Negate Super Abilities/Powers

[Redoric]

im not too sure about the ability, but, if i am negating another persons abilities can i attack at the same time? also does it work on invulnerability?

[Tinker Dragoon]

if i am negating another persons abilities can i attack at the same time?

Yes, but you are limited to just two attacks per melee due to the intense focus required for negation.

it work on invulnerability?

Yes, assuming that the power of Invulnerability was not granted by magic or by alien physiology.

[say652]

Negate super powers.
Multiple selves.
Invulnerablility.

The ultimate super power badguy stopper.

[NMI]

Negate super powers.
Multiple selves.
Invulnerablility.

The ultimate super power badguy stopper.

Until he meets up against an Alien whose powers are natural to his race and cannot be negated or against someone whose powers are not affected by NSP.

[drewkitty ~..~]

im not too sure about the ability, but, if i am negating another persons abilities can i attack at the same time? also does it work on invulnerability?

However, N.S.A. does not work on the natural powers that an alien race may have.

[NMI]

it work on invulnerability?

Yes, assuming that the power of Invulnerability was not granted by magic or by alien physiology.

The alien "could" be a mutant of their race and have Invulnerability. The entire species would have to have the power naturally.

[Tinker Dragoon]

it work on invulnerability?

Yes, assuming that the power of Invulnerability was not granted by magic or by alien physiology.

The alien "could" be a mutant of their race and have Invulnerability. The entire species would have to have the power naturally.

Yes, they could be Experiments, Mutants, etc., in which case Negate Super Abilities would work; I was alluding specifically to those Aliens that have super abilities innately, e.g. Titons, Thisseras, Miceans, etc., and anyone who rolls 11-40% on the Alien Random Power Category table.

[say652]

Also magic power category, I house ruled even punches and kicks from a mage bypasses Invulnerablility.

[drewkitty ~..~]

it work on invulnerability?

Yes, assuming that the power of Invulnerability was not granted by magic or by alien physiology.

The alien "could" be a mutant of their race and have Invulnerability. The entire species would have to have the power naturally.

Yes, they could be Experiments, Mutants, etc., in which case Negate Super Abilities would work; I was alluding specifically to those Aliens that have super abilities innately, e.g. Titons, Thisseras, Miceans, etc., and anyone who rolls 11-40% on the Alien Random Power Category table.

However, N.S.A. does not work on the natural powers that an alien race may have.

Of which I specifically stated.

Yes, NSA would work in aliens who's powers are of the experimental or mutant varieties. If the Alien has both Mu./Exp. and natural super powers (even thought they can't under the char creation rules) then only the Mu./Exp. powers can be negated by NSA.

[Razorwing]

Also magic power category, I house ruled even punches and kicks from a mage bypasses Invulnerablility.

And why would a mage-type character need to throw a punch at an invulnerable character to begin with? Their spells can harm the guy... and usually deal much more damage. Okay... maybe if the Invulnerable character can survive long enough for the Mage to use up all their PPE... but a well played mage with a decent assortment of spells should be able to incapacitate such an opponent... or at least make good an escape long before he needs to resort to mere physical violence.

[Nightmask]

Also magic power category, I house ruled even punches and kicks from a mage bypasses Invulnerablility.

Why? Mages aren't magical creatures they're simply people educated in the casting of magic, and it hardly makes sense for a mage to be able to actually punch and harm someone who's got Invulnerability. It's not like being a mage makes you like Captain Marvel and no one would expect Dr. Strange or even Dr. Fate to be able to punch and harm an invulnerable character because that's just not something they can do, they have to use magic to get anywhere in those cases.

[drewkitty ~..~]

Also magic power category, I house ruled even punches and kicks from a mage bypasses Invulnerability.

Why? Mages aren't magical creatures ....

Say said that because in places in canon text so some settings that they are considered Creatures of Magic. And Say is just importing that rule into HU as a house rule.

However, Say's comment is a bit off topic.

[say652]

True back to negate super powers.

This one is provolone n Swiss, all day.

1 major.
Negate super powers.

1 super psionic.
Bio Manipulation.


Mutant Sea Inquisitor.

[Razorwing]

Also magic power category, I house ruled even punches and kicks from a mage bypasses Invulnerability.

Why? Mages aren't magical creatures ....

Say said that because in places in canon text so some settings that they are considered Creatures of Magic. And Say is just importing that rule into HU as a house rule.

However, Say's comment is a bit off topic.

Okay... I can agree that it may be a little off topic, but now my curiosity's been piqued... exactly where in canon text does it say that mages (those who have learned to cast magic) are considered to be creatures of magic? I know there are some OCCs in Rifts where some become CoM (Lord Magus OCC for example, if I remember correctly), but these are exceptions... not the rule.

[Tor]

Aside from HU2p95's "11-40 Possesses Super Abilities" (PSA) and its "not affected by the Negate Super Powers ability" text, does anyone know of any other explicit examples of things being mentioned as being immune to NSA?

I don't recall it saying that for the Bhlaze or other races in Skraypers though I figure you would treat them like that. Or basically in any case where all members of a species have the super power.

This should apply to the Altara Blind Warrior Women from Rifts Atlantis, for example.

I wonder if it applies to learned super abilities though, like an Ancient Master starting with Ext PE, a Physical Training starting with SHPS, a Genin starting with ExtSpd, or a Choirboy starting with Karmic Power?

Mages aren't magical creatures they're simply people educated in the casting of magic

This differs from the Rifts Conversion Book which happens to mention that Men of Magic are part of the Creatures of Magic category. This seems forgot by WB16 Federation of Magic where the Lord Magus specially becomes a Creature of Magic even though this should be the case with all the magi.

exactly where in canon text does it say that mages (those who have learned to cast magic) are considered to be creatures of magic?

Rifts Conversion Book page 43 right column, part of the 'Rifts Superhumans' section preceding 'Select Super-powers'. A bolded note mentions "creatures of magic (including men of magic) .. cannot have super abilities".

Of course this is the same section which mentions "Characters with super abilities can not have psionic powers too" and HU2 is rife with combinations of psionic and super powers, so we could take anything said here as being specific to Rifts and not HU.

Spoiler:

I'm not even sure how specific it is to Rifts, since WB12 would later introduce the Psi-Ghost who combined the major power of Intangibility with some psionic powers.

So perhaps 'men of magic' are creatures of magic only on Rifts Earth, but not on HU Earth.

Looking at the wording, considering that the actual category in Rifts is "Practitioners of Magic", you could opt to interpret that only adult males who are PoM become CoM, while female or non-adult male magic practitioners do not become creatures of magic.

That, or only the "Men of Magic" OCCs listed on page 15 of the Palladium RPG: Wizard/Witch/Warlock/Diabolist/Summoner/MindMage/Alchemist

[Razorwing]

Let's take a look at the term "Creature of Magic" as defined by RUE.

Amy mortal creature that is born with magical abilities; a Magic RCC if you will. Beings within whom magic is a part of their very essence.

Does this describe a human Practitioner of Magic? Well, humans are mortal... they are born, age and eventually die... but humans are not born with any magical abilities. Yes, humans can learn to use magic... but they are not born with any innate magical powers. While every human is born with some level of PPE, this does not make magic a part of their very essence.

So... when reading that line from the Conversion book that includes Practitioners of Magic when referencing Creatures of Magic... one should not see them as the same thing, but rather that anyone who has magical abilities (innate or learned) shouldn't also develop HU-type super powers.

[Tor]

I see it as establishing the Rifts Conversion Book being for the Rifts RPG and RUE being something else which defines Creature of Magic differently in a way which excludes Men of Magic.

[drewkitty ~..~]

Any mortal creature that is born with magical abilities;...

That is defining a Race, with no Char Class about it. SOoooo it would be just a R.
RCC's are something Races have/possess. (not going to argue the distracting minutia..because that is what they are.)

[say652]

This is a first edition vs second edition type thing.

Originally men of magic were magic creatures, then suddenly they weren't.

Particle beams do have a strong physical aspect in their damage.
That's why they deal half to those impervious to energy. Balrogs whip if fire damages things impervious to Fire. Same thing basically.

[Nightmask]

This is a first edition vs second edition type thing.

Originally men of magic were magic creatures, then suddenly they weren't.

Particle beams do have a strong physical aspect in their damage.
That's why they deal half to those impervious to energy. Balrogs whip if fire damages things impervious to Fire. Same thing basically.

I don't think they ever listed magic users as magic creatures, since they aren't.

[eliakon]

Or maybe it was a bad way of saying no Creatures of Magic and no Mages, with the parenthetical meant to set of a separate, related but not sub-class ban.
Or maybe its just a bad editing job (since the line in CB1 conflicts with RMB, RUE, WB 16, and multiple other locations....)
It wouldn't be the first time that there are two different rules saying opposite things in the books.

[Tor]

Particle beams do have a strong physical aspect in their damage. That's why they deal half to those impervious to energy.

When/where did that get added again?

I don't think they ever listed magic users as magic creatures, since they aren't.

Apparently you missed my quote from the Conversion Book, which I think was still present in the Revised version. Here it is again:

'Rifts Superhumans'
Note
"creatures of magic (including men of magic) .. cannot have super abilities".

Technically 'men' not 'users'. Sorry ladies, gotta become a Lord Magus if you want to be creatures of magic too.