New CS armor on cover of Rifts Canada

[Tor]

The inside description of the cover says that these are Tundra Rangers defending one of their strongholds...

The CS armor (particularly since it is the new type) stands out like a sore thumb and I was wondering how people interpreted its presence, and it I might be overlooking any hints within the book as to how to interpret the scene.

Is it possible that Coalition soldiers may be helping to defend a Tundra stronghold? Or could this possibly be one of the attackers who the Rangers are defending against. To me, it looks more like he is facing their enemies than facing them though, based on the direction everyone is oriented in.

I guess it could possibly be a ranger dressed in stolen or fenced armor, but it seems unlikely since that is the new form which hasn't been around very long, so it would be very hard to get ahold of.

Plus in that case, or even in the case of someone going AWOL and leaving the CS to join the TRs, wouldn't they try to disguise their armor, maybe repaint it, add some new adornments, etc. to fit in better and avoid pissing off the CS by showing off their stolen cutting-edge tech?

[eliakon]

1) Art really isn't Canon
2) Its just a picture
3) There are a lot of people with stolen/salvaged suits of armor out there. Its not like most people can afford to be picky about stuff
4) The armor has been out now for what? 4 years 5? With prototypes being tested for a good year or so before that? With fielding in a major war recently? So yah its not exactly 'ultra new, exotic, rare' anymore.
5) Canada is a bit remote....its pretty unlikely that the CS is going to exactly KNOW that some one has a suit of their armor up their.....they are not omniscient after all.

[glitterboy2098]

the skull inside the maple leaf on the 'tundra rangers' is problematic as well..

[Alrik Vas]

They're all bros, get over it. *humanity hug*

[taalismn]

I always assumed it was a retasked painting....they were all originally supposed to be Coalition troopers at a icecap outpost(maybe during the Free Quebec war?) when the demeanor of the book changed from CS/Free Quebec-centric to Canada in general.

[SolCannibal]

I always assumed it was a retasked painting....they were all originally supposed to be Coalition troopers at a icecap outpost(maybe during the Free Quebec war?) when the demeanor of the book changed from CS/Free Quebec-centric to Canada in general.

My impression too, the little skulls and CS soldier make it mightly suspicious indeed.

[Kagashi]

Plus their energy weapons being "version of early CS weaponry" shouldnt be accurate either. They should flat out have NEMA weaponry, Japanese weaponry, or New Navy weaponry as the text describes that Canada didnt make their own weapons and purchased them from the United States and Japan. Plus, this came out before Chaos Earth, which Canada was one third of the NEMA and those weapons should be included as well, or at least have access to them.

But I suspect the pic on the cover was originally supposed to be a "CS North" unit (Free Quebec or Iron Hearth troops perhaps) that used CS weapon, hence the CS armor, skull in the leaf, and the fact they have a C-27 and C-14 in action. This would also explain why the CS troop is behind the firing line as if he were on their team.

Explaining the picture after available source material can still be explained as well. 1) they dont have to use NEMA, old American or old Japanese tech and could have acquired the C-27 and C-14 after the fact. 2) the CS troop could still be on their "team". Perhaps they are combating Calgary monsters/demons or Xiticix and are in an alliance for this engagement. 3) A skull can be a common symbol and does not *have* to be Coalition.

Either that or that CS grunt has the drop on the elite Canadian protectors and his going to go Prosek on those dirty thieves of his nations technology.

[SolCannibal]

Explaining the picture after available source material can still be explained as well.
1) they dont have to use NEMA, old American or old Japanese tech and could have acquired the C-27 and C-14 after the fact.
2) the CS troop could still be on their "team". Perhaps they are combating Calgary monsters/demons or Xiticix and are in an alliance for this engagement.
3) A skull can be a common symbol and does not *have* to be Coalition.

True in all cases, though truth be told i wasn't even thinking of weaponry details and such.

Number 3 in particular is quite relevant in general - if a unit from BOPE, one of the SWAT equivalents in my country, could be easily be mistaken for a CS-related group if it was 'ported to Rifts Earth, no matter how unrelated.
Not to mention the more than obvious.

[Tor]

1) Art really isn't Canon
2) Its just a picture

I disagree on these points, and don't find your stance adequately sourced.

I'm particularly confused by it in cases where pictures have captions or descriptions affixed to them (as this cover does) since that is text.

3) There are a lot of people with stolen/salvaged suits of armor out there. Its not like most people can afford to be picky about stuff

I'm clearly aware of that, I'm pointing out that this is the new top-secret CWC armor though, too new to have many stolen or salvaged, making it travelling that far north odd. FQ did not have this stuff so I'm led to think maybe Iron Heart.

4) The armor has been out now for what? 4 years 5? With prototypes being tested for a good year or so before that? With fielding in a major war recently? So yah its not exactly 'ultra new, exotic, rare' anymore.

Not sure about 'now', the key thing would be the time lapse between CWC and Canada. The top-secret prototypes prior to official reveal are extremely unlikely to be stolen or salvaged since they were being managed by special forces.

its pretty unlikely that the CS is going to exactly KNOW that some one has a suit of their armor up their.....they are not omniscient after all.

This one is standing on top of a base though, it's not like it's being used in a field op, it's in clear view alongside tundra rangers defending a TR base.

the skull inside the maple leaf on the 'tundra rangers' is problematic as well..

Dat Iron Heart (Sudbury) Tundra Rangers connect..

TRIH?

Plus their energy weapons being "version of early CS weaponry" shouldnt be accurate either. They should flat out have NEMA weaponry, Japanese weaponry, or New Navy weaponry as the text describes that Canada didnt make their own weapons and purchased them from the United States and Japan.

I think the book mentions that the Tundra Rangers have made knockoffs of all the CS items from the Main Book but not of the new tech in CWC.

[eliakon]

1) Art really isn't Canon
2) Its just a picture

I disagree on these points, and don't find your stance adequately sourced.

I'm particularly confused by it in cases where pictures have captions or descriptions affixed to them (as this cover does) since that is text.

*shrugs* I know you don't like the stance. But since there is absolutely nothing written anywhere that says that art IS canon I find the stance that it must be canon to be flawed. A description is nice, but since we KNOW that some art is of things that do not match the actual game stats, I just assume that the art is meant to help visualize things. This is especially important when you look at some of the more...surreal art in some of the books. Does this mean that races change? Does this mean that the weird, off scale things are how the world is laid out? Or does it mean that...its just art? The world may never know. Now if there is some source that states that Art is Canon I would look at it. Until that time then I am not going to consider it canon.

[Tor]

Where does it say that all text within a book is canon?

I believe that's something we just inherently take for granted because it's the book, and art is also the book.

Like where does it say "the IQ we give to Erin Tarn is canon" or whatev?

Conflicts do not disprove art, text often conflicts with other text just as it might with art. Art has more flexible interpretation in case of conflicts to resolve it when necessary, but where it isn't, Occam's Razor can be used.

[Blue_Lion]

Given that the tundra ranges makes use of non humans some known as cannibals it is more likely a CS attack than CS help. As the main cannon is facing a different direction than the soldiers are facing they may be facing attacks from multiple directions.

Non CS personal is also likely.
Theft of CS gear happens really fast. There is a hook line and sinker of a garrison getting robed as soon as it gets issued. CS military has a issue with desertion while not critical levels of significant loss man power it does happen. A deserter could head north or the gear sold north by the black market, or just some poor Slob got caught in a random earth to earth rift.

Not sure where off the top of my head but I do remember that text triumphs art as KS gives artist creative flexibility. This means that art by it self is not cannon and does not need to fallow cannon closely.

By the way Tor where is the caption description of the cover all I see is a tittle. If it says tundra ranger defends with help of CS then the CS soldier is helping if it does not that is not a likely reason for the CS armor. But as I have no description of what the seen is suppose to be to define and it give meaning it is just a peace of art meant to sell a book, and does not have a deeper impact than that on the game.

[kaid]

As some have mentioned with the upgrades to the new standard CS gear a LOT of their older gear has "fallen off the back of the hover truck" so it would not be uncommon at all for merc forces/raiders/brigands with the funds to pick up all or parts of CS body armors off the black market.

[SolCannibal]

As some have mentioned with the upgrades to the new standard CS gear a LOT of their older gear has "fallen off the back of the hover truck" so it would not be uncommon at all for merc forces/raiders/brigands with the funds to pick up all or parts of CS body armors off the black market.

Indeed - in a game i played a minor state in the border of the Magic Zone collected so much of that surplus they decided in the end to just replicate it in blue without spikes and skulls for their own army standard gear.

[eliakon]

As some have mentioned with the upgrades to the new standard CS gear a LOT of their older gear has "fallen off the back of the hover truck" so it would not be uncommon at all for merc forces/raiders/brigands with the funds to pick up all or parts of CS body armors off the black market.

Indeed - in a game i played a minor state in the border of the Magic Zone collected so much of that surplus they decided in the end to just replicate it in blue without spikes and skulls for their own army standard gear.

I suspect that the 'old CS' stuff is going to end up like 'old US gear' or 'old Russian gear' and will be the standard issue for most client states, and vaguely aligned nations.

[SolCannibal]

As some have mentioned with the upgrades to the new standard CS gear a LOT of their older gear has "fallen off the back of the hover truck" so it would not be uncommon at all for merc forces/raiders/brigands with the funds to pick up all or parts of CS body armors off the black market.

Indeed - in a game i played a minor state in the border of the Magic Zone collected so much of that surplus they decided in the end to just replicate it in blue without spikes and skulls for their own army standard gear.

I suspect that the 'old CS' stuff is going to end up like 'old US gear' or 'old Russian gear' and will be the standard issue for most client states, and vaguely aligned nations.

Indeed - in the game's case it was pretty ironic considering the "Alliance" ended up becoming a 3rd minor front in the CS' wars along with Tolkeen and Free Quebec.