Fixes for the Enchanted Object category?

[barna10]

Anyone ever work up someway to make this class more balanced? Useful? Interesting?

It hardly seems to compare to the other Mystical categories yet it requires the same amount of XP to advance....

[eliakon]

Basically....
I would just give it the same boost that the weapons got.

[Regularguy]

Anyone ever work up someway to make this class more balanced? Useful? Interesting?

It hardly seems to compare to the other Mystical categories yet it requires the same amount of XP to advance....

Off the top of my head, giving it two of the choices instead of one might work.

So you'd get a major power and sixteen spells, plus one of the 'other abilities'. Or you'd get a major power and a minor power and nine spells, plus one of the 'other abilities'. Or you'd get a major power and three minor powers, plus one of the 'other abilities'.

Each of those is an option you can't get with the other Mystical categories -- but there are still reasons to take one of the other Mystical categories instead, and options you can only get through them. And there are still reasons to take another power category altogether, too. But I'm willing to bet that more people would go for an Enchanted Object if you could double-dip in the "Magic Spells or Super Abilities" list -- just like I'm willing to bet that not everyone would.

[say652]

While keeping in the Theme of the power category.

Minor Psionics.
Officer school bonuses.

Use Alien Power Category to use an RCC from another world book.

[Glistam]

Here are some ideas I've had but haven't really tried out. All of them together may make the class too overpowered, so pick and choose:

• Allow non-standard magic from other books to be chosen in place of HU2 spells. Elemental/Warlock magic, Frost Magic, Shadow Magic, Nazcan Line magic, Fleshsculpting, Mirror Magic, and Chaos Magic, are all just a few ideas.
• Replace the special ability table with the information in Nightbane Book 2: The Nightlands for their magical artifacts. I would say 1D4 of the "lesser" artifact powers could be appropriate.
• Double the number of super powers allowed, or use the table in the Imbued power category for how many super powers can be selected. These powers still cost P.P.E. and still have the visual effects as noted. Also, remove the restrictions on what powers cannot be selected.
• Allow the character to be a magic-user. Not a Mystic Study, but like a Mystic or Sorcerer as per the Nightbane setting. The Forsaken Mage or Half-Wizard from Palladium Fantasy could be options too, but would require more conversion.
• Allow multiple Magic Items, using the same guidelines as noted in the Super-Invention power category.

[barna10]

Anyone ever work up someway to make this class more balanced? Useful? Interesting?

It hardly seems to compare to the other Mystical categories yet it requires the same amount of XP to advance....

Off the top of my head, giving it two of the choices instead of one might work.

So you'd get a major power and sixteen spells, plus one of the 'other abilities'. Or you'd get a major power and a minor power and nine spells, plus one of the 'other abilities'. Or you'd get a major power and three minor powers, plus one of the 'other abilities'.

Each of those is an option you can't get with the other Mystical categories -- but there are still reasons to take one of the other Mystical categories instead, and options you can only get through them. And there are still reasons to take another power category altogether, too. But I'm willing to bet that more people would go for an Enchanted Object if you could double-dip in the "Magic Spells or Super Abilities" list -- just like I'm willing to bet that not everyone would.

I agree. I was also thinking of allowing a few rolls on the secondary list with one of the additional option that if a result was rolled twice the player could pick any 3rd level or lower spell to use for free and at will. What do you think?

[barna10]

Here are some ideas I've had but haven't really tried out. All of them together may make the class too overpowered, so pick and choose:

• Allow non-standard magic from other books to be chosen in place of HU2 spells. Elemental/Warlock magic, Frost Magic, Shadow Magic, Nazcan Line magic, Fleshsculpting, Mirror Magic, and Chaos Magic, are all just a few ideas.
• Replace the special ability table with the information in Nightbane Book 2: The Nightlands for their magical artifacts. I would say 1D4 of the "lesser" artifact powers could be appropriate.
• Double the number of super powers allowed, or use the table in the Imbued power category for how many super powers can be selected. These powers still cost P.P.E. and still have the visual effects as noted. Also, remove the restrictions on what powers cannot be selected.
• Allow the character to be a magic-user. Not a Mystic Study, but like a Mystic or Sorcerer as per the Nightbane setting. The Forsaken Mage or Half-Wizard from Palladium Fantasy could be options too, but would require more conversion.
• Allow multiple Magic Items, using the same guidelines as noted in the Super-Invention power category.

All good ideas. I was thinking about the "allow the character to be a magic-user" idea as well, but I was thinking of allowing the character to develop casting abilities over time. This seems in-line with many existing comic characters (especially many from the Golden Age).

[Glistam]

Here are some ideas I've had but haven't really tried out. All of them together may make the class too overpowered, so pick and choose:

• Allow non-standard magic from other books to be chosen in place of HU2 spells. Elemental/Warlock magic, Frost Magic, Shadow Magic, Nazcan Line magic, Fleshsculpting, Mirror Magic, and Chaos Magic, are all just a few ideas.
• Replace the special ability table with the information in Nightbane Book 2: The Nightlands for their magical artifacts. I would say 1D4 of the "lesser" artifact powers could be appropriate.
• Double the number of super powers allowed, or use the table in the Imbued power category for how many super powers can be selected. These powers still cost P.P.E. and still have the visual effects as noted. Also, remove the restrictions on what powers cannot be selected.
• Allow the character to be a magic-user. Not a Mystic Study, but like a Mystic or Sorcerer as per the Nightbane setting. The Forsaken Mage or Half-Wizard from Palladium Fantasy could be options too, but would require more conversion.
• Allow multiple Magic Items, using the same guidelines as noted in the Super-Invention power category.

All good ideas. I was thinking about the "allow the character to be a magic-user" idea as well, but I was thinking of allowing the character to develop casting abilities over time. This seems in-line with many existing comic characters (especially many from the Golden Age).

That's how I made this N.P.C., who was inspired by a City of Heroes character I had (highlight the page to read the white-color "hidden" text): Arctic Hellfire. I figured a dual-element Warlock was a low-power enough option in a Super Hero game to add to a Magic Artifact Hero, whose artifact also had Elemental spells.

[Incriptus]

Quick Fix 1: Make an Enchanted Weapon Character, but instead of a magic sword have a magic ring. (Sure you lose the ability to hit people for damage, but you've got a smaller easier to conceal item)

Quick Fix 2: Make a Super Invention. Pretend it's powered by magic

[barna10]

Quick Fix 1: Make an Enchanted Weapon Character, but instead of a magic sword have a magic ring. (Sure you lose the ability to hit people for damage, but you've got a smaller easier to conceal item)

Quick Fix 2: Make a Super Invention. Pretend it's powered by magic

Both good options.

[Razorwing]

One idea I had was to have Enchanted Objects be a little more... progressive than Mystic Weapons or Mystically Bestowed characters. What I mean by this is that it take time for the character to unlock all the abilities of the object. You see this a lot in many anime where the hero receives an enchanted object and is told it holds great power... but they only seem to be able to use a small fraction of it until they gain more experience using it (the character, not the object).

I think this would help to overcome the major set back that the power level of the spells and powers of the object are set at a specific level. Unlike the powers granted by enchanted weapon (the actual super power or spells the wielder can use at any time) or those granted unto a mystically bestowed character, the powers of an Enchanted Object are frozen at a specific level regardless of the character's actual level. Now, if as the character levels up he learns to unlock new powers held within the object, it could help the player feel their character is progressing like other characters (who's powers improve with level). True, the new abilities would also be frozen at the same level of power, but it still feels like the character is making progress in using the object to its full potential.

I am thinking that at first level the character starts with a roll on the Magic Spell Super Abilities Table... and gets to roll on it again at level 4 and 11. At levels 2, 7 and 15, the character gets to roll on the Special Ability Table for additional abilities that can be used whenever the character wants (or is always active when the object is active in the case of bonuses).

This may also require these tables to be modified slightly to keep the over all level of power to something reasonable... like what follows:

Magic Spells or Super Abilities
01-16 Choice of 2 Minor Super Abilities
17-33 Choice of 1 Major Super Ability (excluding Immortality)
34-50 Choice of 1 Minor Super Ability and two spells from each of the Spell Levels 3, 4 and 5
51-67 Choice of 2 spells from each Spell Levels 1-4 and a total of 6 spells from Spell Levels 5-8
68-84 Choice of 3 spells from each Spell Levels 1-4 and a total of 4 spells from Spell Levels 5-8
85-00 Choice of 6 spells total from Spell Levels 1-6 and a total of 6 spells from Spell Levels 7-12

Yes, the power level of these is slightly less than standard, but since the character will be rolling on this 3 times as their mastery of the Object increases (their level goes up), they still get a significant boost to their power. As you can also see, I've removed the limit on Control Powers but retained the exclusion of Immortality... the ability to control things is just too common in objects in mythology and popular culture (the rings wielded by the Planeteers could each control an element... and the power to control plants, animals and insects is common to wands and such)... but the immortality power doesn't fit with a device that can be turned on and off (often it is seen as much as a curse as it is a blessing... which is greatly lessened if one can simply turn the power off... which defeats the point of being immortal).

In the end, the overall power of a character with full access to all that their object can provide is roughly equivalent to the power level of many other categories that can have all their powers at 1st level (or who progress in power at a faster rate). This also leads to some interesting role-playing situations as the character learns how to access more of the Object's abilities (or unlocks the spells or whatever that was preventing the full power of the object from being used).

[Incriptus]

Character’s Magic Background
01-15 None: The character had no background in mysticism before finding the Enchanted Object. As a matter of fact he may not have even believed magic was real. Has a +2 to all saving throws vs. Magic.
16-35 Academic: The character had an academic background in the occult before finding the object. This could either been anything from a hobby to a university degree depending on the characters education level. The character has access to the magical lore of a mystic study (see HU2 page 153).
36-55 Occult: The character comes from a family who have dabbled in the occult for generations. The character is sensitive to magic and the supernatural. Gains the abilities of Sense Enchantment, Sense Supernatural Evil, Sense Magic. While not a magician himself the character has 1D4x10 +10 P.P.E which can be used to supplement the abilities of the Enchanted Object. Add Lore Magic (+15%) to his list of skills. Learns spells as a Mystic Study for each level after first.
56-75 Mystic: The character is a minor magician in his own right. His powers however do not come from study and are rather intuitive. At first level knows 6 spells from spell level 1-2. Gains 1 additional spell of a spell level of his level or lower each additional level of experience. Also has access to the psionic abilities of Clairvoyance, exorcism, Sense Evil and Sixth Sense. In addition choose 3 additional abilities from the psychic sensitive and 2 from healer categories. Has 1D4X10 + ME ISP and 1D4x10 + PE PPE. At third level the Mystic gains a familiar as per the Mystic Study.
76-95 Dependent Magician: The character has all the abilities of a Mystic Study character in addition to the enchanted object; however the character is now dependent on the object to do magic. Any spell not cast via the Object costs double the usual PPE.
96-00 Full Magician: The character has all the abilities of a Mystic Study character in addition to the enchanted object. Note: This option for NPC's or games including Mega-Heroes


Object's Appearance
01-10 Belt
11-20 Boots
21-30 Cape/Cloak
31-40 Bracers
41-50 Gloves/Gauntlets
51-60 Glasses/Goggles
61-70 Helmet/Hat
71-80 Ring
81-90 Necklace/Amulet/Pendant
91-00 Mask


Object's Origin
01-20 Divine: The object has a divine relic with a ties to a god (See Pantheons of the Megaverse for Inspiration)
21-40 Extra dimensional: The object is native to another dimension where magic is more common (Palladium Fantasy, Rifts, Nightbane, etc.)
41-60 Ancient: The object was empowered by ancient magicians (Atlantis, Camelot, etc.)
61-80 Demonic: The object was initially created in one of the nether realms. Despite its insidious origins the item is not inherently evil
81-00 Man Made: Somehow the character is responsible for the creation of the object, even if they're not aware how


Object's Intelligence
01-35 None: The object has no intelligence and can be used freely by anyone
35-55 Emotional: The object reacts to emotions despite not having a sentience. The object can sense the emotions of the owner and those around it (within 20 feet). When it sense hostility it trembles granting the owner +2 to initiative checks. In addition the object has a preferred emotional state where its abilities act as if they were one level greater than usual.
01-20 Anger
21-40 Joy
41-60 Danger
61-80 Fear
81-00 Protectiveness
56-75 Knowledge: The object is a repository for knowledge as well as magic powers. Choose 1d4 + 1 skills at +20% (GM's discretion on which skills are appropriate) which the Object can communicate raw information telepathically with the character
76-90 Rational: The object can communicate telepathically with the owner. While still not sentient the can apply logical analysis of ideas acts like an advanced computer. +5% to logic based skills
91-00 Sentient: The object if fully sentient and can communicate with the owner telepathically. While in possession of the owner it senses everything he does. Has an IQ of 2D6+6, ME 2D6, MA 2D6
01-20 Helpful: The item is genuinely helpful regardless of the user’s alignment. May use its powers to aid the character if he is unable to control is actions. 1 attack per melee round
21-90 Observant: The item only interacts with the character when requested, however it is always observing and can give advice when needed. Will not take action on its own
91-00 Antagonistic: The item dislikes being used. While it cannot prevent the user from accessing its powers it will not offer help/advice unless there is something in it for the object. May betray its owner if it falls into an enemy’s hands!


Object's Magic Abilities
01-20 Raw P.P.E.: The Enchanted Object is a raw P.P.E. Battery. While it does not grant any abilities the Object has 3D6 *10 + 90 P.P.E.
21-60 Spell Casting Ability: The Enchanted Object is capable of casting spells. P.P.E. Available is 2D6*10 + 90
01-20 3 spells from each of the spell levels 1-4 and a total of 8 spells from spell levels 5-8
21-70 4 spells from each of the spell levels 1-4 and a total of 6 spells from spell levels 5-8
71-00 8 spells from spell levels 1-6 and a total of 8 spells from spell levels 7-12
61-00 Super Abilities: The Enchanted Object grants super abilities
01-20 3 Minor Super Abilities
21-40 1 Major Super Ability
41-80 1 Major Super Ability 2 Minor Abilities
81-00 2 Major Super Abilities

[Razorwing]

@Incriptus

First... amazing job with the new tables. Well Done.

I only have two small criticisms. First, I think the first table should be dropped... the focus of the character should be entirely on the Object that they possess... all of their special abilities should come from it (it is the Enchanted Object Category after all). The potential for abuse by granting them even limited abilities from the Mystic Study Category is rather high... and takes away from what the Object gives them (even if unintentional).

The other criticism is allowing the object to be just a PPE battery. This makes it possible to have an Object that is more or less useless for a character. Just having a large amount of PPE means little without spells or powers to use that energy with. Perhaps replacing that option with a combination of Super Abilities and spells would be better... and save the Increased PPE for an object's Special Abilities (granting more PPE than is usual for an Object).

Any knowledge of magic (other than actual spell casting) should be part of the character's skill selection... not in addition to it... and while not all Objects will make their owners into Heroes (or Villains), those who choose to be such should have an Object that provides abilities that lets them do so (even if they aren't good at it).

[barna10]

Spoiler:

Character’s Magic Background
01-15 None: The character had no background in mysticism before finding the Enchanted Object. As a matter of fact he may not have even believed magic was real. Has a +2 to all saving throws vs. Magic.
16-35 Academic: The character had an academic background in the occult before finding the object. This could either been anything from a hobby to a university degree depending on the characters education level. The character has access to the magical lore of a mystic study (see HU2 page 153).
36-55 Occult: The character comes from a family who have dabbled in the occult for generations. The character is sensitive to magic and the supernatural. Gains the abilities of Sense Enchantment, Sense Supernatural Evil, Sense Magic. While not a magician himself the character has 1D4x10 +10 P.P.E which can be used to supplement the abilities of the Enchanted Object. Add Lore Magic (+15%) to his list of skills. Learns spells as a Mystic Study for each level after first.
56-75 Mystic: The character is a minor magician in his own right. His powers however do not come from study and are rather intuitive. At first level knows 6 spells from spell level 1-2. Gains 1 additional spell of a spell level of his level or lower each additional level of experience. Also has access to the psionic abilities of Clairvoyance, exorcism, Sense Evil and Sixth Sense. In addition choose 3 additional abilities from the psychic sensitive and 2 from healer categories. Has 1D4X10 + ME ISP and 1D4x10 + PE PPE. At third level the Mystic gains a familiar as per the Mystic Study.
76-95 Dependent Magician: The character has all the abilities of a Mystic Study character in addition to the enchanted object; however the character is now dependent on the object to do magic. Any spell not cast via the Object costs double the usual PPE.
96-00 Full Magician: The character has all the abilities of a Mystic Study character in addition to the enchanted object. Note: This option for NPC's or games including Mega-Heroes


Object's Appearance
01-10 Belt
11-20 Boots
21-30 Cape/Cloak
31-40 Bracers
41-50 Gloves/Gauntlets
51-60 Glasses/Goggles
61-70 Helmet/Hat
71-80 Ring
81-90 Necklace/Amulet/Pendant
91-00 Mask


Object's Origin
01-20 Divine: The object has a divine relic with a ties to a god (See Pantheons of the Megaverse for Inspiration)
21-40 Extra dimensional: The object is native to another dimension where magic is more common (Palladium Fantasy, Rifts, Nightbane, etc.)
41-60 Ancient: The object was empowered by ancient magicians (Atlantis, Camelot, etc.)
61-80 Demonic: The object was initially created in one of the nether realms. Despite its insidious origins the item is not inherently evil
81-00 Man Made: Somehow the character is responsible for the creation of the object, even if they're not aware how


Object's Intelligence
01-35 None: The object has no intelligence and can be used freely by anyone
35-55 Emotional: The object reacts to emotions despite not having a sentience. The object can sense the emotions of the owner and those around it (within 20 feet). When it sense hostility it trembles granting the owner +2 to initiative checks. In addition the object has a preferred emotional state where its abilities act as if they were one level greater than usual.
01-20 Anger
21-40 Joy
41-60 Danger
61-80 Fear
81-00 Protectiveness
56-75 Knowledge: The object is a repository for knowledge as well as magic powers. Choose 1d4 + 1 skills at +20% (GM's discretion on which skills are appropriate) which the Object can communicate raw information telepathically with the character
76-90 Rational: The object can communicate telepathically with the owner. While still not sentient the can apply logical analysis of ideas acts like an advanced computer. +5% to logic based skills
91-00 Sentient: The object if fully sentient and can communicate with the owner telepathically. While in possession of the owner it senses everything he does. Has an IQ of 2D6+6, ME 2D6, MA 2D6
01-20 Helpful: The item is genuinely helpful regardless of the user’s alignment. May use its powers to aid the character if he is unable to control is actions. 1 attack per melee round
21-90 Observant: The item only interacts with the character when requested, however it is always observing and can give advice when needed. Will not take action on its own
91-00 Antagonistic: The item dislikes being used. While it cannot prevent the user from accessing its powers it will not offer help/advice unless there is something in it for the object. May betray its owner if it falls into an enemy’s hands!


Object's Magic Abilities
01-20 Raw P.P.E.: The Enchanted Object is a raw P.P.E. Battery. While it does not grant any abilities the Object has 3D6 *10 + 90 P.P.E.
21-60 Spell Casting Ability: The Enchanted Object is capable of casting spells. P.P.E. Available is 2D6*10 + 90
01-20 3 spells from each of the spell levels 1-4 and a total of 8 spells from spell levels 5-8
21-70 4 spells from each of the spell levels 1-4 and a total of 6 spells from spell levels 5-8
71-00 8 spells from spell levels 1-6 and a total of 8 spells from spell levels 7-12
61-00 Super Abilities: The Enchanted Object grants super abilities
01-20 3 Minor Super Abilities
21-40 1 Major Super Ability
41-80 1 Major Super Ability 2 Minor Abilities
81-00 2 Major Super Abilities

Love it!

[Incriptus]

@Incriptus

First... amazing job with the new tables. Well Done.

Thanks, just threw them together while avoiding work

I only have two small criticisms. First, I think the first table should be dropped... the focus of the character should be entirely on the Object that they possess... all of their special abilities should come from it (it is the Enchanted Object Category after all). The potential for abuse by granting them even limited abilities from the Mystic Study Category is rather high... and takes away from what the Object gives them (even if unintentional).

One of the previous suggestions in this thread was to give them some powers of their own. However I didn't care for that option myself (thats why only 1/2 of them get magic). It does come with some advantages but (with the exception of the last option) does not over power the mystic study. However it was just to broaden the field. Honestly the handful of extra skills from Academic or Occult are there because "lore magic" doesn't exist as a normal skill in HU. It also seems that plenty of magic items are found by people with some back ground in the arcane.

The other criticism is allowing the object to be just a PPE battery. This makes it possible to have an Object that is more or less useless for a character. Just having a large amount of PPE means little without spells or powers to use that energy with. Perhaps replacing that option with a combination of Super Abilities and spells would be better... and save the Increased PPE for an object's Special Abilities (granting more PPE than is usual for an Object).

I thought about the possibility of a useless object. On the other hand I thought it was a cool option for the dependent magician or the mystic ... perhaps a note to reroll if the player doesn't have a mystic background.

Any knowledge of magic (other than actual spell casting) should be part of the character's skill selection... not in addition to it... and while not all Objects will make their owners into Heroes (or Villains), those who choose to be such should have an Object that provides abilities that lets them do so (even if they aren't good at it).

Unfortunately most of those skills don't exist as standard skills (in HU2) I didn't feel that every enchanted item person had to be ignorant of mysticism (although it's still an option) ... and I didn't feel that penalizing them with losing a skill program was worth while.


Thanks for the feedback !

[barna10]

Like I said previously, there are many examples of Enchanted Object type characters that started with an object and no powers and then developed into full-fledged magicians. Also, I think the object imparting knowledge makes sense.

[Razorwing]

Each Power Category has a specific focus on where those abilities comes from. For the Enchanted Object... the focus must be on the Object itself... not on any mysticism the character may have had previous to owning it. This isn't boosting the power of the Enchanted Object to the level of other Power Categories... it is boosting the character by giving them additional abilities independent of the Object they possess. In other words, they no longer require the Enchanted Object to be a Hero because they have abilities that don't rely on it.

The point of this thread is to bring the level of power of the Enchanted Objects themselves to be on par with Mystic Weapons or Mystically Bestowed characters. You don't see either of those Power Categories having abilities that aren't derived from their source of power (the weapon or the powers they were granted). In fact, each Power Category has a specific focus on where their powers come from... even the Alien Category which seems to include the potential for many sources of power (but in this case, it is the Alien culture which provides the specific focus). By giving the wielder of an Enchanted Object even limited Mystic Study training, you aren't bringing the power of the Object up... you are increasing the power of the character itself in a way that makes them less reliant on the Object that is supposed to be the focus of their power.

This sort of Power Category combining should be limited to the Optional Mega Hero option... not an inherent part of the Enchanted Object Category. The Object should be the source of any powers or abilities they have. As for any mystic oriented skills... the beauty of Palladium's system is that you can bring such skills over from other systems. Lore: Magic and such are easily adapted to the HU skills.

[barna10]

Each Power Category has a specific focus on where those abilities comes from. For the Enchanted Object... the focus must be on the Object itself... not on any mysticism the character may have had previous to owning it. This isn't boosting the power of the Enchanted Object to the level of other Power Categories... it is boosting the character by giving them additional abilities independent of the Object they possess. In other words, they no longer require the Enchanted Object to be a Hero because they have abilities that don't rely on it.

The point of this thread is to bring the level of power of the Enchanted Objects themselves to be on par with Mystic Weapons or Mystically Bestowed characters. You don't see either of those Power Categories having abilities that aren't derived from their source of power (the weapon or the powers they were granted). In fact, each Power Category has a specific focus on where their powers come from... even the Alien Category which seems to include the potential for many sources of power (but in this case, it is the Alien culture which provides the specific focus). By giving the wielder of an Enchanted Object even limited Mystic Study training, you aren't bringing the power of the Object up... you are increasing the power of the character itself in a way that makes them less reliant on the Object that is supposed to be the focus of their power.

This sort of Power Category combining should be limited to the Optional Mega Hero option... not an inherent part of the Enchanted Object Category. The Object should be the source of any powers or abilities they have. As for any mystic oriented skills... the beauty of Palladium's system is that you can bring such skills over from other systems. Lore: Magic and such are easily adapted to the HU skills.

I appreciate your stand, but I don't see a problem with adding some casting. Dr. Occult, Dr. fate, and others are examples of Enchanted Object that later developed independent casting abilities.

[Nightmask]

Each Power Category has a specific focus on where those abilities comes from. For the Enchanted Object... the focus must be on the Object itself... not on any mysticism the character may have had previous to owning it. This isn't boosting the power of the Enchanted Object to the level of other Power Categories... it is boosting the character by giving them additional abilities independent of the Object they possess. In other words, they no longer require the Enchanted Object to be a Hero because they have abilities that don't rely on it.

The point of this thread is to bring the level of power of the Enchanted Objects themselves to be on par with Mystic Weapons or Mystically Bestowed characters. You don't see either of those Power Categories having abilities that aren't derived from their source of power (the weapon or the powers they were granted). In fact, each Power Category has a specific focus on where their powers come from... even the Alien Category which seems to include the potential for many sources of power (but in this case, it is the Alien culture which provides the specific focus). By giving the wielder of an Enchanted Object even limited Mystic Study training, you aren't bringing the power of the Object up... you are increasing the power of the character itself in a way that makes them less reliant on the Object that is supposed to be the focus of their power.

This sort of Power Category combining should be limited to the Optional Mega Hero option... not an inherent part of the Enchanted Object Category. The Object should be the source of any powers or abilities they have. As for any mystic oriented skills... the beauty of Palladium's system is that you can bring such skills over from other systems. Lore: Magic and such are easily adapted to the HU skills.

I appreciate your stand, but I don't see a problem with adding some casting. Dr. Occult, Dr. fate, and others are examples of Enchanted Object that later developed independent casting abilities.

Well to be fair Dr. Fate did have magical training before the addition of the helmet, and it's not quite a proper fit for an example anyway since you really had a case of someone being possessed by the spirit in the helmet with the spirit using them to work magic the wearer didn't just put it on and gain magical abilities from the object they were just a possessed vessel.

[Incriptus]

Each Power Category has a specific focus on where those abilities comes from. For the Enchanted Object... the focus must be on the Object itself... not on any mysticism the character may have had previous to owning it.

Enchanted Objects superior cousin, the super invention, has the option of having the skill set of the Hardware class.


I guess part of my imagination worked the same way. There are plenty of stories of magicians placing the bulk of their power in objects. Then there are archaeologists who found their object, and there are occultists who inherited their object, then there are just random dues who got it by dumb luck.

[barna10]

Well to be fair Dr. Fate did have magical training before the addition of the helmet, and it's not quite a proper fit for an example anyway since you really had a case of someone being possessed by the spirit in the helmet with the spirit using them to work magic the wearer didn't just put it on and gain magical abilities from the object they were just a possessed vessel.

This is true of newer versions, but not Kent Nelson, the Golden Age Dr. Fate, at least not in the beginning. It wasn't till decades into his story that Nabu began to posses him.

We could also look at the Green Lantern. He went from being an Enchanted Object category to a creature of magic.

[The Artist Formerly]

Anyone ever work up someway to make this class more balanced? Useful? Interesting?

It hardly seems to compare to the other Mystical categories yet it requires the same amount of XP to advance....

Use any other class. The only difference between most of the power cats is the "side effect" table and the flavor text.

Observe the three steps.
Step 1) You have an external power source.
Step 2) Character internalizes that power source.
Step 3) Profit.

Consider a mystic artifact that only works with a select blood line. Fairly standard comic trope, no? Basically it's mutant abilities. Sometimes the magic channels it's effect into the chosen one, changing their bodies, enhancing (generally the good guys) or deforming (generally the bad guys) them. Letting their outer appearance match their inner one. Only those of the given blood line may use it's power.

Or you might have a mystic being grant unto a mortal the power to carry forth their great totem. So long as they hold the amulet of Carthitum, or the crown of dying light, or perhaps even the one true shoe of Brian, they have the abilities of the greatest warrior of the race of the mystic being. Basically an experiment or perhaps a super soldier.

And one can do this over and over again. Consider your framing device and the trajectory of the character you intend to build, then select the power table that most fits. Twist the back ground and power cat roles to fit the character's back story. In terms of game mechanics, doesn't matter one wit if you shoot plasma because of magic or super science, it matters that you shoot plasma. How you spin that you shoot plasma is role play, and that has very little to do with power cats.

[Razorwing]

Increasing the power level of Enchanted Objects should actually increase the power level of the Objects, not the one using them. Giving the character abilities that aren't derived from the Object means that the object more or less becomes an after thought... rather than the focus of the character.

Heroes Unlimited is not like other Palladium Games where one can start in one profession and then move to another one. One's Power Category is more or less the focus of the character. When the Enchanted Weapon category was given its power boost... it was by giving the weapons extra power. The Mystic Study's strength comes from the fact that they continue to study magic, gaining new spells and more mystic energy to cast those spells. The Bestowed characters get their power granted to them (and their power level increase saw those granted powers increased). Yet, you seem to think that a good way to boost the power of an Enchanted Object is not to increase the power of the Object itself, but rather to increase the abilities of the one using it... giving them abilities that can make the Object redundant.

Villain: "Behold Power Ring! I have taken the mystic ring that gave you all you powers! Tremble as I now turn that power against you!"
Power Ring: "You know what... keep the ring... I don't need it since I can actually cast spells better without it. Besides... it's power really wasn't all that impressive to begin with."
Villain: *confused* "But it is the source of your power!"
Power Ring: "No, not really... all it did was let me fly and gave me a few spells which I have learned to cast without it... and to better effect actually. Seriously... it's become rather useless to me. I'm okay without it. Keep it, it's yours now."

[Regularguy]

Or you might have a mystic being grant unto a mortal the power to carry forth their great totem. So long as they hold the amulet of Carthitum, or the crown of dying light, or perhaps even the one true shoe of Brian, they have the abilities of the greatest warrior of the race of the mystic being. Basically an experiment or perhaps a super soldier.

Heh. As it happens, I suggested that one in a previous thread figuring Mystic Bestowed could stand in for Enchanted Object -- because, hey, you have multiple Major Powers or whatever, and no glowing eyes, and all the rest, as long as you stay in your patron's good graces, right?

Well, okay; let's say your magical benefactor's big concern is how you treat his holy relic: bam; done; so long as you act as if you were an Enchanted Object hero, you get the Mystic Bestowed package deal.

[Glistam]

Increasing the power level of Enchanted Objects should actually increase the power level of the Objects, not the one using them. Giving the character abilities that aren't derived from the Object means that the object more or less becomes an after thought... rather than the focus of the character.

Heroes Unlimited is not like other Palladium Games where one can start in one profession and then move to another one. One's Power Category is more or less the focus of the character. When the Enchanted Weapon category was given its power boost... it was by giving the weapons extra power. The Mystic Study's strength comes from the fact that they continue to study magic, gaining new spells and more mystic energy to cast those spells. The Bestowed characters get their power granted to them (and their power level increase saw those granted powers increased). Yet, you seem to think that a good way to boost the power of an Enchanted Object is not to increase the power of the Object itself, but rather to increase the abilities of the one using it... giving them abilities that can make the Object redundant.

Villain: "Behold Power Ring! I have taken the mystic ring that gave you all you powers! Tremble as I now turn that power against you!"
Power Ring: "You know what... keep the ring... I don't need it since I can actually cast spells better without it. Besides... it's power really wasn't all that impressive to begin with."
Villain: *confused* "But it is the source of your power!"
Power Ring: "No, not really... all it did was let me fly and gave me a few spells which I have learned to cast without it... and to better effect actually. Seriously... it's become rather useless to me. I'm okay without it. Keep it, it's yours now."

The upgrades I was talking about earlier would not have made the item irrelevant. I don't agree with the story example. It's very aggravating to talk about a power category without being able to discuss heroes or villains from comics or media who could be examples of that category in order to help explain.

Here's a short, assembled version of the story I wrote for one of my player's during an e-mail side-session:

Spoiler:

Two figures fought in the sky above the buildings engulfed by the weirdly cold, blue flame. One broke off and dove towards the buildings; the other followed. As they swooped close the lead girl can be identified as the hero Arctic Hellfire. The one chasing her is a girl dressed similarly, but in opposing colors. She can be identified as the villain Antipode. The eyes of both hero and villain were glowing and each of them had something glowing on their chests - an amulet, perhaps? Once Arctic Hellfire came within a couple hundred feet of the fire she stopped and cast a spell. After it went off a 150 foot diameter area of the "frost-fire" suddenly extinguished. Antipode screamed in anger when she saw this. "NOO! Stop! Ignoring! ME!" With a quick spell of her own she created a 20+ foot long line of fire and started hitting Arctic Hellfire with it.

Those down on the ground shouted up to Arctic Hellfire, asking what they could do to put out this freezing inferno. Water had been tried initially, but it only made the magically cold flame spread faster and increase in intensity. While dodging the blows from Antipode she shouted back down, "Magic! Um... not water! Sand! You can smother it!" Antipode took that moment to cast another spell at her opponent but nothing happened when she finished. She looked surprised. Arctic Hellfire turned to her and asked, "Running low?" Emboldened by this seeming turn of the tide she cast a spell which caused the upper body of Antipode to become encased in ice. Struggling against the encasement, Antipode started to fall into the ice cold flames. Arctic Hellfire dove to try and catch her.

She grabbed Antipode and pulled her close, but the ice encasement quickly melted due to the invisible flaming aura Arctic Hellfire forgot she had around her. Antipode broke free and started laughing wildly as she grappled with Arctic Hellfire. Arctic Hellfire tried to disentangle herself from Antipode but before she could, Antipode grabbed the glowing amulet that she was wearing and pulled it free. The glow receeded from both the amulet and Arctic Hellfire's eyes. Antipode said, "Looks like I'm not running low anymore!" She then let go of Arctic Hellfire and laughed as the two of them fell together. They crashed through the structurally weakened roof of one of the buildings and landed in a room. Both girls were stunned by the impact but recovered at nearly the same time.

Antipode was in much better shape than Arctic Hellfire. She stood up confidently with the other girl's amulet in her hand while across the room they landed in, Arctic Hellfire remained slumped against the wall. Antipode began gloating. "Admit it - I've won! You're powerless. You're beaten. This whole block, including your home, is going to go up in frozen flames and there's nothing you can do about it!" She gestured with the amulet and a blast a blue energy flew from her hand to strike the wall next to Arctic Hellfire. Her head had been down but she looked up now at Antipode, smirking. Shakily she stood up and faced her opponent. "What's so funny?" Antipode demanded while gesturing with the amulet again - threatening but not doing anything. "I've won. You can't... you won't ignore me any more."

Arctic Hellfire coughed and in a raspy voice began, "Do you..." She coughed again, this time she brought up blood. "Do you know where we are? This whole place... this whole area..." She paused a moment. "It's full of magical power. Seeped in it." She mentally pulled some more energy from the Ley Line they stood within as she said that. She hadn't been dazed or stunned as badly as she seemed - she had been drawing in energy that whole time.

Antipode just looked at her, puzzled. She didn't know much about magic or what was being talked about. The only thing she knew that was around them was the Frost Fire she had created, which as far as she knew was still raging out of control as she intended. "So what?" She barked at Arctic Hellfire. "It's not like that matters. I've got the source of your power right here." She wiggled the amulet in her hand again to illustrate her point. "You're nothing without it! Nothing!"

Reaching out to a nearby table to steady herself, Arctic Hellfire quietly began to speak. "Tamara..." she started. Then she glared at Antipode/Tamara as she finished her statement. "You couldn't be more wrong." She kept staring at her as she began chanting the words for a spell. Suddenly orange flames appeared in her hands and she tossed them defiantly at Tamara.

Stunned, the fire hit Tamara squarely and directly, causing a small fiery explosion which obscured her from sight. When the blaze cleared she continued to stand there, seemingly unhurt. "So you have a few tricks left, Michelle." She confidently said. "But you forget that I still have the source of all your powers." She shook the amulet again as a reminder. "And with it I have all those powers as well!" She began casting another spell, while Arctic Hellfire/Michelle flipped the table she was leaning against on its side and dove behind it for cover.

At this point perhaps you've seen and heard enough? Or do you keep watching and listening for more?

[barna10]

Increasing the power level of Enchanted Objects should actually increase the power level of the Objects, not the one using them. Giving the character abilities that aren't derived from the Object means that the object more or less becomes an after thought... rather than the focus of the character.

Heroes Unlimited is not like other Palladium Games where one can start in one profession and then move to another one. One's Power Category is more or less the focus of the character. When the Enchanted Weapon category was given its power boost... it was by giving the weapons extra power. The Mystic Study's strength comes from the fact that they continue to study magic, gaining new spells and more mystic energy to cast those spells. The Bestowed characters get their power granted to them (and their power level increase saw those granted powers increased). Yet, you seem to think that a good way to boost the power of an Enchanted Object is not to increase the power of the Object itself, but rather to increase the abilities of the one using it... giving them abilities that can make the Object redundant.

You make some true statements, but I think you may be missing somethings.

First, just increasing the power of the object doesn't fix one of the fundamental flaws of the category: anyone can use the item and the character is always one thief away from being powerless. Enchanted Objects aren't available at the Family Dollar. This means the character can be rendered all but unplayable in a single action. Upping the power doesn't fix this.

Also, characters should not be static. you should ALWAYS have options to increase in power and/or versatility as you advance in level. That's just good game design. This category just doesn't. Besides the addition of a few secondary skills that all characters get, this character is the same at 1st level as he is at 15th. Heck, all this screams that the Enchanted Object character should pick up an O.C.C....not even a dual class option, just stop being an Enchanted Weapon character and pick up something else. There's nothing saying he'd have to give up the object, anyone can use it, remember?

Lastly, I just reread Enchanted Weapon. It actually imparts powers upon the bearer that aren't a part of the weapon itself. The magic/super abilities become a part of the character, with no chance of losing them. How is an Enchanted Object possessor also having spell casting abilities any different?

[Razorwing]

With the Enchanted Weapon... the power they get is theirs for as long as they are bonded to the weapon. If that bond is ever severed, the power is gone. They don't have to hold the weapon to use it, but the weapon is still the source of the power.

And yes, I do agree that Enchanted Objects do come with a serious drawback... that those who use them can be rendered powerless if they are taken, but most of these objects will be very difficult to take from a hero actually using them... most will tend to be something the user wears... or holds in his hand, and will likely be rather small. Disarming them will likely be very difficult... and stealing the item from a character when it isn't being used (the wand from a backpack or such) would require knowing where it is at that time... and who actually has it (hence the reason many heroes keep their identities... well... secret). This really is no different than other ways to depower a hero (and is a common way for Heroes to depower villains who use such objects).

The point is that increasing the power level of Echanted Objects should actually involve increasing the power of the Object... not the power of the one who uses it who (more often than not) IS powerless without the object. Yes there are a few Heroes in comics that have abilities beyond what an Object grants them, but they tend to be the exception rather than the rule.

I already proposed a possible means to increase the power of Objects using the fact that many Heroes and Villains in comics who have such items often are using a fraction of such an Object's power. As they gain experience, they unlock more of the Objects powers. While this means that an Object user may start of weaker than the current version (weak being a relative term), as the character grows in experience, they get to use more of the Object's powers, earning more power that at higher levels makes them equal to most other characters (and more powerful than the current version of Enchanted Objects). Yes, the character is still dependent on the object for their powers, but it also means that a new owner of the object may not know all that the object can do (creating the potential for a very interesting scene where a previous owner who knows more of the object's secrets showing up to take back the object... forcing the player to be creative in keeping it/retrieving it from someone with more experience using it/knowing more of its secrets).

Villainous Previous Owner: Return to me the Ring of Sereteph youngling... I alone can wield it's full power!
Current Owner: I think I am doing just fine... besides I found it!
Villainous Previous Owner: Bah! You are but a child playing with the smallest fraction of it's power... you can only fly and create force fields... it can do so much more in the hands of one who knows its secrets!
Current Owner: Such as?
Villainous Previous Owner: Hand it over and I shall show you exactly just how little you know of the item you wield!

Current Owner: How did you do that?
Heroic Previous Owner: I told you, you were only using a small fraction of the Ring's true potential.
Current Owner: I never suspected that I could create constructs out of the Ring's force fields... can you show me how to do that?
Heroic Previous Owner: It will take time and practice to unlock all of the rings power, but you are well on your way to doing so. The Ring of Sereteph is in good hands with you, young one.

[barna10]

With the Enchanted Weapon... the power they get is theirs for as long as they are bonded to the weapon. If that bond is ever severed, the power is gone. They don't have to hold the weapon to use it, but the weapon is still the source of the power.

And yes, I do agree that Enchanted Objects do come with a serious drawback... that those who use them can be rendered powerless if they are taken, but most of these objects will be very difficult to take from a hero actually using them... most will tend to be something the user wears... or holds in his hand, and will likely be rather small. Disarming them will likely be very difficult... and stealing the item from a character when it isn't being used (the wand from a backpack or such) would require knowing where it is at that time... and who actually has it (hence the reason many heroes keep their identities... well... secret). This really is no different than other ways to depower a hero (and is a common way for Heroes to depower villains who use such objects).

The point is that increasing the power level of Echanted Objects should actually involve increasing the power of the Object... not the power of the one who uses it who (more often than not) IS powerless without the object. Yes there are a few Heroes in comics that have abilities beyond what an Object grants them, but they tend to be the exception rather than the rule.

I already proposed a possible means to increase the power of Objects using the fact that many Heroes and Villains in comics who have such items often are using a fraction of such an Object's power. As they gain experience, they unlock more of the Objects powers. While this means that an Object user may start of weaker than the current version (weak being a relative term), as the character grows in experience, they get to use more of the Object's powers, earning more power that at higher levels makes them equal to most other characters (and more powerful than the current version of Enchanted Objects). Yes, the character is still dependent on the object for their powers, but it also means that a new owner of the object may not know all that the object can do (creating the potential for a very interesting scene where a previous owner who knows more of the object's secrets showing up to take back the object... forcing the player to be creative in keeping it/retrieving it from someone with more experience using it/knowing more of its secrets).

I think there's room for both (especially since there are examples from the comics). Why not have options for the object to increase in power and/or for prolonged possession/exposure to also change the hero? I think there's room enough for both scenarios.

[barna10]

Curious, some of you mentioned using the Hardware category instead. How exactly? Not to familiar with the Hardware types...

[The Artist Formerly]

Or you might have a mystic being grant unto a mortal the power to carry forth their great totem. So long as they hold the amulet of Carthitum, or the crown of dying light, or perhaps even the one true shoe of Brian, they have the abilities of the greatest warrior of the race of the mystic being. Basically an experiment or perhaps a super soldier.

Heh. As it happens, I suggested that one in a previous thread figuring Mystic Bestowed could stand in for Enchanted Object -- because, hey, you have multiple Major Powers or whatever, and no glowing eyes, and all the rest, as long as you stay in your patron's good graces, right?

Well, okay; let's say your magical benefactor's big concern is how you treat his holy relic: bam; done; so long as you act as if you were an Enchanted Object hero, you get the Mystic Bestowed package deal.

We used to use Mystic Bestowed as the template for pretty much everything that wasn't specifically detailed elsewhere. Did aliens tinker with your DNA? Did you find a super suit from aliens greatest american hero style? Power bands? Symbiote goo like you're David Hayter? All of these and more, Mystically bestowed and some reflavoring.

[Shadowknight]

My take is allow the character to be a Magic User give him +2 to Spell Strength, but allow the 7 magical abilities of the Mystic Studies to grow over time, he would receive 1 every lvl and give the character 2 or 3 minor powers. I plan on creating a Nigh God Thread hopefully around May 2016 which is based on my take on the Mega Hero which is too cookie cutter, and to be honest under-powered for my taste in there I'll go into greater detail on this class & how to make it stand out.

[barna10]

My take is allow the character to be a Magic User give him +2 to Spell Strength, but allow the 7 magical abilities of the Mystic Studies to grow over time, he would receive 1 every lvl and give the character 2 or 3 minor powers. I plan on creating a Nigh God Thread hopefully around May 2016 which is based on my take on the Mega Hero which is too cookie cutter, and to be honest under-powered for my taste in there I'll go into greater detail on this class & how to make it stand out.

I look forward to it. Please PM when you start that!

[barna10]

Character’s Magic Background
01-15 None: The character had no background in mysticism before finding the Enchanted Object. As a matter of fact he may not have even believed magic was real. Has a +2 to all saving throws vs. Magic.
16-35 Academic: The character had an academic background in the occult before finding the object. This could either been anything from a hobby to a university degree depending on the characters education level. The character has access to the magical lore of a mystic study (see HU2 page 153).
36-55 Occult: The character comes from a family who have dabbled in the occult for generations. The character is sensitive to magic and the supernatural. Gains the abilities of Sense Enchantment, Sense Supernatural Evil, Sense Magic. While not a magician himself the character has 1D4x10 +10 P.P.E which can be used to supplement the abilities of the Enchanted Object. Add Lore Magic (+15%) to his list of skills. Learns spells as a Mystic Study for each level after first.
56-75 Mystic: The character is a minor magician in his own right. His powers however do not come from study and are rather intuitive. At first level knows 6 spells from spell level 1-2. Gains 1 additional spell of a spell level of his level or lower each additional level of experience. Also has access to the psionic abilities of Clairvoyance, exorcism, Sense Evil and Sixth Sense. In addition choose 3 additional abilities from the psychic sensitive and 2 from healer categories. Has 1D4X10 + ME ISP and 1D4x10 + PE PPE. At third level the Mystic gains a familiar as per the Mystic Study.
76-95 Dependent Magician: The character has all the abilities of a Mystic Study character in addition to the enchanted object; however the character is now dependent on the object to do magic. Any spell not cast via the Object costs double the usual PPE.
96-00 Full Magician: The character has all the abilities of a Mystic Study character in addition to the enchanted object. Note: This option for NPC's or games including Mega-Heroes


Object's Appearance
01-10 Belt
11-20 Boots
21-30 Cape/Cloak
31-40 Bracers
41-50 Gloves/Gauntlets
51-60 Glasses/Goggles
61-70 Helmet/Hat
71-80 Ring
81-90 Necklace/Amulet/Pendant
91-00 Mask


Object's Origin
01-20 Divine: The object has a divine relic with a ties to a god (See Pantheons of the Megaverse for Inspiration)
21-40 Extra dimensional: The object is native to another dimension where magic is more common (Palladium Fantasy, Rifts, Nightbane, etc.)
41-60 Ancient: The object was empowered by ancient magicians (Atlantis, Camelot, etc.)
61-80 Demonic: The object was initially created in one of the nether realms. Despite its insidious origins the item is not inherently evil
81-00 Man Made: Somehow the character is responsible for the creation of the object, even if they're not aware how


Object's Intelligence
01-35 None: The object has no intelligence and can be used freely by anyone
35-55 Emotional: The object reacts to emotions despite not having a sentience. The object can sense the emotions of the owner and those around it (within 20 feet). When it sense hostility it trembles granting the owner +2 to initiative checks. In addition the object has a preferred emotional state where its abilities act as if they were one level greater than usual.
01-20 Anger
21-40 Joy
41-60 Danger
61-80 Fear
81-00 Protectiveness
56-75 Knowledge: The object is a repository for knowledge as well as magic powers. Choose 1d4 + 1 skills at +20% (GM's discretion on which skills are appropriate) which the Object can communicate raw information telepathically with the character
76-90 Rational: The object can communicate telepathically with the owner. While still not sentient the can apply logical analysis of ideas acts like an advanced computer. +5% to logic based skills
91-00 Sentient: The object if fully sentient and can communicate with the owner telepathically. While in possession of the owner it senses everything he does. Has an IQ of 2D6+6, ME 2D6, MA 2D6
01-20 Helpful: The item is genuinely helpful regardless of the user’s alignment. May use its powers to aid the character if he is unable to control is actions. 1 attack per melee round
21-90 Observant: The item only interacts with the character when requested, however it is always observing and can give advice when needed. Will not take action on its own
91-00 Antagonistic: The item dislikes being used. While it cannot prevent the user from accessing its powers it will not offer help/advice unless there is something in it for the object. May betray its owner if it falls into an enemy’s hands!


Object's Magic Abilities
01-20 Raw P.P.E.: The Enchanted Object is a raw P.P.E. Battery. While it does not grant any abilities the Object has 3D6 *10 + 90 P.P.E.
21-60 Spell Casting Ability: The Enchanted Object is capable of casting spells. P.P.E. Available is 2D6*10 + 90
01-20 3 spells from each of the spell levels 1-4 and a total of 8 spells from spell levels 5-8
21-70 4 spells from each of the spell levels 1-4 and a total of 6 spells from spell levels 5-8
71-00 8 spells from spell levels 1-6 and a total of 8 spells from spell levels 7-12
61-00 Super Abilities: The Enchanted Object grants super abilities
01-20 3 Minor Super Abilities
21-40 1 Major Super Ability
41-80 1 Major Super Ability 2 Minor Abilities
81-00 2 Major Super Abilities

I clipped this and added it on my forum. I still think this is the best update so far. Thanks again.

[RockJock]

I've done a few alternate versions that come close to this.

Sort of a Dr. Strange sort of character. Basically a Mystic Study with items of power. PPE battery talisman, a magic ring or three, magic cloak of armor and so on.

The next is Stage Magician with an inherited collection of PF style magic items/weapons/armor. Not exactly what you are talking about, but i think it is close enough to look at. Everything from Cherub's Rope to Gauntlets of Quick Hands to a Shadow Cloak fit with this.

I also think more of a dual class could work, with the object being gifted to someone who already championed the good fight.

[Regularguy]

I hadn't really thought about it before, but: the book already has full power-by-association rules for Magic Object Syndrome, right?

I mean, you can go whole hog with the kind of build they mention in the Mega-Hero section -- as the pitfall they were trying to avoid -- being invulnerable and super-strong and super-fast and having half-a-dozen other "super" tricks on tap; except you act like an Enchanted Object hero, as if you needed to rely on your ring or cloak or belt or whatever.

Mystic Bestowed with a major power and spellcasting? Fine. Mutant with two major powers? No problem. Experiment with three major powers? Why not? You just take any of those playable options, and build it around the "needs an item" theme, and that's a character who starts off great and gets better with experience!

So what should the answer be, if you want to play an Enchanted Object hero who selects powers as if he could pick them off another category's list? What could be more balanced than the choice that's, like, already right there? By definition, even?

[barna10]

I hadn't really thought about it before, but: the book already has full power-by-association rules for Magic Object Syndrome, right?

I mean, you can go whole hog with the kind of build they mention in the Mega-Hero section -- as the pitfall they were trying to avoid -- being invulnerable and super-strong and super-fast and having half-a-dozen other "super" tricks on tap; except you act like an Enchanted Object hero, as if you needed to rely on your ring or cloak or belt or whatever.

Mystic Bestowed with a major power and spellcasting? Fine. Mutant with two major powers? No problem. Experiment with three major powers? Why not? You just take any of those playable options, and build it around the "needs an item" theme, and that's a character who starts off great and gets better with experience!

So what should the answer be, if you want to play an Enchanted Object hero who selects powers as if he could pick them off another category's list? What could be more balanced than the choice that's, like, already right there? By definition, even?

Very good thoughts!