Need help with Simultaneous Attacks, please!

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MechaTC
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Need help with Simultaneous Attacks, please!

Unread post by MechaTC »

I'm sorry if this is some kind of noob question of something, but I want to specify something really important about SA in Heroes Unlimited. Is that suppose to be exactly hand-to-hand or weapon attack like punch, slash, shoot etc or character can use his superpowers? If latter is the thing, can character use some of his powers to defend himself?

Situation 1. Someone attack psionic character with Mentally Possess Other. Can psionic actually let his opponent strike, but use this opportunity to touch him and thus activate the possession?

Situation 2. Someone attack bearer of Magnetism power with metallic weapon. Can this mutant use Simultaneous Attack and perform Repel Metal Object to stop opponent's weapon?

This is somewhat new to me, so it would be nice to have someones advice) Also... Being master of magnetism and be killed by metal is really embarassing, if you ask me :D
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Re: Need help with Simultaneous Attacks, please!

Unread post by Stone Gargoyle »

Initiative kind of rules out simultaneous attacks. You can defend yourself by dodging, parrying or grabbing someone as they attack you as a defense to an attack, but you would still be the second action in each instance and not simultaneous. At least that is how I understand it.
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Re: Need help with Simultaneous Attacks, please!

Unread post by Sir_Spirit »

MechaTC wrote:I'm sorry if this is some kind of noob question of something, but I want to specify something really important about SA in Heroes Unlimited. Is that suppose to be exactly hand-to-hand or weapon attack like punch, slash, shoot etc or character can use his superpowers? If latter is the thing, can character use some of his powers to defend himself?

Situation 1. Someone attack psionic character with Mentally Possess Other. Can psionic actually let his opponent strike, but use this opportunity to touch him and thus activate the possession?

Situation 2. Someone attack bearer of Magnetism power with metallic weapon. Can this mutant use Simultaneous Attack and perform Repel Metal Object to stop opponent's weapon?

This is somewhat new to me, so it would be nice to have someones advice) Also... Being master of magnetism and be killed by metal is really embarassing, if you ask me :D


1) Yes.
2)This requires a roll, but wouldn't be an attack per se, just a parry[parry variant? maybe], basically.
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Re: Need help with Simultaneous Attacks, please!

Unread post by MechaTC »

Sir_Spirit wrote:
MechaTC wrote:I'm sorry if this is some kind of noob question of something, but I want to specify something really important about SA in Heroes Unlimited. Is that suppose to be exactly hand-to-hand or weapon attack like punch, slash, shoot etc or character can use his superpowers? If latter is the thing, can character use some of his powers to defend himself?

Situation 1. Someone attack psionic character with Mentally Possess Other. Can psionic actually let his opponent strike, but use this opportunity to touch him and thus activate the possession?

Situation 2. Someone attack bearer of Magnetism power with metallic weapon. Can this mutant use Simultaneous Attack and perform Repel Metal Object to stop opponent's weapon?

This is somewhat new to me, so it would be nice to have someones advice) Also... Being master of magnetism and be killed by metal is really embarassing, if you ask me :D


1) Yes.
2)This requires a roll, but wouldn't be an attack per se, just a parry[parry variant? maybe], basically.


Thanks)
Can you tell more about parrying with superpowers, please? Problem is I didn't find anything about it( Basically it's just natural for superhuman to block that way, but... Will it be just parrying with bare hands, which is pointless, or a regular block with all bonuses applied? Will that cost an attack? Because user of HtH can block for free, but most superpowers has cost of one or even more attacks
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Re: Need help with Simultaneous Attacks, please!

Unread post by jaymz »

1 - yes. You do not have to actually defend yourself

2 - if you are in touch range then yes you can do a simultaneous attack that effectively allows you to do as you ask.


It is no different than allowing someone to shoot you while you in return shoot them by foregoing your right to defend yourself.

Nowhere does it specify what the incoming attack is to be nor does it specify what you are limited to doing in regards to your own attack in return.

That is why many of us feel simultaneous attack should not be allowed as it effectively ignores initiative and those with the damage capacity to jus take hits can just simultaneous attack all the time as long as they themselves have attacks left and since many supers have auto dodge (no action cost) and parry is usually a free action, why would you NOT do simultaneous attack if you could since it allows you to attack without waiting for your turn in the initiative order?
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Re: Need help with Simultaneous Attacks, please!

Unread post by Razorwing »

When one performs a simultaneous attack, they are forfeiting any kind of defense against that attack that requires a conscious effort to make (Armor ratings are natural and still apply). Most likely this means that the one making the simultaneous attack WILL take damage from the attack leveled against him, but is also likely to deal damage to his attacker who can't defend against this attack.

However, there are some limitations to this.

1) it is an attack and thus will cost the one making the simultaneous attack an action/attack for that melee round. Just because one can parry or even dodge without using up an attack per melee doesn't mean that one can attack for free by forfeiting that defense.

2) You can only attack the one that is attacking you. Your focus is on the one that is attacking you at that moment, so they are the only one you can attack... even if it is at range.

3) Yes, if you are being attacked by multiple opponents, you can simultaneously attack each of them when they roll their strike against you, but doing so counts as a separate attack by you... which can drain your attacks quite quickly while leaving them with plenty of attacks for later that you will only be able to parry/dodge (provided you can auto parry/dodge). Additionally, you can only defend against 3 attackers... or simultaneously attack 3... if there is a 4th, then you can not defend against their attack and thus can not simultaneously attack them in return.

While performing a Simultaneous attack can be an advantage, in that it allows the defender to make an umblockable attack outside of his usual initiative, it does come with some hefty prices... namely doing so does use up his attack and he still is likely to take damage (unless he is invulnerable in some way). In one on one combat, this may not matter, but when he is being attacked by multiple opponents... forfeiting one's auto parry may not be the wisest action.

At least this is my take on the subject.
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Re: Need help with Simultaneous Attacks, please!

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

mechanic wrote:I'm sorry if this is some kind of noob question of something, but I want to specify something really important about SA in Heroes Unlimited. Is that suppose to be exactly hand-to-hand or weapon attack like punch, slash, shoot etc or character can use his superpowers? If latter is the thing, can character use some of his powers to defend himself?

Situation 1. Someone attack psionic character with Mentally Possess Other. Can psionic actually let his opponent strike, but use this opportunity to touch him and thus activate the possession?

Situation 2. Someone attack bearer of Magnetism power with metallic weapon. Can this mutant use Simultaneous Attack and perform Repel Metal Object to stop opponent's weapon?

This is somewhat new to me, so it would be nice to have someones advice) Also... Being master of magnetism and be killed by metal is really embarrassing, if you ask me :D

Yes, superpowers can be used in a Simo-Attack
Yes, chars can use their superpower to defend themselves.

Sit 1: this would only work in bare-hand melee. And then….as a GM I would make the psionic to roll vs their ME (or 'something') to see if the hit they take would disrupt the use of their powers.

Sit 2, if the magnetic sup is the one being attacked, just roll a parry to use the power that way.
Sit 2.1: if the magnetic sup wants to mess-up someone attacking someone else, simo attack & APM use. However, this "off-use prescription" needs the Player to be proactive & tell the GM what he wants to do and the GM to allow it.
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Re: Need help with Simultaneous Attacks, please!

Unread post by SittingBull »

In some books, the description of auto-dodge (where it's not a conscious effort), would allow auto-dodge to be used even with simo-strike or dual-strike.
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