Elves and rune weapons

[Whiskeyjack]

Something that I've thought of a few times and am curious on other peoples take on.
According to the history of Elves and Dwarves, when they met, the Elves were presented with a new magic that the Dwarves possessed. Rune magic, especially in the form of rune weapons.
I'm quite positive that many of the rune weapons presented in the books, including many in the hands of gods, come from the chaos war. I'm pretty sure I read that the old ones also created rune weapons.
So that only leaves a couple of options.
1)The Elves never noticed rune weapons during the war (or they were a closely guarded secret known only to a few).
2) The Elves forgot about them.
3) The Elves had their memories altered to forget them.

This also brings up the question of who taught the Dwarves. Or did they just develop it completely alone?

[kiralon]

As far as I can tell rune magic is lost so pc's can't make to order rune weapons, even though several gods know the secret, and apparently some wolfen dude rediscovered them before disappearing, but the dwarves were so embarrassed about the whole rune magic affair they gave up magic and actually, after thousands of years of fighting the elves and each side doing multiple atrocities to each other, got the elves to help them get rid of a lot of the rune magic at the end of the elf dwarf wars.

[Warshield73]

If I understand what you are talking about I don't think that elves received knowledge of the existence of Rune weapons from the dwarves they received knowledge of how to make rune items from them. My understanding is that the elves had rune items made by others when they encountered dwarves but couldn't make there own. The dwarves gave them the magic to make there own.

How did the dwarves learn it? I have never encountered an answer for that but I always assumed it was by finding remnants and texts from the time of the Old Ones.

[Whiskeyjack]

I'm talking about knowledge of their existence. The dwarves never gave Elves knowledge of creating Rune Weapons. It was one of the underlying reasons the war began. I can't remember which book describes the meeting of the races, but it recall it being clear that the elves were unfamiliar with rune magic.

[Prysus]

Something that I've thought of a few times and am curious on other peoples take on.
According to the history of Elves and Dwarves, when they met, the Elves were presented with a new magic that the Dwarves possessed. Rune magic, especially in the form of rune weapons.

Greetings and Salutations. I'm not aware of any official book passage stating this was new and something they'd never seen before. If you find it, let me know.

I'm quite positive that many of the rune weapons presented in the books, including many in the hands of gods, come from the chaos war. I'm pretty sure I read that the old ones also created rune weapons.

Old Ones knew rune magic (fairly sure that's clearly stated somewhere, and I know I can find rumors/myths with a quick look). Some gods (such as Thoth) also know rune magic. Thoth may know it as a result of his origins, could've learned it from the Dwarves, or from another world (such as Rifts).

So that only leaves a couple of options.
1)The Elves never noticed rune weapons during the war (or they were a closely guarded secret known only to a few).
2) The Elves forgot about them.
3) The Elves had their memories altered to forget them.

I'm still not sure of an official source that says this was new to them, but even if it was ...

The only ones who know would've had it before the Dwarves are the Old Ones (in a slumber) and their minions (largely sealed away in the Land of the Damned), neither very readily available. Can you tell in detail everything you did 8,000 years ago? Would you say you forgot?

That's the equivalent of how long it was for the Elven race (factoring Elves live 600 years and humans 60 year life span per PF2 main book). The Chaos War ended 100,000 years ago. The Age of Elves (in which time the Dwarves also rose to power and the tension over rune magic transpired) only 18,000 years ago. That's a bit more than 80,000 years in between.

This also brings up the question of who taught the Dwarves. Or did they just develop it completely alone?

Secrets will be secrets. Possible they reversed engineered some rune item they found. But I kind of like the idea (the following is not official) of Dwarves being more inventive and just kind of came up with it. Elves meanwhile have a knack for using magic really well, but only use what someone else already invented (they can create variants on magic or a new spell, but not a new school of magic). So it wasn't just that rune magic was powerful, but Dwarves did something they couldn't.

Anyways, just some thoughts. Farewell and safe journeys.

[Whiskeyjack]

It's one thing to not remember every detail from ages past, but to forget the most coveted type of weapon to exist? That sounds like the makings of a fine conspiracy theory.

Anyway, I found what I was looking for! Mysteries of Magic, pg 13. "The Dwarves, on the other hand, had mastered Rune Magic (something new and unknown to the Elves)."

[eliakon]

My feeling is that the elves and dwarves were basically 'bombed back to the stone age' by the war of chaos.
They lost most of their records, lore and civilization and had to rebuild basically from scratch.

Thus while they were able to keep some pieces of magical lore...they lost far, far more than they maintained. And thus they didn't even realize that they ever knew about rune magic, or bio-wizardry, or what have you.