How Do You Use: Kobolds

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How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Library Ogre »

So, I figured I'd start a series of questions about how you use what are, IME, the lesser-used parts of the PFRPG, and start with a favorite race: Kobolds.

Kobolds are interesting to me, because they're one of the few "monster" races that is fully capable of nigh the gamut of classes... their only limitations (knight, palladin, and long bowman) stem from their height and habitat, not innate disability. Combine that with very long lives and a tendency to live in places humans cannot or will not, and I like to view them as frequent allies to humans... when the humans are sufficiently morally flexible to work with kobold clans. A learned kobold wizard or other magician can work with a single human family for a long time, helping to keep the two clans together, while the humans would provide daylight hands and additional protection for the kobold clan. When they get with wolfen, this gets even more pronounced, since there's less racial baggage between the two.

Outside of those situations, I see them as being often the "everyman" of the monster races... not the idiots that Goblins, Hobgoblins, and Orcs tend to be, nor are they giants like Ogres and Trolls. Clever, resourceful, and creative, with their main flaw being somewhat weak wills.

How do you use kobolds?
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by kiralon »

Mark Hall wrote: How do you use kobolds?

Put a metal pointy hat on them and use them as giant sized ammo. Just like gnomes. ;)


I play them as clever, resourceful grey marketeers. You want something the dwarves wont make, go see a kobold.
Mercenary Groups (especially sappers).
You need an underground path to someplace to toss a ring into some lava, find a kobold.
Gypsy type travellers as well (underground).
I only rarely have combat confrontations starring kobolds.
Trade with all underground races including troglodytes.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Reagren Wright »

I love kobolds. They are the monster race that has so much poltential (especially since
they can be magic pratishioners). The bad part is that limited day vision. They walk
around town during the day like me in the morning without my glasses. There are also
tens of thousands (maybe more) in the Old Kingdom living below the ground. We are
told they established an Empire after the Elf/Dwarf War, but we don't know anything
more. Yet we're told they are still told there are thousands of these guys in Old
Kingdom Western Lowlands. Defintitely plan on doing some mentioning of these guys
real soon. I can't recall anyone playing a kobold in any of my groups because they hate
the limited day vision. But I've had load of kobold villains.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Ancient GM »

One of the most feared npcs duo's in my campaigns is a pair of bounty hunters. A kobold ex soldier/wizard and and an elf long bowman. Piagla and Red Arrow. They are ruthless. Professional pursuers of pc's that take contracts from anyone willing to pay. The wide range of skills makes them tough to escape. The kobold is key to making this work as the combination of class and natural ability Are well matched with the race's general reputation of mercenary mortality. The pc's tend to fear the kobold more than the elf.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Library Ogre »

So, has anyone else had players suggest kobolds (and goblins) figure out something like sunglasses? How do you have that affect their vision?
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by dreicunan »

Polarized lenses (or the magical equivalent) means no penalties during the day. It's been years, but I think the ruling as that they had to be goggle like to completely negate the penalties; sunglass style lenses negated half the penalty.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by kiralon »

Dark quartz crystal goggles.

I also increase the day vision range the more time the kobold spends in the sun (years), but drops the darkvision ranges back at the same time.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Reagren Wright »

dreicunan wrote:Polarized lenses (or the magical equivalent) means no penalties during the day. It's been years, but I think the ruling as that they had to be goggle like to completely negate the penalties; sunglass style lenses negated half the penalty.


That's kind of funny that the kingdom of Bizantium which is famous for developing glassware and lenses would be able to solve the Kobold's eyesight problem.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Whiskeyjack »

Personally, I have nocturnal races use a flipped version of the nightvision spell, dayvision.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by RockJock »

I've always gone with the idea of a 'dayvision" spell as well.

I've used Kobolds in several ways over the years. They make a great companion race to pretty much everyone. They work wonderfully to bridge the gaps between difference races, from the true monsters to the light siders. I've also used them as the basis of the black market, selling everything from weapons to magic items. In the latter they work well as the power behind wars. What happens when groups of Kobolds turn their back on a Troll/Ogre led horde and they lose support, or decide to support a budding kingdom of humans?
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by BookWyrm »

1st guy:"....what is it?"
Scout: *points to tracks up ahead* "Look at the spacing, how the pads flatten the earth, the conformity?"
1st Guy: "....(*expletive*)......kobolds."
3rd Guy, leans in: "So, what's the hold-up?"
1st Guy & Scout: "Kobolds."
3rd Guy, look of disbelief: "Kobolds?"
*1st Guy & Scout nod*
3rd Guy quietly facepalms* ".......Kobolds......"
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Whiskeyjack »

How does every play the relationship between Kobolds and Dwarves? Depending on which book you read, they are either long time allies, or the bitterest of enemies.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Osmeroid »

I quite like using them as temporary allies for player groups - their moral ambivalence and hard-headed pragmatism makes them pretty good for this sort of thing.

Better still, as a few folks have pointed out, they have access to almost all character classes. Nothing like having a kobold magic user of some sort acting as a kingmaker and behind the scenes power broker manipulating everyone and throwing out false leads to clever players :)
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Soldier of Od »

Like others have said, kobolds are an interesting race because they can be almost anything. However, for the most part I tend to play the vast majority of kobolds as isolationist and fiercely territorial. They stick to their own kind and their own underground cities, emerging only to raid surface dwellers or to trade with them, though I think that many of their raids, especially in the Old Kingdom Mountains, might be targeted at other underground communities such as troglodytes, goblins and gnomes, with surface people unware of the struggles going on beneath their feet. The upper tunnels of their cities are small and crudely made, leading visitors to assume the kobolds are primitive thugs like goblins, but deep beneath one would find sophisticated kobold cities, with a society as complex as the dwarves but perhaps with an architecture that looks much more stark and functional. Where kobolds do trade with others, in shallow tunnel systems or surface trading posts (perhaps inhabited mostly by their trading partners such as wolfen, ogres or orcs) we get an interesting opportunity for interaction and intrigue. Like others have said, kobolds present an opportunity for all sorts of black market dealings. And isolated subterranean communities are a perfect location for secret but powerful 'underground' cults dedicated to dark gods.

But away from their big cities, back in the surface world, I play individual kobolds living amongst other races a bit differently, as a sort of 'everyman' who might be accepted by all sorts of people. Most humans or elves only know kobolds as reavers or bandits and nothing more. A small god-fearing farming community in the Timiro Kingdom might not accept a kobold, assuming them all to be no more than monsters, but citizens of a large Western Empire city might not care at all, having never been the victim of kobold raids and surrounded by all sorts of other ne'er-do-wells. This is especially true if they have developed a reputation as masterful smiths or craftsmen, or are backed by their dwarven allies. With such a range of OCCs to choose from, a kobold in such a position can fill all sorts of roles in a role playing game, from roguish ally, devious broker/middleman or memorable henchman, right up to the big bad. I think they make especially good alchemists. In groups, they make an interesting twist on the standard bandit ambush, using their underground tunnelling skills to spring from nowhere or to lay traps. As a PC, I see them willing to throw in with almost anyone, so long as it benefits them in some way.

On the subject, I play the kobold-dwarven relationship as it is written in the main book. They are historically allies, having 'never gone to war' with each other. I imagine it is basically a case of mutual respect; neither race particularly 'likes' the other, but they are united by their similarities. Each looks down on the other as being too 'soft' or too 'nasty', but accepts them a bit like one might forgive a wayward relative despite their questionable decisions. As the two great subterranean civilisations, they feel they need to 'stick together', at least a little bit, against the surface people. Just so I know, in which books does is say they are the bitterest of enemies?

In my recently published Rifter article about the Holy City of Khemennu (Rifter #77 & #78), I have kobolds playing a significant role in the city, filling many of the roles traditionally taken by dwarves in human-dominated society. Regarding their light-sensitiveness, I have their homes and places of business connected by many underground passages; in areas of high kobold population the streets are literally built over to connect opposing buildings, turning streets into tunnels. And kobolds travelling on the surface in the daytime wear wide-brimmed hats and/or veils over their faces to shade their eyes from the glaring sun. I didn't think to work out an actual game mechanic for wearing a veil over the eyes, but now you mention it, maybe one could half the penalty, i.e. allow them to see twice the normal distance in daylight. Although the veil itself will limit clarity of vision. But really I imagined it more as a comfort thing; to prevent blindness rather than to circumvent the penalties.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by The Beast »

Mark Hall wrote:So, I figured I'd start a series of questions about how you use what are, IME, the lesser-used parts of the PFRPG, and start with a favorite race: Kobolds.

Kobolds are interesting to me, because they're one of the few "monster" races that is fully capable of nigh the gamut of classes... their only limitations (knight, palladin, and long bowman) stem from their height and habitat, not innate disability. Combine that with very long lives and a tendency to live in places humans cannot or will not, and I like to view them as frequent allies to humans... when the humans are sufficiently morally flexible to work with kobold clans. A learned kobold wizard or other magician can work with a single human family for a long time, helping to keep the two clans together, while the humans would provide daylight hands and additional protection for the kobold clan. When they get with wolfen, this gets even more pronounced, since there's less racial baggage between the two.

Outside of those situations, I see them as being often the "everyman" of the monster races... not the idiots that Goblins, Hobgoblins, and Orcs tend to be, nor are they giants like Ogres and Trolls. Clever, resourceful, and creative, with their main flaw being somewhat weak wills.

How do you use kobolds?


Honestly I think that these guys have the best methods of using kobolds.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Whiskeyjack »

Soldier of Od wrote:On the subject, I play the kobold-dwarven relationship as it is written in the main book. They are historically allies, having 'never gone to war' with each other. I imagine it is basically a case of mutual respect; neither race particularly 'likes' the other, but they are united by their similarities. Each looks down on the other as being too 'soft' or too 'nasty', but accepts them a bit like one might forgive a wayward relative despite their questionable decisions. As the two great subterranean civilisations, they feel they need to 'stick together', at least a little bit, against the surface people. Just so I know, in which books does is say they are the bitterest of enemies?.


I'm going to have to go through and find it again. It will be a couple of weeks before I get the chance to even start, but I will post when I find it.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Hell knight »

I my self have played a gob love gobs, but as a gm i have a kobold mage and a kobold smith and a trio of gob assassin/spy's my players regularly interact with . Espicly when there dealing with lady Arbites they work for her.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by FriarJohn00 »

I played a Kobold Wizard/Diabolist. We worked out a set of polarized/tinted spectacles for out of the field and goggles for being out in the field/adventuring.
He was only "morally ambiguous" in his language. He never committed to anything, but never actually acted evil, just a tad ruthless.
"Don't make me put my glasses on." was noted to be one of the most ominous things he ever said.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Alrik Vas »

Kobolds in a campaign? Night raids.

Stealing beer, livestock, crops. The occasional life. Though mostly the people unfortunate enough to notice them.

Oh, and screaming. lots and lots of screaming.

They aren't bad, I just give them a bit of a handicap that says they don't understand they'd be better off raising their own crop of mushrooms in a cave somewhere rather than stealing from people who want to kill them.

Yet in PF, I say any large kobold population would probably hang out with the wolfen empire. They'd make good scouts at night, and by that same note, decent sappers.

Though it's been so long since i've read the source material, I don't recall if that was my idea or something i read in the books. :-?
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Judman »

Alrik Vas wrote:
Yet in PF, I say any large kobold population would probably hang out with the wolfen empire. They'd make good scouts at night, and by that same note, decent sappers.

Though it's been so long since i've read the source material, I don't recall if that was my idea or something i read in the books. :-?


Not saying it wasn't your idea as well, but the Algor Mountain Collective (a Kobold society) is one of the two non-wolfen member states in the Empire. The other being the Human Kingdom of Havea, who helped the Empire on it's outward-looking trajectory by responding to the founding of the empire with a savvy application of "Can't beat 'em? Join 'em!".

As for the original discussion, personally I've wanted to do something a little silly and offbeat with a Kobold and play one as a squire, ideally as something akin to a Jaegermonster serving as something of a comedic foil to a do-gooder knight.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Dibzva »

Love kobolds as PCs for pretty much all the reasons already given. There should be more basic monster races who can be something more than just mercenary/assassin/whatever.

Really longing for a chance to play my first level Kobold Diabolist. He has issues (very koboldy issues) but he is more than able to work with parties of most alignments.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Dibzva »

Love Kobolds. Personally, I feel there should be more monster races that aren't just mercs/assassins/whatever.

Would also love the chance to play my 1st level Kobold Diabolist, but I often find I have to metamorphose him into a gnome to make him more palettable to GMs.

Shame.
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by Sir Dellis »

Kobolds are a very resourceful race and as previously mentioned can be pretty much any OCC.

In my campaigns in the past, unfortunately for them, are the butt of many jokes and getting punted like gnomes
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Re: How Do You Use: Kobolds

Unread post by DenverGentleman »

Does any one know how to find good character images of kobolds on the internet? If you search for kobolds you get hundreds of dumb lizard dudes from dand but almost nothing resembling the Palladium kobolds. I've found some hobgoblin pics that are passable and tommyknockers are good if you can filter out the steven king hits.
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