You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

You are on your own. The Army is MIA and our government is gone! There are no communications of any kind. Cities and towns have gone dark, and zombies fill the streets. The dead have risen and it would seem to be the end of the world. Help me, Mommy!

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What would you do?

Use your "Last bullet" on one of the zombies behind you?
6
25%
Use your "Last bullet" on the guy beside you, sacrificing him to get away?
12
50%
Use your "Last bullet" on yourself, killing yourself to dodge pain of death and becoming a zombie?
6
25%
 
Total votes: 24

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Pepsi Jedi
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You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Pepsi Jedi »

This week's Walking Dead brought up a rather intresting moral question.

Spoiler:
In the episode, towards the end, one of the main characters is wounded. he's got a hurt leg. He is trying to escape a group of zombies. 20 to 50 strong. He is with another man, a rather.... we'll call him rotund. The rotund man isn't a part of the main character's group. And they're both trying to escape the zombies. They're running low on ammo. One or two shots left... no where in sight to hide. They're limping and jogging about 20 feet in front of the zombies, (( Whom seem to alternate between runners and shamblers depending on the point in the episode, but for now.. shamblers)). The main char looks to the fat guy, and just up and shoots him in the leg. The fat guy clearly shocked tries to fight back as the main character strips him of gear and leaves him there for a zombie distracting snack.

This brings up the old scuba diving addage, 'You scuba in pairs... not to share air, but incase of sharks. When the shark shows up, you don't have to out swim the shark. Just out swim the other guy with you" (Implying the shark will eat the slower human)

The question is, in such a situation, would you purposefully use your last bullet to wound the guy beside you, and gget away? Would you fight to the last, using your last bullet on one of the 20 to 50 zombies behind you..... would you use your last bullet on yourself, ((Shooting yourself in the head so you don't become a zombie, and escape the pain of being a zombie snack))
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by azazel1024 »

I'd leave the last round for myself if it looked like it was the end. Its not that I wouldn't put myself first, but at the same time I wouldn't intentionally murder someone else just to save my own skin (which is basically what happened), unless that person was basically trying to kill me (directly or indirectly). By the same token, unless it is basically my wife or kids or some other close family member, I also wouldn't sacrafice my life for someone else's. I'd take risks to help someone, but I wouldn't stick myself in a situation where I knew I'd deffinitely be zombie munchies just to save someone elses neck.

The only part I didn't like is, considering the number, I can't imagine all of them would have just swarmed the one dude. Take a hundred or so of them and I'd imagine a few would keep going after the other live meat.
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Severus Snape »

I can't answer this because it depends on the situation.

If I'm in a situation and it's me or my wife's survival, I sacrifice myself to insure that she lives at least a little longer. There's no question there.

If I'm in a situation and it's me or a friend's/acquaintance's survival, the friend gets it. Sorry, but if I've done everything I can to get both of us out and we're still screwed, he's nothing more than dead weight to me at that point.

If I'm in a situation and I'm not only going to die, but everyone else around me is pretty screwed too, then I'm saving my last bullet for my wife. I'll die at the hands of zed and let her do the honors of ending her own life. If she isn't there, then I'm ending my own life.

Too many variables to answer the question. It really does depend on the situation.

And one more thing to throw out there for this question: Shane and Otis were at a high school, which is something I would never even think of volunteering to do given the imminent danger in just going there. Shane and Otis put themselves in a situation where this was going to happen (ok, so the writers put them there, but bear with me), and the only way either of them could get out is for one of them to be a decoy/distraction for the zombies. In the situation they were in, Shane obviously could move faster even though he was injured, and Otis was slowing him down. Getting the supplies back to the farm (which, for some reason, is immune to the outbreak, and that's an entirely different story) was the most important thing, and there isn't any law that says everyone has to make it back safely, even if it means endangering the overall mission. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few...or the one. Although, in this case, it was because of the one that they were out there...but I digress.

The simple point is that they put themselves in that situation, and Shane came to the only conclusion that could lead to either of them surviving to get back to the farm: someone had to be sacrificed. If Shane sacrifices himself, Otis probably still dies. If Otis is sacrificed, there's a better chance of Shane making it back (which he did).

I also have to agree with azazel1024 that the sheer number of zombies bearing down on Otis was far too many. Some of them should have kept going after Shane. Maybe some did and we just didn't see it. But after the first 20 or so zeds that started munching on Otis they should have kept going as (based on DR rules) PPE is no longer in Otis, and the only source is running away.
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Pepsi Jedi »

Well at the point that he shot the guy there wern't "That many" Zombies still on thheir tail. maybe 20 to 30. It's way more than you want after you but wasn't the 100s they started with.

And the "Walking dead"s Zombies have shown a heavy "Swarm to eat" instinct. Remember the horse?
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Pepsi Jedi »

Severus Snape wrote:I can't answer this because it depends on the situation.

If I'm in a situation and it's me or my wife's survival, I sacrifice myself to insure that she lives at least a little longer. There's no question there.

If I'm in a situation and it's me or a friend's/acquaintance's survival, the friend gets it. Sorry, but if I've done everything I can to get both of us out and we're still screwed, he's nothing more than dead weight to me at that point.

If I'm in a situation and I'm not only going to die, but everyone else around me is pretty screwed too, then I'm saving my last bullet for my wife. I'll die at the hands of zed and let her do the honors of ending her own life. If she isn't there, then I'm ending my own life.

Too many variables to answer the question. It really does depend on the situation.

And one more thing to throw out there for this question: Shane and Otis were at a high school, which is something I would never even think of volunteering to do given the imminent danger in just going there. Shane and Otis put themselves in a situation where this was going to happen (ok, so the writers put them there, but bear with me), and the only way either of them could get out is for one of them to be a decoy/distraction for the zombies. In the situation they were in, Shane obviously could move faster even though he was injured, and Otis was slowing him down. Getting the supplies back to the farm (which, for some reason, is immune to the outbreak, and that's an entirely different story) was the most important thing, and there isn't any law that says everyone has to make it back safely, even if it means endangering the overall mission. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few...or the one. Although, in this case, it was because of the one that they were out there...but I digress.

The simple point is that they put themselves in that situation, and Shane came to the only conclusion that could lead to either of them surviving to get back to the farm: someone had to be sacrificed. If Shane sacrifices himself, Otis probably still dies. If Otis is sacrificed, there's a better chance of Shane making it back (which he did).

I also have to agree with azazel1024 that the sheer number of zombies bearing down on Otis was far too many. Some of them should have kept going after Shane. Maybe some did and we just didn't see it. But after the first 20 or so zeds that started munching on Otis they should have kept going as (based on DR rules) PPE is no longer in Otis, and the only source is running away.



The situation was given. You, injured and moving slowly, with a fat guy, NOT of "your group" also moving slowly. I didn't bring in anyone's wife and kids and stuff. lol Goin' a little deeper than was projected there. :)
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by azazel1024 »

Fatty probably gets a bullet if you water it down to that.
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by King Newt »

Shane was a coward for what he did. Plain and simple. They had a bit of distance on the zombies, so there had to be other options. I would never of done that and doubt that I could of. Among the zombies were National Guard soldiers and police officers, so chances are that there were more weapons to be found. I just can't see me doing that. I can see myself volunteering to go to the school to get the supplies that Carl needed, but I might of done things different.

Watching the last episode i told my wife that he knee capped the guys way before they revealed what he did. Shane is just a coward and he's the kind of guy who could do it. Like leaving his friend to die in the hospital and not come back for him.

I am really enjoying this season of Walking Dead, it's definitely becoming one of my favorite shows.
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Severus Snape »

Pepsi Jedi wrote:The situation was given. You, injured and moving slowly, with a fat guy, NOT of "your group" also moving slowly. I didn't bring in anyone's wife and kids and stuff. lol Goin' a little deeper than was projected there. :)

Yeah, missed that. In the case that was given...

Fat-ass takes a bullet so I can escape. He's not family, and he's slowing me down. If I have to sacrifice him so I can live, that's too bad for him. He should have hit the gym once or twice before the outbreak instead of focusing on Big Macs and watching WWE.
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by azazel1024 »

What is it, rule #5, do cardio?

OR is #5 seatbelts and #4 is cardio?
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by dargo83 »

cardio is #1 seatbelts is #4
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Silveressa »

If it's just those 3 options then aye, lardy gets the high speed lead injection.

If there's room for creativity then a fire extinguisher near on the wall gets the bullet creating a small cloud of powder that will hopefully blind/distract/slow down the zombies long enough to make a cleaner get away. (Assuming they're not DR life seeing Z's anyway.)
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by MurderCityDisciple »

I would be the fat guy in this equation...so I'd shoot slim shady before he could shoot me.
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Pepsi Jedi »

MurderCityDisciple wrote:I would be the fat guy in this equation...so I'd shoot slim shady before he could shoot me.


lol This cracked me up, and I can relate.
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by azazel1024 »

I'd be a small target for you to hit :-)
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Beatmeclever »

Seriously, they just needed a smaller grocery list and a well thought out infiltration/exfiltration plan. There might have been NO reason to send two men into the site for the supplies. Just one to man the vehicle and one to secure the material.
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Pepsi Jedi »

Probably one of those pesky things like.... the one guy was fat and scared, but knew where it was and what the stuff needed looked like, and the other one was hunky and a cop and a hero character in the series.... and.. they needed someone to die... so the fat guy got the red shirt treatment?

Seriously though, Shane didn't know where it was and couldn't have found the gear, and the fat guy needed someone to cover his back. That part isn't that confusing.
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by MurderCityDisciple »

Beatmeclever wrote:Seriously, they just needed a smaller grocery list and a well thought out infiltration/exfiltration plan. There might have been NO reason to send two men into the site for the supplies. Just one to man the vehicle and one to secure the material.


Yeah drive a big loud monster truck around the parking lot and run over the horde of zombies, while the other bloke goes in and gets the supplies.

Or even better, first use the thumper (ala Dune) method and play a CD of a crying baby a quater mile or so away, that should really thin out the ranks.

I think it wouldactually be an interesting series of scenarios for a DR game to actually do the same missions as the Walking Dead do, only do it your way and compare the results.
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Illendaver »

I am the tubby one of the group (At 350 lbs I think I qualify) but I can still keep up with the skinny people in my group. I wrestled in high school (which has a surprising amount of running involved) and I work out at least once a week for the last 6 years since then. I used to work on the family farm, but I had a daughter a few years ago and have moved away and become a full time stay at home dad since then. I can see the big change this has made on me (Gained 75 lbs in two years, don't get nearly as much exercise as I used to) but I know that I can and will still snap your god#!&% neck if you shoot me and then try to take my gear. I don't have cable, but from the description they did that fat guy all wrong. He should have been dead in the first 15 min.
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Zamion138 »

blowing your own brains out is the right thing to do, one less future zombie and inless whos running next to you is a peice of scum well they deserve anouther try....
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Vrykolas2k »

Bye-bye, fat guy.
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by ZINO »

sacrificing him
let your YES be YES and your NO be NO but plz no maybe
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Oberoth »

Thing is Shane may have done that for more than just selfish survival. What would have happened if no one had returned with the medical supplies for Carl? It's obvious that Shane cares for Carl more than any other person in the group. It shows a certain humanity that he still clings to. Perhaps this was a way for him to make sure Carl got what he needed to live while still surviving himself?

(Again I will emphasize that if they kill Shane, witch they will eventually, they will most likely stay true to the comic. Either way Carl will put a bullet in him. Live by the gun, die by the gun)
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by Severus Snape »

Ok, so the next new episode is the 12th of February, and I can't wait. And I had to re-read through this topic because, well, I can't get enough of the show. With that said...

My answer stays the same. Fat boy gets it so I can live and get the stuff back to the farm. Then again, I wouldn't have been stupid enough to run into a school filled with zed trying to recover some item that may or may not save Carl assuming I can get back to the farm before he dies. Although I was a little shocked at first, I don't blame Shane for looking out for #1.
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by azazel1024 »

Here is my thing.

Molotov cocktails. Come on, seriously, the zeds aren't all that fast moving and its not like they are going to go running around trying to bat out the flames. They couldn't have/wouldn't have put together a few molotovs before going after the supplies? Sure it takes awhile for something the size of a human to burn up, or at least burn up enough to disable something that can feel no pain, can't die of shock or blood loss. That said, crisp up a zombie for a minute or so and it won't be able to see and should start doing enough muscle damage that it can't move anymore not long after. A good toss with a molotov should easily be able to "coat" 5 or 6 zombies in a group enough that they'll burn up after a couple of minutes.

The big groups they saw at the school, toss half a dozen molotovs and they could probably have "burned down" 50 zombies or more all in a big group and spreading the flames among each other.

Also, why so little ammo? We know Shane's posse has a fair amount of ammo. Not unlimited, but with recovery of the guns and ammo they should have at least had enough for him to have had a shotgun or rifle with a hundred plus rounds with him in case they really ran in to it (which they did).
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Re: You don't have to swim faster than the shark....

Unread post by psam_rage »

Walking dead zombies? I shoot a zombie and a keep running.
Dead Reign, I keep running and save the bullet till I'm out of options.
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