The silent speak...

[Thinyser]

So our party of 6 Jeridu has made it over the mountains into The Land of the Damned. Along the way our GM pulled out the HLS at the end of LoTD1 "The Silent Speak" where a group of (150) Vorloc demand (under the penalty of destroying us if we didn't agree) to be lead into the "final Crusade" and finish what the gods of light started. Well with an offer like that how could we refuse?

So now the issue is we are surrounded by 150 Vorloc, and need an enemy that can keep them busy and give us a challenge too. Nothing that would wipe them out or even really kill more than a couple but that can tie them up long enough to allow the PCs to get some licks in too and maybe be the tipping point in the battle.

Any ideas?

[kiralon]

Tell them that to rush in is to invite destruction. All good military campaigns had good intelligence (lol). They need good intelligence, and to get that someone will have to sneak in and find the enemy, as rushing it won't accomplish anything, but a surgical strike at the weakest part could work. Now if you wait there (point somewhere) we will go gather intelligence and find the best place to stick in the knife.

[say652]

So I thing vs around a hundred and fifty something things. Hmmmm...sdc settings. ....cb1 supernatural Intelligence.

[Thinyser]

Tell them that to rush in is to invite destruction. All good military campaigns had good intelligence (lol). They need good intelligence, and to get that someone will have to sneak in and find the enemy, as rushing it won't accomplish anything, but a surgical strike at the weakest part could work. Now if you wait there (point somewhere) we will go gather intelligence and find the best place to stick in the knife.

So basically tell them to wait here while we go get ourselves into trouble?

It would work but talk about a non-intelligent thing to do

[kiralon]

Demanding what they are they sound like they might be difficult to deal with, giving them something to focus on that isn't you might be helpful, especially if you don't have something to aim them at.

[Thinyser]

So I thing vs around a hundred and fifty something things. Hmmmm...sdc settings. ....cb1 supernatural Intelligence.

You take the phrase "an enemy" too literally. It is meant as a general term for the enemy like an enemy force. And I dont think there are enough of us to take on even a small AI or SN intelligence.

[MADMANMIKE]

So I thing vs around a hundred and fifty something things. Hmmmm...sdc settings. ....cb1 supernatural Intelligence.

You take the phrase "an enemy" too literally. It is meant as a general term for the enemy like an enemy force. And I dont think there are enough of us to take on even a small AI or SN intelligence.

Also in Palladium Fantasy RPG the Supernatural Intelligence is statted out in Dragons & Gods, not a RIFTS book.

[Thinyser]

So I thing vs around a hundred and fifty something things. Hmmmm...sdc settings. ....cb1 supernatural Intelligence.

You take the phrase "an enemy" too literally. It is meant as a general term for the enemy like an enemy force. And I dont think there are enough of us to take on even a small AI or SN intelligence.

Also in Palladium Fantasy RPG the Supernatural Intelligence is statted out in Dragons & Gods, not a RIFTS book.

In conversion book 1 there is a random SN-I generation table. And it would be easy enough to convert to SDC

[MADMANMIKE]

In conversion book 1 there is a random SN-I generation table. And it would be easy enough to convert to SDC

Only if you have the first edition of that book (which again, was made for RIFTS, not Palladium Fantasy); the revised edition doesn't have that because the info was put into (and expanded quite a bit in) Dragons & Gods, which IS a Palladium Fantasy book.

If a person want's to use books from one game in another by all means do so, but the generation tables in the book written specifically for the RPG being discussed in this thread and forum has more detailed better tables that require no conversion. That's all I'm saying.

[Thinyser]

In conversion book 1 there is a random SN-I generation table. And it would be easy enough to convert to SDC

Only if you have the first edition of that book (which again, was made for RIFTS, not Palladium Fantasy); the revised edition doesn't have that because the info was put into (and expanded quite a bit in) Dragons & Gods, which IS a Palladium Fantasy book.

If a person want's to use books from one game in another by all means do so, but the generation tables in the book written specifically for the RPG being discussed in this thread and forum has more detailed better tables that require no conversion. That's all I'm saying.

True. I checked it out and its basically the same.

[say652]

In conversion book 1 there is a random SN-I generation table. And it would be easy enough to convert to SDC

Only if you have the first edition of that book (which again, was made for RIFTS, not Palladium Fantasy); the revised edition doesn't have that because the info was put into (and expanded quite a bit in) Dragons & Gods, which IS a Palladium Fantasy book.

If a person want's to use books from one game in another by all means do so, but the generation tables in the book written specifically for the RPG being discussed in this thread and forum has more detailed better tables that require no conversion. That's all I'm saying.

Funny my copy has the sn intelligence. And I believe a slugorth has SDC stats listed in atlantis.
I used the listed slugorth stats and removed the magic and psionic abilities to create an Armageddon Beast to test my players in a heroes unlimited game. I told them bring ALL your heroes cause your gonna need them.

[MADMANMIKE]

Funny my copy has the sn intelligence. And I believe a slugorth has SDC stats listed in atlantis.
I used the listed slugorth stats and removed the magic and psionic abilities to create an Armageddon Beast to test my players in a heroes unlimited game. I told them bring ALL your heroes cause your gonna need them.

What is the point of this statement? So you have a copy of first edition RIFTS Conversion Book 1, and you've used an entirely different RIFTS book in your Heroes Unlimited game.. What at all does that have to do with Palladium Fantasy? Please explain to me how this is the least bit relevant to a thread about valid enemies for a group of Palladium Fantasy characters in a Palladium Fantasy game being discussed on the Palladium Fantasy RPG® boards?

[Thinyser]

Actually no don't explain.

None of your posts are relevant either MMM. You were nitpicking something that was only relevant if you didn't have the book. I do.

Stay on topic please.

[Grug]

Hmm. How about the were(beings) within the darkest heart? It could be an epic fight to make it to the fallen palace.

[say652]

Funny my copy has the sn intelligence. And I believe a slugorth has SDC stats listed in atlantis.
I used the listed slugorth stats and removed the magic and psionic abilities to create an Armageddon Beast to test my players in a heroes unlimited game. I told them bring ALL your heroes cause your gonna need them.

What is the point of this statement? So you have a copy of first edition RIFTS Conversion Book 1, and you've used an entirely different RIFTS book in your Heroes Unlimited game.. What at all does that have to do with Palladium Fantasy? Please explain to me how this is the least bit relevant to a thread about valid enemies for a group of Palladium Fantasy characters in a Palladium Fantasy game being discussed on the Palladium Fantasy RPG® boards?

In a game that is marketed as a universal system ALL books are just sourcebooks for your campaign.
Its just easier to use sdc to sdc then try an convert mdc with no canon rules to do so.

[MADMANMIKE]

Actually no don't explain.

None of your posts are relevant either MMM. You were nitpicking something that was only relevant if you didn't have the book. I do.

Stay on topic please.

Not relevant? If you'd do a bit of research you would see that only a small fraction of the people who register on these message boards actually post; the vast majority lurk. Likewise, if you look at the posts made by the majority of Palladium Fantasy fans, you would see that in general they are not fans of RIFTS. To be relevant in the Palladium Fantasy RPG Forum, one should post with reference to a Palladium Fantasy RPG Supplement.

So my pointing out that the suggested answer to your original post can be found in an actual supplement to Palladium Fantasy could not be more relevant. Particularly since the info was expanded upon in the Palladium Fantasy book. Most of the people who read this thread are more likely to have or buy the Dragons & Gods book than they are to go searching the internet and used book stores for the long out of print RIFTS book that was suggested first.

Also in Palladium Fantasy RPG the Supernatural Intelligence is statted out in Dragons & Gods, not a RIFTS book.

-completely relevant post.

In a game that is marketed as a universal system ALL books are just sourcebooks for your campaign.
Its just easier to use sdc to sdc then try an convert mdc with no canon rules to do so.

None of Palladium's games are marketed as a universal system, certainly not Palladium Fantasy.

"Megaversal" Defined

There has been some confusion over the years as to the nature of Palladium Books Megaversal Rules system. Megaveral refers to the ease with which a character from one Palladium Books game setting can be modified and used in another Palladium Books game setting. The core character creation process is essentially the same throughout our games, so that if you've played Palladium Fantasy®, you can quickly learn and enjoy Heroes Unlimited®, or RIFTS® for example. That said, there are always setting-specific rules that are not meant to be carried over from one setting to the next.

If you find yourself in need of a mechanic that hasn't been covered in the rules of the setting you are playing, a Game Master may decide to use a rule from one of our other settings instead, but in general, if there isn't a rule for it, the game designer didn't feel it was necessary for the setting. A little common sense should be used in questionable situations.

Remember, the first rule in any game, is to have fun. This means everyone, the Game Master included. The second rule is The Game Master's decision is final."

[Thinyser]

Actually no don't explain.

None of your posts are relevant either MMM. You were nitpicking something that was only relevant if you didn't have the book. I do.

Stay on topic please.

Not relevant? If you'd do a bit of research you would see that only a small fraction of the people who register on these message boards actually post; the vast majority lurk. Likewise, if you look at the posts made by the majority of Palladium Fantasy fans, you would see that in general they are not fans of RIFTS. To be relevant in the Palladium Fantasy RPG Forum, one should post with reference to a Palladium Fantasy RPG Supplement.

So my pointing out that the suggested answer to your original post can be found in an actual supplement to Palladium Fantasy could not be more relevant. Particularly since the info was expanded upon in the Palladium Fantasy book. Most of the people who read this thread are more likely to have or buy the Dragons & Gods book than they are to go searching the internet and used book stores for the long out of print RIFTS book that was suggested first.

which is relevant to your agenda of correcting a perceived poor reference but NOT RELEVANT to anything I was asking.

Also in Palladium Fantasy RPG the Supernatural Intelligence is statted out in Dragons & Gods, not a RIFTS book.

-completely relevant post.

Its true, but not relevant to what I asked.

The question I asked was "any ideas?" which is obviously in reference to ideas to keep a group of Vorloc busy... NOT to nitpick what book should have been sited as reference to somebody else's suggestion.

You are off topic, and to a point I would consider borderline trolling since you decided to ignore my polite request to get back on topic and instead continued to nitpick a source sited instead, and furthermore you argue that your post is relevant when it addresses absolutely nothing in my request for ideas for keeping Vorlocs busy.

Suggest an idea please, or at least stop posting off topic. Please.

[say652]

My first experience with the system. Was the fantasy setting. My super fit in well. My cousin Robby(our DM) used all the books as one. Fighting naruni camo armor wearing thugs with bow and dagger was great. Jussayin.

[MADMANMIKE]

Actually no don't explain.

None of your posts are relevant either MMM. You were nitpicking something that was only relevant if you didn't have the book. I do.

Stay on topic please.

Not relevant? If you'd do a bit of research you would see that only a small fraction of the people who register on these message boards actually post; the vast majority lurk. Likewise, if you look at the posts made by the majority of Palladium Fantasy fans, you would see that in general they are not fans of RIFTS. To be relevant in the Palladium Fantasy RPG Forum, one should post with reference to a Palladium Fantasy RPG Supplement.

So my pointing out that the suggested answer to your original post can be found in an actual supplement to Palladium Fantasy could not be more relevant. Particularly since the info was expanded upon in the Palladium Fantasy book. Most of the people who read this thread are more likely to have or buy the Dragons & Gods book than they are to go searching the internet and used book stores for the long out of print RIFTS book that was suggested first.

which is relevant to your agenda of correcting a perceived poor reference but NOT RELEVANT to anything I was asking.

Also in Palladium Fantasy RPG the Supernatural Intelligence is statted out in Dragons & Gods, not a RIFTS book.

-completely relevant post.

Its true, but not relevant to what I asked.

The question I asked was "any ideas?" which is obviously in reference to ideas to keep a group of Vorloc busy... NOT to nitpick what book should have been sited as reference to somebody else's suggestion.

You are off topic, and to a point I would consider borderline trolling since you decided to ignore my polite request to get back on topic and instead continued to nitpick a source sited instead, and furthermore you argue that your post is relevant when it addresses absolutely nothing in my request for ideas for keeping Vorlocs busy.

Suggest an idea please, or at least stop posting off topic. Please.

Oookay, I'll reiterate the suggestion. Yes, an alien intelligence would do the job, and fit the Vorloc's request perfectly. You can create one with the excellent rules for creating Palladium Fantasy RPG Alien Intelligences as found in the Palladium Fantasy RPG® supplement Dragons & Gods™, co-written by game designer Kevin Siembieda and the late great Erick Wujcik, who also wrote the first official adventure for Palladium Fantasy, "The Tombs of Gersidi".

Likewise as the Vorloc's quest for a crusade is the sort of zealotry you might find in a religious order, Dragons & Gods is an excellent resource for all things religious in Palladium Fantasy, including some excellent God minion races that would fit the bill nicely. Or if you want to play down the religious aspect you can find some great detailed stats on all the different Elementals, 14 different dragon races and over 20 demonic lords.

There you go, five suggestions that also clarify the validity of my original response. Have a nice day.

[say652]

Boom! Bump, Set, Spike! Son. *attempts solo flying chest bump, flies over kitchen island lands awkwardly upside down in front of fridge, hit with chips and Dory the plant. Smile never leaves face for being right* ow my kidney limps off.

[Thinyser]

Hmm. How about the were(beings) within the darkest heart? It could be an epic fight to make it to the fallen palace.

I was thinking of that too. Great minds and all that

Now the question is (and this might be better for a new topic but we can do it here too) is how do you handle mass combat? 150 Vorloc versus 150 (or so were critters) is gonna be way to many to roll for each creatures attack defence damage etc.
Im sure there is a thread that already discusses this but I dont have time to search for it now. gotta eat and go to work! if anybody can post a link that would be sweet otherwise I'll look later.

[Grug]

For all the times I have game mastered large battles, I have never found a way I loved completely. It's always come down to a mix of random rolls and a lot of story telling. Here is the way I did it last time and it fairly well. It's a lot of prep work but made it run smoother.

So I started by making a list of negative and bounses. Which will be applied to a D20 roll later. Such as,
-3: Starving/dehydrated, no weapons/armor, out numbered 10 to 1, etc...
-2: Conscripted peasants, out numbered 5 to 1, etc...
-1: Poor weapons/armor, crappy weather, unsuccessful intelligence or surveillance roll.etc...
0
+1: Experienced soldiers (level 2-4), good morale, successful intelligence or surveillance roll, etc...
+2: Hardened soldiers (level 5-7), great morale, has a pc or a high level npc in the unit, etc...
+3: Veteran soldiers (level 8+), exceptional leadership, has terrain advantage (high ground, within a fortified structure), etc...

Then I split the army into manageable units, and figure in the bonuses or negatives for the unit.
Let's say the army was sixty strong, you would then split it into three units of 20.

Unit A: Are veterans, behind a wall, but are out numbered 5 to 1. So +6 from being veterans, and having terrain advantage. But -2 from being out numbered. For a total of +4.

Enemy B: Are experienced soldiers for a +1 and that's it.

When the two units battle each other, they both roll a D20 high roll wins. Figuring in bounses and negatives of course. Then you roll to see how many casualties the units suffered. I roll max unit numbers for the losing side and about a quarter for the winning side, so if enemy b was 100 strong I would roll 10d10 for a loss and a d20 if they won.

I also let the player's control the overall placement on troops, and if a unit needs reinforcements they decide how many and where from. Then perhaps a major enemy/situation will arise that the player's will need to take care of. Either through the troops they command if any, or themselves.

This is just loosely based on how I do it, without my notes and prepping for it. Plus lack of time right now. My full way is much more detailed lol.

[Thinyser]

Sweet thanks! I like it.