Catoblepa Leather Armor

[RockJock]

Has anyone every worked up stats for catoblepa armor? They have an AR significantly higher than regular cowhide leather.

I'm thinking mimic what is given for the Arctic Monitor, with as 12 AR and a slight boost in SDC for soft leather?

On a related thought, do you think Leather of Iron made from a higher AR leather would have a higher AR?

[Lukterran]

No, Leather of Iron gets it A.R. from Magic not from the qualities of the leather. So no I do not think "Leather of Iron" made from catoblepa or arctic monitor would have a higher AR.

[Library Ogre]

And, in fact, it might simply be a requirement of Leather of Iron to use some specialty leathers, not plain old cowhide. I think using Arctic Monitor leather as a source for Catoblepa leather is a good idea, though.

[RockJock]

Thanks Mark. I always have issues with decent armor for non-warriors, and I figured the Cato might be a good option.

Thanks for the feedback as well Luk.

[Library Ogre]

Really, most of the armor in PF is pretty horrible, due to the interaction between parry rolls and AR.

[RockJock]

Agreed, especially as you get to higher level characters. I still like it as a "style" item. I've experimented with making armor behave as Natural Armor, which makes it useful, but swings things the otherway.

[Lukterran]

That is why I always use house rules for Armor. Makes it more useful. However, you armor does tend to get trashed faster with these new rules.

"An unmodified roll that successfully hits above the characters A.R. inflicts full damage. A modified roll to hit above the characters A.R. inflicts one half damage to the armor and one half to the character. The exception to this rule is a successful called shot to a specific unarmored portion of opponents anatomy."

[Library Ogre]

If I were to play again, I would probably go with

"Subtract 4 from the AR; that amount is removed from the damage every attack. Any damage blocked by the armor is removed from the armor's SDC. At the attacker's option, a critical strike may either do double damage or ignore armor; if a higher critical strike is allowed, reduce the multiple by 1 to ignore armor (so someone with a *4 critical strike could do *4 damage OR *3 damage and ignore armor)."

It's a less complicated version of using CWAC's Resistance Factors, but far better, making armor a useful thing for everyone, such that not wearing it is a pretty big choice. Because, seriously, the AR rules as the stand suck.

[kiralon]

I split the armour penetration off from the strike roll, slows things down marginally but the only bonus to penetrate armour is your weapon proficiency plus to strike. So when someone hits and the other person fails to parry they then have to roll to penetrate armour with only their wp bonus. This makes Full Plate pretty scary to face off against. (I also have a possible +2 to AR enchantment as well as the +1 from well made)

[Library Ogre]

Another option that gets a little crazier... AR is a bonus to parry when parrying, and an automatic parry when not.

So, if I'm wearing AR 9 armor, I get a +9 to my parry. If I beat their roll by less than 9, my armor takes damage; if I beat it by more than 9, there is no damage, and if don't beat it, I take full damage. If I'm taken by surprise, and don't get to parry, then I am counted as having a 9. Thus, armor always remains relevant, but there's the possibility for a complete avoidance of damage.

[Glistam]

Another option that gets a little crazier... AR is a bonus to parry when parrying, and an automatic parry when not.

So, if I'm wearing AR 9 armor, I get a +9 to my parry. If I beat their roll by less than 9, my armor takes damage; if I beat it by more than 9, there is no damage, and if don't beat it, I take full damage. If I'm taken by surprise, and don't get to parry, then I am counted as having a 9. Thus, armor always remains relevant, but there's the possibility for a complete avoidance of damage.

That seems like a cool idea, but I think it would work better in a computer program. It would create too much rolling during the game.

Ideas on dealing with body armor A.R. (not Natural A.R.) that I've considered but have yet to test:

1. Make all attacks hit the armor, period. To not hit the armor and damage the person instead you make a called shot with the difficulty equal to the A.R. number.
2. Any roll to strike below the A.R. does full damage to the armor and none to the person. Any roll to strike above the A.R. does half damage to the armor and half damage to the person.

[Library Ogre]

Another option that gets a little crazier... AR is a bonus to parry when parrying, and an automatic parry when not.

So, if I'm wearing AR 9 armor, I get a +9 to my parry. If I beat their roll by less than 9, my armor takes damage; if I beat it by more than 9, there is no damage, and if don't beat it, I take full damage. If I'm taken by surprise, and don't get to parry, then I am counted as having a 9. Thus, armor always remains relevant, but there's the possibility for a complete avoidance of damage.

That seems like a cool idea, but I think it would work better in a computer program. It would create too much rolling during the game.

No more rolling than the normal. Roll to parry. If the strike is bigger than the parry, it's a hit. If the strike is between the parry+bonuses and parry+bonuses+armor, it's an armor hit. If the strike is below parry+bonuses, it's a clean miss.

[kiralon]

Still have the problem at high level where the bonuses are higher than the AR's

[Library Ogre]

Sure, but the armor always remains useful.

Let's take two people. Both have a +10 to strike and a +10 to parry. One is unarmored, the other is wearing armor with an AR of 9. Amy is wearing armor, Bob is bare. Everything else being equal, Amy will win, because while she and Bob are evenly matched, and so he has a 50/50 chance of beating her parry roll, she'll also be adding 9 to every roll, giving Bob a chance to hit her armor. If Amy were less capable... with a +10 to strike but only a +1 to parry, she'd be on par with Bob until her armor went away.

[kiralon]

Hmm certainly has potential.
What do you do with things that give natural AR like magic rings and amulets, or critters with natural AR.

[Library Ogre]

I've been fiddling with that. As it stands, the "You are invulnerable" answer doesn't really cut it, but that's the answer you get from the game...

[Prysus]

I've been fiddling with that. As it stands, the "You are invulnerable" answer doesn't really cut it, but that's the answer you get from the game...

Greetings and Salutations. Only invulnerable if you can't be the A.R. value though (the ability to parry or dodge can also make you "invulnerable" if the opponent can't get passed your parry or dodge).

With that said, if you still want characters to be able to take damage in the armor range of your system, have you considered something like: Half damage? Or maybe even a quarter. The AR would still give you a better chance at parry, and if it hits the (natural) armor it still does reduced damage. While true armor may be able to negate damage to the character, the benefit of natural armor is that it never fully depletes or needs repairs. *Shrugs.* Just a thought. Farewell and safe journeys.