS. Though their OCC does not appear to be authorized for such use. Would they count as a "pilot" or does the Character need to have authorization and more detailed skills to be considered a pilot, can the pilot be via skill pickup OR does it have to be via OCC skills to be counted as a pilot? Not to mention how to handle some of CWC OCCs before new models came out (with them in mind, ex SF) that would reasonably be available.

Something else to consider with the 3.2 million SAMAS being stockpiled. What is their actual condition? Are all of them fully opreational? What is the status of their nuclear reactors?

Its also worth noting that the SAMAS isn't transfered to the ISS, which is a separate organization, but used by it (CWC pg113). So the CS military and CS ISS organization proper stockpile is 1.6million each, and this probably doesn't include FQ (who suceeded around this time). Which results in an easier to work with number for each organization. But it also means that "new" SAMAS models probably are closer to 1.6 million in number in total in theory, but since the unit is still available for use (per pg113), the number of new SAMAS is likely lower.

[Blue_Lion]

While by the RAW the grunt does have robot combat basic and can pilot SAMAS.
*I personally feel it makes no sense with what they where doing. They where making a 11M mechanized infantry and instead of giving them a skill like weapon systems to use vehicle mounted weapons they gave them robot combat basic that is stated as focusing on piloting. (They also are missing the prerequisite.) Do you really want your tank and APC troops not to have training to use the main gun by default. The weapon system skill would also allow them to be gunners in robot without them needing the extra training to pilot them. (Some might argue they are back up pilots but they lack any default weapon training for using the power armor and robot weapons systems.)

[Blue_Lion]

I get it you hate the CS always winning. Have a nice day.

He's not WRONG per se...but his answer is boring.

So after stripping off Prosek's Plot Armor, what happens? Well...

-First, it depends on the troops and their gear. Are we talking deadboys? Are we talking demons? Are we talking a horde of Golems equipped with magically-reloading rail guns and controlled remotely by minor AI targeteers and some human/d-bee squad commanders?

-Second, their gear. Same basic question.

-Third, Oh no,the minion war.

Actually, let's fast-forward past that. What happens when a giant army stomps in to the walled cities of the Coalition States, plants their flag, and occupies?

A: Massive losses from the fighting mean major breakdowns in the social order. The militarized police are largely dead or imprisoned, the people are terrified of their inevitable doom at the hands of the unspeakably evil magic aliens demons, and a lot of families just lost their primary breadwinner(s) because the most common way to earn a paycheck and feed your family in the CS (or any large-military state like that) is "being a soldier" and you just killed or imprisoned all of them.

So, you now have a lot of mouths to feed who are trained to bite your hand when you try to feed them, or talk to them, or stand 10 feet away from them...there's just a lot of biting happening.

B: The FoM has some real @#$*-wizards who are actual wizards in it. If memory serves the City of Brass has a robust slave-raiding-from-the-coalition market, and they AIN'T just gonna stop because you removed the main obstacles to that business. They're going to step it up. A magic civil war is in the cards if things go badly enough.

C: Everybody else starts caring. From the Splugorth to FQ, the Coalition is a shining beacon of distraction and dissension keeping the good-aligned power-players from building up a force and being bad for business.

D: To HWalsh it up for a second, the Techno-wizard is officially evil as can be. I finally started looking over The Sorcerer's Revenge and from all I could find the "Evil, unconscionable acts" that made Tolkeen so irredeemable and abandoned by its allies were freakin' nothing. They hit legitimate military targets and crushed ALL resistance without mercy, as happens in war. The only logical conclusion is that if you engage in actual warfare against the CS, that is an objectively evil act as defined by the Rifts Alignment system.

You asking about the troops that he provided when I have him in play. Allot of it is not on the books but forces include magic uses, Cloned Commandos(of a friend of the CS emperor that was lost heroically during the original battle with FoM), genetically engineered super natural troops like Deveil Dog boys, or Brodkill dragon hybrids. (He has access to gene splicer tech.)

Equipment they have advanced magical and TW access. Done more with special brand of TW aproach. He(and his clones) know all invocation spells 1-15. The entire force he provides use TW or other magical gear. Jets that can magically cloak, tanks that are protected by magic, PA that can teleport, Bows that can make you fall in love, missile that can summon demons, robots that regenerate like golems. (he started out as a high level TW challenge how would a tw with high level spells and skills do TW.)

[boring7]

That's a lot of "I eatz da peeplz" soldiery if I'm not mistaken. Additionally the clones are going to have the usual identity issues.

[Blue_Lion]

That's a lot of "I eatz da peeplz" soldiery if I'm not mistaken. Additionally the clones are going to have the usual identity issues.

Usual identity issue?

[boring7]

That's a lot of "I eatz da peeplz" soldiery if I'm not mistaken. Additionally the clones are going to have the usual identity issues.

Usual identity issue?

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CloningBlues

Basically, you have an army of clones. Whatever their upbringing and memories they are now surrounded by people that are extremely similar to them, they are considered by many to be "just a copy, not a real person", and they were created, essentially, to be expendable. The sense of identity in such a situation becomes a major thing, a thing people will agonize over, commit murder over. The issues can roll as many ways as their are clones, which is probably ironic on some level, or at least oddly coincidental.

They might see themselves as the new master race. They might see themselves as shallow copies and be depressed at not being "real". They might begin acting out just to try and establish themselves as NOT being identical. They might develop a new religion based on the idea that their soul was shattered and split amongst them and only by being the protectors of the human race can their soul be reunited.

I don't want to just go on forever, but TVtropes has a lot of examples of exploring the concept (as well as related tropes) if you want to watch/read more takes on it. I think a lot of the writers of the Star Wars Clone Wars material did a pretty good job of exploring some of the concepts (at least what I watched of the TV series and video games, admittedly I didn't watch much) of what it means to be one of thousands or millions of genetically identical people who were born and bred for battle.

Swinging us back around, though, unless I'm mistaken most of the troops are pretty good at slaughter but pretty bad at self-control. They stand a good chance of slaughtering the entire Coalition Army but then just starting to devour the CS proper rather than conquer and protect it.

That's above and beyond the normal problems with nation-building, which I'm going to leave on the table for a moment (short version, we just beat our heads against that wall in Iraq and Afghanistan for over a decade).

[Blue_Lion]

With a crazy person providing troops to a terrorist group do you think any one was worried about control?

(the idea is a it a time when armies can not stop the bad guy. It takes small band of heroes.)

[boring7]

Ah, well in *that* case...everybody dies.

Well, maybe not everybody dies, but you end up with your own army and whatever allies you have factionalizing and turning on each other while the CS population is slaughtered en masse. The human clone army is probably equipped with some badass stuff, and they're probably going to watch the people-eating and general monstering and fire the first shot of what becomes known as "the Mage War" or "The Magic Civil War" depending on who you ask.